Automatic Tithing

No I wouldn't let the Church ake any money out of my paycheck. I don't believe in Tithing. It is under the LAW and we are under GRACE, my Wife and I give from our hearts. It is different amt. every Sunday. The Lord loves a cheerful giver :tongue3:

 

I don't think chuck meant that the church took debited the bank account without consent. I don't think the bank could do it without authorization.

Now, if it was a requirement of membership, that's another thing.

 

Apparently you haven't read the whole thread, most specifically where it states he "ok'd' this AND that it is only a requirement for the staff NOT the church.

Secondly, No one went anywhere and 'took' anything. Please show scripture were his giving cheerfully a tithe out of his paycheck is disobeying the Lord.
You did all this because of your assumption and not reading the full thing. I admit that the OP wasn't giving all the best information but it was only a couple of posts later that he clarified what was going on. However it does seem that we are quick rebuke just because the word tithe was mentioned. For a second look at how far you took your accusation. First you rebuke (Ok, I understand your point) but then you take it a step further and accuse them of potentially having other areas of disobedience. And then you finally bring the accusation of them not trusting God. Are you mad this morning or what? Please be careful when assuming. I usually an the one wrong when I do this.


BTW- It is not against the word to tithe but is actaully biblical - it just isn't if you aren't cheerfully giving it unto God who gave it to you in the first place to steward over His stuff.

 

Did you stop to consider that maybe he came 'on staff' knowing this is what was expected of those who are or will be on staff? The fact it is a 'requirement' does not give neither you nor I the right to assume the intension of making it so. Maybe all those in leadership wanted to ensure (by an easy visable trail - so to speak) that they ALL in leadership are leading by example and this was an easy way they all agreed might work. Did you think that just maybe everyone who comes on staff is apprised of this and that they might actually agree to it happily?

It is in this we must be careful. Just becuase it is a requirement does not mean he had no choice nor does it mean he was caught sideways with this and had no recourse but to obey.

I understand you spoke strongly about it, but my issue wasn't the strength of your comment but the fact your strong comment was based primarily upon an assumption and that because of your assumption you brought baseless accusation against them of being disobedient and not trusting God. You maligned them without any 'real' cause.

 

My church does this. It is NOT a requirement of staff members, we are asked voluntarily- even the amount is voluntary, it does NOT have to be 10%. It is pre-tax giving, and something I would do anyhow, so why not save myself the hassle of writing a check every two weeks (although we do write one for special offerings) and get a little tax benefit to boot?

I would do it even if there were no tax benefit, BTW.

 

Chuck's church is one which believed that tithing is scriptural, and believed that its pastor and staff should be tithers. It was not up for debate, and being a tither was a condition of employment.

chuck did not say he was not a tither. He said he did not have a paper trail to follow.

Debate the automatic withdrawal all you want. I don't think I'd like that practice, and I've never heard of it before. But that's just me.

 

To each church their own.

The point regarding the 'paper trial' was just an assumption just as 'annsni' assumption about the 'requirment'. We can speculate with assumptions all day but we should be careful not to malign or bring accusation against another when we don't know all the facts concerning the issue. THAT is my point.

ANNSNI - If you are correct in your assumption then I actaully would agree but again my point was not to bring accusation based off of an assumption.

 

Would it be okay if, when presented with this condition of employment, you agreed to the automatic deduction? Seems to me that consent is there.

 

Again with the assumptions. Something is not 'forced' if they willingly and thus cheerfully agree. Keep the assumptions out of your argument. So again, NOTHING was 'taken' from anyone but freely and willingly given.

Wrong, It is still a choice.

Umm, that was my point. Again, even in my comments you are assuming something I was not saying.
There is nothing in scripture that says a church can not require this.
Scripture only states that if one is to give he must be a cheerful giver. It does not tell us from where it must come or how it must be given or the manner in which it is received. It only states that one who is giving is do so (in whatever means they do give) cheerfully. So the 'requirement' is not unbiblical regarding the holding of a position in a church, but 'would' be so if it was forcefully taken even when the person does not desire to give.

Your still assuming and continuing to malign brothers and sisters in Christ with NO real proof but your 'assumption'.

Is it really that hard to say you were wrong and that what you said is purely speculation at best. But that it 'could' be true IF what you assumed were actaully true.

 

The assumption is not that it is a requirement but what you 'assume' is the intent behind making it a requirement and the assumption of disobedience and not trusting God (both are based upon your assumptions and not facts here). You will note I have repeatedly addressed this.

I am hung up on your accusations against fellow believers based upon imagination of what 'might be' and not what is.

 

No one on that staff is 'forced' to give either. They agree to give not out of obligation to be on staff but toward God. This is your error over and over and over again.

No church is worth their salt if the have people is positions of leadership who do not give consistantly and continuously to God (This is the principle of the tithe or giving). Thus it is still a 'requirement' in most all the churches I know of to tithe if you want to be in a leadership position. The 'requirement' being addressed is not a 'forced' issue (because they desire to do so) but a 'maturity' issue. They just have it in writing down on the application where many churches have it in the their by-laws.


Anyway - I'm done here and have said my peace. Have a blessed and grace filled day.