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Baptist History

Discussion in 'Baptist History' started by Salty, Mar 5, 2023.

  1. Salty

    Salty 20,000 Posts Club
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    • Informative Informative x 1
  2. Alan Gross

    Alan Gross Well-Known Member

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    from: Baptist History - by Winthrop Hudson

    I, as a Historic Baptist, will go with their first statement of:


    "Origins

    Some Baptists believe that there has been
    an unbroken succession of Baptist churches*
    from the days of
    John the Baptist and the Apostles of Jesus Christ."

    New thread: Thoughtful, Prayerful, Acquiescence to The Eternal Word of God.

    * "Baptist-like" churches of "like faith and order" like The Kind of church Jesus Built, with The New Testament distinctive of being faithful to The Great Commission.
     
  3. Salty

    Salty 20,000 Posts Club
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    From the link above - Roger Williams - founded the first Baptist church was founded in Rhode Island. But Williams had just left the Puritans. Therefore - according to some - that church in Rhode Island would NOT be a valid Baptist church; as it was not founded under the authority of a valid Baptist church.
     
  4. Alan Gross

    Alan Gross Well-Known Member

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    Satan is a liar.

    Roger Williams was a pretender, self-initiated 'Baptist', for four mouths, before giving up his status, as a pretender 'Baptist', forever.

    Baptist History Homepage

    Was Roger Williams a Baptist?
    By M. R. Ellis, 1928
    A history of the establishment of the Baptist church in the colonies

    "It was announced recently that statues in memory of ancient divines are to be placed in the Cathedral of St. John in New York, among them being one of Roger Williams, "Father of the Baptist Church in America."

    "Being familiar with the traditions and history of his time and activities, I took exception to this as a historical error. Since Roger Williams was never a Baptist, and was during his whole life one of the most vigorous antagonists of the church of England, this statue will be, at least, an anomaly. There is no evidence that he was ever associated with any religious organization."
    ...
    "I shall confine myself to the questions of the establishment of the Baptist church in the colonies and the charter upon which our civic liberties were founded. The honor for both belongs to Dr. John Clarke, founder of Newport R. I., in 1639."

    ...

    "Meantime, in 1638, Williams, with about twenty followers, moved from his retreat at Narragansett up the coast to a point where Providence is situated. There they kneeled and thanked "Providence" for their liberation. Thus came the name of that prosperous city."

    "A civic compact was drawn up by Williams and signed by thirteen of his followers, five of them using the "X" mark as signature. Evidently they had no high degree of education. Let us consider the environment. An ax was the only available implement, and trees the only building material; the "log house" was the result. Here the religious impulses of the group found free action. They built a church."

    "The required dimensions were not great for the accommodation of twenty people."

    "Among Williams' following was Ezekiel Holliman. (One historian calls him Holyman.) They adopted the Baptist faith, which required baptism. Since none of them had been baptized, it was arranged that Holliman should baptize Williams, and then Williams baptized Holliman and others. (Some historians say this was by immersion; others say it was by effusion.)"

    "Upon this baptismal episode, pathetic if not absurd, has grown the tradition of Roger Williams' fame as a Baptist."

    "It is not unlike the cherry tree story of Washington's boyhood, or the apple tree and sword stories associated with the surrender of Lee to Grant at Appomattox."

    "All are myths, magnified by repetition into historical importance."

    "After four or five months of this experience, discovering his error, Williams abandoned the project and retired to his estate in Narragansett, bought from his Indian friends with wampum and beads, then current exchange with the Indians."
     
  5. Salty

    Salty 20,000 Posts Club
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    So to sum it up - Is First Baptist of Providence, RI; a valid Baptist church, since it was not started by the authority of a valid Baptist church?

    A simple yes or no will do.
     
  6. Alan Gross

    Alan Gross Well-Known Member

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    For you: yes.

    For others:

    First Baptist Church in Newport R.I. was organized by John Clark, who had Baptist baptism and, therefore, Scriptural authority, from his home church in Bedfordshire, England.

    "...the reader is referred to David B. Ray's Baptist Succession, and especially to a recent work entitled, First Baptist Church in America, by Graves and Adlam, for a full refutation of this charge (that Roger Williams was ever a Baptist, etc.).

    It is a fact that Roger Williams never held membership in a regular Baptist church a day in his life."

    Dr. John Clarke had scriptural Baptist baptism. This was his authority to Scripturally baptism others who didn't already have Scriptural baptism, by previous authority, and to organize the First Baptist Church of Newport, Rhode Island, U.S.A., as in the next three paragraphs and exactly how the Apostles used their Scriptural authority, in the book of Acts, to baptism others, having been Scripturally baptized themselves, (by John the Baptist, a man sent from God with Authority from God Himself to initiate the Divinely Originated church ordinance of baptism) and they were sent out by a properly structured and organized home church, by Jesus Himself, Who had given her (His church assembly at Jerusalem), All Authority, to go make disciples, baptism them and to teach them all things He had Commanded, in the Gospels.

    "Dr. John Clarke, the first pastor of this church, was a regularly ordained Baptist minister when he came to America from England (Bedfordshire)." That gave him Scriptural baptism and authority to baptism others who then constitute themselves as an autonomous independent New Testament church assembly.

    "By comparing their articles of faith a unity of doctrine was discovered and churches were formed. Baptist churches are always formed just in this way.

    "A few individuals, having been previously baptized, and holding membership in some Baptist church, (and/ or being Scripturally baptized by one with Scriptural baptism authority, upon their profession of faith in Jesus as their Savior) come together and adopt a church covenant and articles of faith, and are then ready to transact business, such as the election of officers for the church, the reception of members, etc., as did the church of Jerusalem just before the day of Pentecost."

    Their 'authority' is in their baptism Scripturally performed by a home church.

    "The first Baptist church in America was established in Newport, R. I., by Dr. John Clarke, and his co-laborers, in the year 1638. A note in the Philadelphia Baptist Association, p. 455, reads as follows: “When the first church in Newport, Rhode Island, was one hundred years old, in 1738, Mr. John Callender, their minister, delivered and published a sermon on the occasion."

    "This places the organization of the church in 1638. The church still exists with its original constitution."
    ...

    "Dr. J. R. Graves, in his "First Baptist Church in America," states that he visited Newport in the year 1854-5, for the purpose of learning the claims of the first Baptist church of Newport to be the oldest Baptist church in America, and while there, in company with Dr. Adlam, he visited the neglected grave of Dr. Clarke.

    Digging away a mould which had accumulated at the foot of his tombstone he read as follows:

    To the Memory
    of
    DOCTOR JOHN CLARKE,
    One of the original purchasers and proprietors of
    this island and one of the founders of the
    First Baptist Church of Newport,
    its first pastor and munificent benefactor;
    He was a native of Bedfordshire, England,
    and a practitioner of physic in London.
    He, with his associates, came to this island from Mass.
    in March, 1638, 0.S., and on the 24th,
    of the same month obtained a deed thereof from
    the Indians. He shortly after gathered
    the church aforesaid and became its pastor.
    In 1651."


    "Dr. Clarke continued to be the pastor of the first church of Newport until his death, a period of thirty-eight years, less the time he was absent in England.

    "This church is now more than two hundred and fifty years old, and from it numbers hare gone out into the West and South to form other churches."

    That is the way God Planned it.


    See: http://baptisthistoryhomepage.com/shackelford.compendium.18.html
     
    #6 Alan Gross, Mar 8, 2023
    Last edited: Mar 8, 2023
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