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Baptist Groups who don't accept OSAS

C

CarpentersApprentice

New Member
The Once Saved Always Saved thread got me to thinking about groups instead of individuals. As evidenced in that thread most Baptists seem to believe in OSAS, although, of course, that is not universally accepted.

I note that the National Association of Free Will Baptists "believe that there are strong grounds to hope that the saved will persevere unto the end and be saved because of the power of divine grace pledged for their support. We believe that any saved person who has sinned (whether we call him a backslider or sinner), but has a desire to repent, may do so and be restored to God's favor and fellowship. Since man, however, continues to have free choice, it is possible because of temptations and the weakness of human flesh for him to fall into the practice of sin and to make shipwreck of his faith and be lost."

Are there other Baptist groups (not individual churches) that do not believe in OSAS?

Thanks.

CA
 
C

CarpentersApprentice

New Member
Hi Bob,

Please help me out a little with this. On the Seventh Day Baptist site I looked under Statement of Belief and Salvation, but I don't see anything that would lead me to believe that they do not believe in OSAS.

I know that there can be nuances of meaning in the words and phrases, but it must be too nuanced for me. :)

CA
 
Salty

Salty

20,000 Posts Club
Administrator
If I recall, it seems a SDB told me OSAA is an opitional belief
Salty

but keep in mind my poor memory
 
R

rlvaughn

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
CarpentersApprentice said:
Are there other Baptist groups (not individual churches) that do not believe in OSAS?
Click to expand...

CA, I list some of these on my blog under Free Will/General Baptists
http://baptistsearch.blogspot.com/2006/11/baptist-groups-in-united-states.html

In addition to the National Association of Free Will Baptists, there are other Free Will Baptist groups that don't affiliate with them. Other groups that generally reject OSAS are the General Association of General Baptists and the General Association of Separate Baptists in Christ. Some United Baptists also do not believe in OSAS, while others do. Most of those who associated with the National Association of United Baptists either did not hold OSAS or held it but would associate with churches that didn't.

There may be some SDB's who don't believe OSAS, but as a body I have always understood that they profess to hold the idea.
 
C

CarpentersApprentice

New Member
rlvaughn,

Wow! You really put a lot of work into that list. Thanks for the references.

According to the General Baptist Statements of Faith "We believe that those who abide in Christ have the assurance of salvation. However, we believe that the Christian retrains his freedom of choice; therefore, it is possible for him to turn away from God and be finally lost."

The General Association of Separate Baptists in Christ had a web site, but a statement of faith was not on it.

CA
 
BobRyan

BobRyan

Well-Known Member
CarpentersApprentice said:
rlvaughn,

Wow! You really put a lot of work into that list. Thanks for the references.

According to the General Baptist Statements of Faith "We believe that those who abide in Christ have the assurance of salvation. However, we believe that the Christian retrains his freedom of choice; therefore, it is possible for him to turn away from God and be finally lost."

The General Association of Separate Baptists in Christ had a web site, but a statement of faith was not on it.

CA
Click to expand...

This is the view of all who reject OSAS as far as I know.

1. Assurance of salvation? YES!
2. OSAS? NO!

in Christ,

Bob
 
C

CarpentersApprentice

New Member
rlvaughn said:
CA, I did some searching on Separate Baptists to see what I could find. It appears the General Association, Central Indiana Association, and Nolynn Association word their statements this way:

Art. 5 We believe that he who endures to the end, the same shall be saved.

http://www.separatebaptist.org/index.php?page=ourbeliefs
http://www.separatebaptist.org/downloads/nolynn/NolynnAssociation2006Minutes.pdf
Click to expand...

Thanks for digging that out!

(You should write a book on all the differences.)

CA
 
C

CarpentersApprentice

New Member
rlvaughn said:
Thanks, CA. But I don't have to; my friend Albert Wardin already has! It has recently been published by the Baptist History and Heritage Society, Atlanta, GA. You can read a description of his new book, The Twelve Tribes of Baptists in the USA: a Historical and Statisical Analysis, here:

http://baptistsearch.blogspot.com/2007/10/albert-wardins-twelve-tribes.html
Click to expand...

Thanks. I'll look into it.

(The title is interesting. Is he subliminally saying that Baptists in America are the new Israel?)

CA
 
D

drfuss

New Member
CarpentersApprentice said:
The Once Saved Always Saved thread got me to thinking about groups instead of individuals. As evidenced in that thread most Baptists seem to believe in OSAS, although, of course, that is not universally accepted.

I note that the National Association of Free Will Baptists "believe that there are strong grounds to hope that the saved will persevere unto the end and be saved because of the power of divine grace pledged for their support. We believe that any saved person who has sinned (whether we call him a backslider or sinner), but has a desire to repent, may do so and be restored to God's favor and fellowship. Since man, however, continues to have free choice, it is possible because of temptations and the weakness of human flesh for him to fall into the practice of sin and to make shipwreck of his faith and be lost."

A good reference on this is "4 Views on Eternal Security" published by Zondervan.

Are there other Baptist groups (not individual churches) that do not believe in OSAS?

Thanks.

CA
Click to expand...

drfuss: In general, Free-Will Baptist are Reformed Arminians, i.e. you can forfeit your salvation, but not lose it. They believe a Christian can forfeit their salvation by making a decision to stop trusting Christ. In the above statement, it says "and to make a shipwreck of his faith and be lost". Note that he is not lost because of sin, but because of his decision to make a shipwreck of his faith (forfeit his salvation).

On the other hand, Wesleyan Arminians believe a Christian (while still retaining his faith) can lose his salvation by not confessing, repenting and being remorseful for known sins. An example would be a believing Christian refusing to forgive someone a long time after the offense.

A good reference on this is "4 Views on Eternal Security" published by Zondervan.
 
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C

CarpentersApprentice

New Member
drfuss said:
drfuss: In general, Free-Will Baptist are Reformed Arminians, i.e. you can forfeit your salvation, but not lose it. They believe a Christian can forfeit their salvation by making a decision to stop trusting Christ. In the above statement, it says "and to make a shipwreck of his faith and be lost". Note that he is not lost because of sin, but because of his decision to make a shipwreck of his faith (forfeit his salvation).

On the other hand, Wesleyan Arminians believe a Christian (while still retaining his faith) can lose his salvation by not confessing, repenting and being remorseful for known sins. An example would be a believing Christian refusing to forgive someone a long time after the offense.

A good reference on this is "4 Views on Eternal Security" published by Zondervan.
Click to expand...

Reformed vs. Wesleyan Arminianism. Whew... Now THAT is a finely honed difference. And thanks for the book reference.

CA
 
D

drfuss

New Member
CarpentersApprentice said:
Reformed vs. Wesleyan Arminianism. Whew... Now THAT is a finely honed difference. And thanks for the book reference.

CA
Click to expand...

drfuss: I suspect to many R/W Arminian Christians, a 5 point Calvinist compared to a 1 point Calvinist is also a finely honed difference.
 
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BobRyan

BobRyan

Well-Known Member
drfuss said:
drfuss:

On the other hand, Wesleyan Arminians believe a Christian (while still retaining his faith) can lose his salvation by not confessing, repenting and being remorseful for known sins. An example would be a believing Christian refusing to forgive someone a long time after the offense.
.
Click to expand...

so basically - Matt 18... "Forgiveness revoked" for one who IS forgiven and yet stubbornly refuses to forgive others?

Is the argument here that Free Will Baptists would not view the "forgiveness revoked" of Matt 18 as "losing salvation"??

in Christ,

Bob
 
D

drfuss

New Member
BobRyan said:
so basically - Matt 18... "Forgiveness revoked" for one who IS forgiven and yet stubbornly refuses to forgive others?

Is the argument here that Free Will Baptists would not view the "forgiveness revoked" of Matt 18 as "losing salvation"??

in Christ,

Bob
Click to expand...

drfuss: I think a better question would be how do they view Matt. 6:14.

I am not a FreeWill Baptist and have never been in a FreeWill Baptist service. So I cannot answer how they would interpret all scriptures. I assume they would handle your question the same way an OSAS Christian would.

When I get time, I will try to find out how FreeWill Baptist handle Matt. 6:14.
 
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