Bapticostal

Pearl -

Perhaps you can find the answer in one of these threads that you started before on the exact same topic:

http://www.baptistboard.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=25&t=000153&p=

http://www.baptistboard.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=3&t=000714&p=

http://www.baptistboard.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=39&t=000068&p=

http://www.baptistboard.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=10&t=001344&p=

http://www.baptistboard.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=3&t=000829&p=

http://www.baptistboard.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=10&t=001410&p=

http://www.baptistboard.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=24&t=000797&p=

If you are still in doubt, I can go back further in you posting history and come up with that many more. What question exactly has not been answered for you in the last 7 months?

 

In general, Baptists and Pentecostals are quite similar. Both are Christian denominations (I know some will take issue with the term "denomination" for Baptist, but whatever) with the same core doctrines, so of course you are going to see a lot of overlap, both in terms of doctrine as well as in type of average member. Of course, both have their "distinctives" and what makes them different is mostly the view of tongues. Both groups have their fringe extremists (don't base your view on a denomination as a whole on the extremists), but other than that they are generally the same.

Brian

 

I think it depends on "what kind" of baptist you are. There are very few similarities between the pentecostal faith and missionary baptist... which is what I am. Around here, we're different in everything from dress to speaking in tongues and the laying on of hands to heal. I attended a nondenom/pentecostal church service and it was so very different that I was even uncomfortable being in the building.

 

It also depends on "what kind" of Pentecostal you are comparing to.

 

"Little children, let no man deceive you..." 1 John 3:7.

I don't know how else to say this without being considered critical and unloving, but I do consider myself loving you when I warn you not to be deceived by satan't deceptions. "If ya play wid dem snakes, sooner or later, you'll git bit!"

 

Pearl go to this site and I hope it answers your qestions?... Brother Glen

http://www.oru.edu/university/library/holyspirit/pentorg1.html#origins

 

Mark 16:[15] And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.
[16] He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.
[17] And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues;
[18] They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover.
[19] So then after the Lord had spoken unto them, he was received up into heaven, and sat on the right hand of God.

 

Like I said elsewhere: There's a whole mess of snakes over with the 'gators across the bayou from me, but I ain't never seen none of these 'apostolics' ever pick one up & handle it. [Wonder why?]

 

I've never seen any Baptists pick one up and handle it either. That passage is the same, whether you are Baptist or Pentecostal.

 

I've never seen any Baptists pick one up and handle it either.[BrianT]

And you WON'T see a true Baptist do it, because those who know what the KJBible really teaches, understand that certain things were given by God to the early Church ONLY, and have ceased upon completion of the written Word of God.

 

Amen Granny!

 

Where does the KJBible teach these things were only for the early church? How do you objectively know which things have ceased and which ones haven't? In other words, where did you get this understanding - from scripture or Baptist "tradition"? I'm a Baptist, and personally I can't find that explanation in scripture - my opinion is that it is simply a Baptist rationalization of why we dismiss things that make us uncomfortable. I admit it - I don't pick up snakes simply because my faith is weak, not because I can find a verse that says God took that promise away.

Brian

[ June 29, 2002, 09:07 PM: Message edited by: BrianT ]

 

Hebrews 2:3 How shall we escape, if we neglect so great salvation; which at the first began to be spoken by the Lord, and was confirmed unto us by them that heard him;

was confirmed (to the Hebrews) Since this fact is codified forever in the Word of God then the salvation message no longer needs to be confirmed by signs and wonders.

HankD

[ June 29, 2002, 09:51 PM: Message edited by: HankD ]

 

HankD, I'm not sure I understand your point. Why does a confirmation of something mean that the means by which it was confirmed ceases?

In the Matt passage, one of the other signs listed is the casting out of devils. Do you believe exorcisms can no longer be performed?

 

What is it that you're worried about?

 

"was confirmed" there is no need for further confirmation. In addition, since that confirmation has been codified into the Word of God, the "signs and wonders" (which were explicitly given to first hand eye and ear witnesses "them that heard him" are no longer necessary apart from their ever-living witness encapsulated in the Word of God.

The second part of your question is concerned with exorcisms:
Exorcisms are possible as an answer to prayer of the modern believer and not an exact fulfillment of "the Matt passage" you mentioned. "the Matt passage" fulfilment is history,
This promise was given to the first-hand eye and ear witnesses of Jesus Christ in the days of His flesh and not to us in particular.

My opinion of course...

HankD

 

Hi HankD,

Your response, of course, is the "standard" response given by most Baptists. I guess it sort of makes sense - but again my point is that this is a rationalization, not something taught in scripture.

Exorcism was listed as a sign of confirmation in Matt 16. Yet when we rationalize signs of confirmation were no longer needed, exorcisms didn't cease - they were just used for a different purpose. Unless scripture explicitly says other things that were initially "signs" have ceased, why make that assumption? I get very nervous when people tell me that parts of the NT teachings or promises are not for us today...

Of course, this is just my opinion in response to your opinion.

Brian

 

Dear Brian,

RE: My "standard answer"

Standard or not it is my answer.
Please note that I didn't say God does not allow exorcisms just that the reason is that He does it as an answer to prayer.

This is also in keeping with the Scriptural principle that the present age believer is to live by faith and not by sight which involves signs and wonders.

HankD

[ June 30, 2002, 07:03 PM: Message edited by: HankD ]

 

I agree. I didn't mean to imply you thought exocisms ceased, I was just trying to point out that because they didn't cease (they still exist, for a reason other than a "sign"), other activities might also follow this pattern.

The passages that talk about walking by faith and not by sight were also for the early church.

Brian