Baptism and the Lords Supper - Outside of the church

[Salty]

In another thread - it was stated: " that baptism and the Lord's Supper are both Christian ordinances and church ordinances, exercised under the authority of the local church by those whom each church appoints to administer them."

So the questions are:
Would you partake of communion - say at a pastors meeting, a women's group, should communion be served at a nursing home.
So about a group of men from various denominations - should they have a communion service?

Should a Bible camp (adult or youth) preform baptisms?

 

[Silverhair]

Communion is remembrance of what Christ did for us so we do not need someone in authority. Where two or three are gathered in my name there I am also.

At a nursing home or at your home as it is between you and God.

The same with baptism, it is an outward expression of an inward reality. God looks at the heart of the person being baptized.

 

[atpollard]

Would you partake of communion - say at a pastors meeting,

No. They are free to follow their conscience and it is not my place to judge the servant of another, but I must answer to my master, so I would respectfully refrain from participation. [Communion is about unity in Christ ... all who partake being united in One Christ and being One Body ... Him in us and us knitted together (that is a church thing, not a group thing).

a women's group,

No, but mostly because I am not a woman, so I would not belong at a woman's group in the first place.

should communion be served at a nursing home.

Yes. They are part of the body and cannot assemble with the body at a church, so the Nursing Home is their "church".

So about a group of men from various denominations - should they have a communion service?

They are free to follow their conscience and it is not my place to judge the servant of another, but I must answer to my master, so I would respectfully refrain from participation.

Should a Bible camp (adult or youth) preform baptisms?

They are free to follow their conscience and it is not my place to judge the servant of another, but I must answer to my master, so I would respectfully refrain from participation.

 

[Deacon]

At the time I first believed, my family occasionally attended a Presbyterian Church, infant baptism was the norm. I don't think I ever witnessed an adult being baptism.

But few months after becoming a believer, I attended a Christian event held in Arie Crown Theater in Chicago.
A swimming pool was set up backstage for baptizing believers. It was my first opportunity to be properly baptized.
I knew no one who witnessed my baptism and my memory is the only reminder that it ever happened.

While others may set up a variety of rules and restrictions, I think the Scriptures make baptism rather simple.

Acts 8:36–38 (NIV 2011) As they traveled along the road, they came to some water and the eunuch said, “Look, here is water. What can stand in the way of my being baptized?” And he gave orders to stop the chariot. Then both Philip and the eunuch went down into the water and Philip baptized him.

The occasions for Lord's Supper, likewise, are quite simple. "Where two or three are gathered in my name, there am I with them. (Matthew 18:20)

When are we not to hold in remembrance what the Lord did for us?
The Lord's Supper can be properly observed as long as it is honoring and orderly.

Rob

 

[Reformed]

In another thread - it was stated: " that baptism and the Lord's Supper are both Christian ordinances and church ordinances, exercised under the authority of the local church by those whom each church appoints to administer them."

So the questions are:
Would you partake of communion - say at a pastors meeting, a women's group, should communion be served at a nursing home.
So about a group of men from various denominations - should they have a communion service?

Should a Bible camp (adult or youth) preform baptisms?

Particular Baptists considered the two ordinances of the church to be acts of worship. As such they were administered by qualified ministers under the auspices of the local church. Regardless of how well meaning or honorable the reason, whenever we stray from the function of the local church we open the door for anything and everything. In the end it comes down to our view of local church authority.

 

[Silverhair]

Particular Baptists considered the two ordinances of the church to be acts of worship. As such they were administered by qualified ministers under the auspices of the local church. Regardless of how well meaning or honorable the reason, whenever we stray from the function of the local church we open the door for anything and everything. In the end it comes down to our view of local church authority.

Actually it comes down to the authority of God.

Man made rules are fine for those that form that particular organization/church.

If you think you need a qualified minister to offer worship to God then you have a serious misunderstanding of worship of God.

 

[JonC]

This hinges on how one views the church. The command to observe the Supper was given to the Apostles and observed within congregations. Paul gives the congregation in Cornith instruction concerning the Supper.

Was it given to the church as a congregation?
Was it given to the Overseer of the congregation?

Maybe this depends on how one defines the church. I don't know.

I believe this ordnance was given to believers, to do in remembrance of Him.

For a large part men have created the clergy. We see this strongly in Catholic and Reformed churches structures.

But in the Bible there are "overseers" appointed to a confregation (or congregations) from within the community and deacons appointed to maintain the equitable distribution of daily provisions between traditional and Hellenistic Jews.


To support my opinion I offer another opinion , I believe the congregations observed the Supper before overseers and elders were appointed.

 

[atpollard]

Paul gives the congregation in Cornith instruction concerning the Supper.

1 Corinthians 10:15-18 [NIV]
15 I speak to sensible people; judge for yourselves what I say. 16 Is not the cup of thanksgiving for which we give thanks a participation in the blood of Christ? And is not the bread that we break a participation in the body of Christ? 17 Because there is one loaf, we, who are many, are one body, for we all share the one loaf. 18 Consider the people of Israel: Do not those who eat the sacrifices participate in the altar?

v.16: The cup and bread are "participation in the blood/body of Christ" [uniting all in the One].
v.17: "We who are many become one body" [true if communion is shared in the context of the gathered congregation, the symbolism is shattered if the congregation partakes as individuals in the comfort of their isolation ... unless we are prepared to embrace transubstansiation/transubstitution and return to a real mystical presence rather than a symbolic presence ... making us Angican or Lutheran rather than Baptists].
"for we all share the one loaf" [true if communion is shared in the context of the gathered congregation, the symbolism is shattered if the congregation partakes as individuals in the comfort of their isolation].
v.18: "participate in the altar" [even in the OT, the many gathered to the ONE ALTAR to unite them as one community to One God].

Was it given to the church as a congregation?
Was it given to the Overseer of the congregation?

It was given to the "congregation", but it was given to them corporately to unite the body, not individually to misuse the "two or three" scripture as support for "John Wayne Christianity" [Me and God, standing alone against the world.] ... communion is a "one another" bonding moment for the local church [all to Him and one to another].

 

[JonC]

1 Corinthians 10:15-18 [NIV]
15 I speak to sensible people; judge for yourselves what I say. 16 Is not the cup of thanksgiving for which we give thanks a participation in the blood of Christ? And is not the bread that we break a participation in the body of Christ? 17 Because there is one loaf, we, who are many, are one body, for we all share the one loaf. 18 Consider the people of Israel: Do not those who eat the sacrifices participate in the altar?

v.16: The cup and bread are "participation in the blood/body of Christ" [uniting all in the One].
v.17: "We who are many become one body" [true if communion is shared in the context of the gathered congregation, the symbolism is shattered if the congregation partakes as individuals in the comfort of their isolation ... unless we are prepared to embrace transubstansiation/transubstitution and return to a real mystical presence rather than a symbolic presence ... making us Angican or Lutheran rather than Baptists].
"for we all share the one loaf" [true if communion is shared in the context of the gathered congregation, the symbolism is shattered if the congregation partakes as individuals in the comfort of their isolation].
v.18: "participate in the altar" [even in the OT, the many gathered to the ONE ALTAR to unite them as one community to One God].


It was given to the "congregation", but it was given to them corporately to unite the body, not individually to misuse the "two or three" scripture as support for "John Wayne Christianity" [Me and God, standing alone against the world.] ... communion is a "one another" bonding moment for the local church [all to Him and one to another].

I disagree. It is participation in one body (the Body of Christ).

I am not saying that two or more people are a congregation observing the Supper. I am saying that it is observed by individuals in a congregation. It is not a ritual given to the clergy but an observance given to the congregation.

It was a modest meal over which the congregation gathered together and did so in remembrance of Jesus.

Today it is a ritual where people eat a piece of cracker and drink a small cup of grape juice or wine.

 

[Silverhair]

It is not the number of believers that gather but the heart of the believers that gather.

Mat 18:20 "For where two or three have gathered together in My name, I am there in their midst."

A christian may be lonely but they are never alone.

 

[Silverhair]

I disagree. It is participation in one body (the Body of Christ).

I am not saying that two or more people are a congregation observing the Supper. I am saying that it is observed by individuals in a congregation. It is not a ritual given to the clergy but an observance given to the congregation.

It was a modest meal over which the congregation gathered together and did so in remembrance of Jesus.

Today it is a ritual where people eat a piece of cracker and drink a small cup of grape juice or wine.

Sad but true, for many it is just something they do one Sunday each month.

 

[atpollard]

I disagree. It is participation in one body (the Body of Christ).

I am not saying that two or more people are a congregation observing the Supper. I am saying that it is observed by individuals in a congregation. It is not a ritual given to the clergy but an observance given to the congregation.

It was a modest meal over which the congregation gathered together and did so in remembrance of Jesus.

Today it is a ritual where people eat a piece of cracker and drink a small cup of grape juice or wine.

So the "communion" would loose nothing if the church just offered prepackaged wafers and cups that "whosoever" could take home at the end of service and partake in the comfort of their home at their personal convenience?

I disagree.
I believe the symbolism of "one body" all eating together the Bread that represents His Body (the very thing that makes us "one body") would be lost. I have repeatedly stated that the CLERGY is irrelevant, but the COMMUNITY is essential. When a "men's group" or a "gathering of pastors" take communion, they are NOT a local COMMUNITY, they are not a "local church" (as Baptists understand the concept of a local, independent church).

 

[JesusFan]

No. They are free to follow their conscience and it is not my place to judge the servant of another, but I must answer to my master, so I would respectfully refrain from participation. [Communion is about unity in Christ ... all who partake being united in One Christ and being One Body ... Him in us and us knitted together (that is a church thing, not a group thing).


No, but mostly because I am not a woman, so I would not belong at a woman's group in the first place.


Yes. They are part of the body and cannot assemble with the body at a church, so the Nursing Home is their "church".


They are free to follow their conscience and it is not my place to judge the servant of another, but I must answer to my master, so I would respectfully refrain from participation.


They are free to follow their conscience and it is not my place to judge the servant of another, but I must answer to my master, so I would respectfully refrain from participation.

Would Paul have shared Communion when Luke visited him in prison, as
when" 2 or more gather in my name?"