Bound to words used in 1611?

[Keith M]

I never said I wasnt going to stand for the truth beeing told, I said I wasn't going to stand for Lies beeig told.

And yet you support the KJVO myth???? How can you support the KJVO myth and claim you will not stand for lies being told? If you won't stand for lies being told then you must immediately abandon your support of the KJVO myth. The KJVO myth is based in error and lies, and your staunch support of it means that you are spreading - well, let's just say it certainly ISN'T the truth!

 

[robycop3]

Mr. Correa:Alot of us are still waiting for that last transmission from the Lord But as I see It he gave us His Word and We Know that Jesus defeated Satan thanks to the AV 1611! And I am sure they Had a Copy of it then Thanks and God Bless.

Yes, God gave the British His word long before the KJV was made. He also has updated His word as the language has changed, according to His design. And Jesus defeated Satan in the temple roof long before English existed, with "It is written". Not once did Satan try to answer "It is written". And JESUS certainly wasn't bound to the words of the KJV.

There is a time appointed for Jesus' return. And, until that time arrives, God will continue to update His word according to the language changes He allows/causes.

 

[robycop3]

Mr. Correa:I am glad that my sins are as far as the East is from the West! I never said I wasnt going to stand for the truth beeing told, I said I wasn't going to stand for Lies beeig told.

But I reckon that doesn't apply to YOURSELF. Every time you advocate the KJVO myth, you're not being on exactly friendly terms with the truth.



It is that Idiotic Phrase that really gets the truth to be told! Because there really isn't such a thing(KJVO Myth) but only in your mind!

KJVO is taught; therefore it's a doctrine. That doctrine is false; therefore it's a myth. Bottom line.


The fact is that the KJB is the Word and No one will deny that but on the other hand? Lets face it the only error here is trying to have your cake and eat too!

No one here denies that the KJV is a valid version of God's word. However, we will argue, quite successfully, that the KJV is NOT the ONLY valid English version of Scripture.


Like Roby said "Pick ONE" and I have! No one Here will dispute wether or not the KJB is the Word but Many will dispute the opposite.Now then, whats your Question?

My question is very simple....WHICH EDITION of the KJV do you choose as your ultimate Bible version, and why? No two KJV editions are alike.

 

[Ed Edwards]

Meanwhile, back at the Opening Post (O.P.):

Originally Posted by Jauthur001:

Why do KJV-only say we are bound to the words used
in the 1611 and that no one should ever change these words
for this would be twisting Gods Word, when the tranlators
of the 1611 did not feel this way?

For the same reason(s) that I've heard KJVO#5s say
(not all KJVOs say the same things):

1. The KJB is Jesus; Jesus is the KJB
2. There are no differences between the KJVs
3. MVs sucketh





Originally Posted by william s. correa

I never said I wasnt going to stand for the truth
beeing told, I said I wasn't going to stand
for Lies beeig told.

To which it was said:

Originally Posted by Keith M

And yet you support the KJVO myth???? How can you support
the KJVO myth and claim you will not stand for
lies being told? If you won't stand for lies
being told then you must immediately abandon
your support of the KJVO myth. The KJVO myth
is based in error and lies, and your staunch support
of it means that you are spreading - well,
let's just say it certainly ISN'T the truth!

Amen, Brother Keith M - Preach it!
The myth has become more important than:

1. true worship of Christ
2. fellowship with otherwise like minded Baptists
3. love for fellow Christians
4. logic

The myth has become important enough to break
fellowship with other christians, lie,
hate the brotherhood of Christ(ians), and commit
other abominations before God including a case load
of double standards.

 

[Keith M]

It is quite obvious that most KJVO supporters view lying and hypocrisy as acceptable. Otherwise they could not support the KJVO myth. The only viable reason to be KJVO is that it is your Bible of choice, and no one should be condemned for that. But those who usually support the KJVO myth normally go much further than having the KJV as their Bible of choice - they usually condemn everyone who holds a modern version as their Bible of choice, blaspheming all other Bible versions in the process. When will they learn?

You shall not bear false witness against your neighbor. Exodus 20:16 NKJV

This is one of the Ten Commandments given us by God through Moses. yet KJVO supporters continually bear false witness against their neighbors. This is acceptable practice for the vast majority of KJVO myth supporters.

 

[Ed Edwards]

Nearby is defined five kinds of KJVO:

http://www.baptistboard.com/showthread.php?t=2394

I'm a KJVO#2 myself - I beleive the Received Texts are
the best source from which to start translating.

 

[Keith M]

I think most of us can accept that, Ed. But you certainly don't condemn all other Bible versions as not being the word of God. But there are many KJVO supporters who claim only the KJV is the word of God, and that all other versions are fakes.

 

[Ed Edwards]

YEs, I sure don't like the New King James Version (nKJV)
and HCSB (Christian Standard Bible /Holman, 2003/ );
to be condemned for having footnotes that menition
things other than the Received Texts.

But I still think that all the KJVs are also the
Written Word of God.

 

[Jarthur001]

Nearby is defined five kinds of KJVO:

http://www.baptistboard.com/showthread.php?t=2394

I'm a KJVO#2 myself - I beleive the Received Texts are
the best source from which to start translating.

If there is a debate..this is where the debate should be. The TR debate has points to be considered. This is all it was in the beginning. Back in the 70s when I 1st heard of the "TR debate" at least it made sense. This "translation debate" has no ground to stand on, full of lies and silly at best.

 

[Trotter]

It is quite obvious that most KJVO supporters view lying and hypocrisy as acceptable. Otherwise they could not support the KJVO myth.

Actually, I know several KJVO people, and I could not group them as such. Those that I know personally are rock-solid Christians without a drop of hypocrisy in 'em.

They support the lie of KJVOism because that is what is screamed at them from the pulpit as truth.

One KJVO lady I used to work with asked me what bible I use. i told her the NKJV for the most part, as well as the NASB. She just smiled and nodded and said, "Well, it's the King James for me." This same lady has no doubt as to my stand, and knows that I am a preacher who knows his stuff (usually).

But those who usually support the KJVO myth normally go much further than having the KJV as their Bible of choice - they usually condemn everyone who holds a modern version as their Bible of choice, blaspheming all other Bible versions in the process. When will they learn?

Thankfully, these are actually a very small minority... but somehow they seem to find the BB every time. Our recently departed friend William was one of these individuals, but he was but one of a long line of such to rampage through the page sof the BaptistBoard over the years.

 

[AntennaFarmer]

My, aren't we smug now that bad ole William is gone.


//It is quite obvious that most KJVO supporters view lying and hypocrisy as acceptable.// That comment is just plain offensive.

//They support the lie of KJVOism because that is what is screamed at them from the pulpit as truth.// I don't think I have ever heard it even mentioned from the pulpit.

//My question is very simple....WHICH EDITION of the KJV do you choose as your ultimate Bible version, and why? No two KJV editions are alike.// Do you actually believe that line?

//The myth has become important enough to break fellowship with other christians, .....// That is right brother. Now that William is gone we can work on running off the next KJVO on the list. Now who would that be, maybe Antennafarmer?

 

[kubel]

AntennaFarmer,

I agree with you on quote #1. I don't think most KJVOs are in support of lieing or hypocrisy. They just strongly believe in something that is just not true, and are unwilling to accept the evidence that shows that it is not true. KJVOs are unwilling to accept, much less even consider the evidence because they take it by faith. Faith, even in the shadows of fact, can be a hard thing to break. Fortunately, I know that faith comes by hearing, and hearing comes by the word of God. Nowhere in Gods word does it support one-version-onlyism. So that faith is not Biblical faith. It's faith in man-made religion, and it's tied into the fundamentals of that faith so much that KJVOs feel they will lose the ground they stand on if they lose KJVO. As an ex-KJVO, I can say that I thought that same thing. But it didn't turn out as I feared. I still have that foundation. And what I know of Christ and his gospel still comes from his word. In fact- the KJV! One can keep their KJV without the nonsense of KJVO.

As far as quote #2, sure, KJVO is taught from the pulpit. That's where I heard it. And I believed in it. Grew up in it.

Quote #3 is likewise valid. If the KJV is the only valid version, which edition is the valid edition? It's a fair question. But the silence on a KJVOs part isn't going to change their mind about it. The issue is not logic, but faith. A KJVO has to be willing to drop their faith in something that is of man (it's not of the Bible) in order to see the truth.

#4 and I'm done. It's unfortunate that we argue over this and break fellowship because of the argueing. Both sides feel they are justified in saying what they do because both sides feel that what they say is right. But when we look at it from the other persons side, it's not so cool. On the KJVO side, all the MVers are a bunch of devil-deceived know-it-alls that are trying to pull people from the truth. On the MV side, all the KJVOs are willingly ignorant fools that are liars and hypocrits. Neither side is correct.

But then again, this room is a debate forum. It's designed for arguments. But KJVO shouldn't be an issue that we break fellowship over. Debates can get heated, but we are still saints of God and followers of Christ.

 

[robycop3]

AntennaFarmer:My, aren't we smug now that bad ole William is gone.


//It is quite obvious that most KJVO supporters view lying and hypocrisy as acceptable.// That comment is just plain offensive.

The evidence in many of their posts speaks for itself.

//They support the lie of KJVOism because that is what is screamed at them from the pulpit as truth.// I don't think I have ever heard it even mentioned from the pulpit.

I believe you can receive the Voice Of The Appalachians radio broadcast, with Rev. Jeffrey Fugate, in Virginia. (From Clay's Mill BC, Lexington, KY) While Pastor Fugate is otherwise a fine preacher, he's eaten up with the KJVO myth and often supports it from his pulpit. And you may hear "The Old Trail Blazer" from the following:
http://www.radiomissions.org/

Not to mention the many local churches which have "KJV Only" among their beliefs, policies, or doctrines.


//My question is very simple....WHICH EDITION of the KJV do you choose as your ultimate Bible version, and why? No two KJV editions are alike.// Do you actually believe that line?

Of course I do...COMMON SENSE!! I have several KJV editions, none of which are alike. This includes the AV 1611.

//The myth has become important enough to break fellowship with other christians, .....// That is right brother. Now that William is gone we can work on running off the next KJVO on the list. Now who would that be, maybe Antennafarmer?

I don't believe anyone is trying to run anyone else off. What I do is seek to keep the falsehoods of the KJVO myth before the readership lest anyone else becomes infected with this false doctrine....and maybe, just maybe, some KJVO will realize the fallacy of the KJVO doctrine and drop it like a hot potato. Remember, one can choose to use the KJV or any other one version only without taking up a false "One-Version-Only" doctrine. If the KJVOs think more of their doctrine than they do the TRUTH, and just cannot take seeing their doctrine laid bare, stripped of all pretense, & choose to leave, then so be it.

 

[Keith M]

We are told that there will come a time when people will not endure sound doctrine but will be turned aside to fables. Such is it with the KJVO stance preached by some people. They accept the myth of the KJVO fable and do not endure the sound doctrine of the truth. How sad...

I charge you therefore before God and the Lord Jesus Christ, who will judge the living and the dead at His appearing and His kingdom: Preach the word! Be ready in season and out of season. Convince, rebuke, exhort, with all longsuffering and teaching. For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine, but according to their own desires, because they have itching ears, they will heap up for themselves teachers; and they will turn their ears away from the truth, and be turned aside to fables. But you be watchful in all things, endure afflictions, do the work of an evangelist, fulfill your ministry. 2 Timothy 4:1-5 NKJV

 

[robycop3]

He left on his own!

With all due respect, Antenna farmer, have you not seen other KJVOs leave this & other boards when they see no one's gonna buy into their myth? That makes me wonder if those cats are REALLY all that dedicated to KJVO. Seems that if they were, they'd try to justify their belief with more than the flimsy evidence they've shown so far.

Seems that if William were truly convinced he's right, that he woulda made a better defense. He seems to me to be one who's read a buncha KJVO books & unfortunately hasn't bothered to check out the veracity of their claims. His "arguments" appear quite in step with the old Wilkinson-Ray-Ruckman-Fuller "party line" with some Riplingerisms tossed in.

There have been times when I've been the ONLY Freedom Reader active on some boards. The usual KJVO reaction is to ban me from their boards, but sometimes they actually allow me to stay & present my views. Of course their usual mass reaction is to spin when I ask'em to justify their KJVO doctrine by substance & evidence, and/or to launch an ad-hominem attack, but since I KNOW I'm right in denying the veracity of "the KJV is the only valid English Bible version", I keep on plugging away. You see, my conviction that it's false is much-stronger than the KJVO's conviction that their myth is right. You see, for them to be right, they need EVIDENCE, while all I need to be right is their LACK of evidence. All they've EVER needed to shut me up is PROOF AND EVIDENCE that supports KJVO. To me, DEFENDING GOD'S WORD & TRYING TO KEEP BABES IN CHRIST FROM FALSE DOCTRINES & BELIEFS is much-more-important than winning any argument. But the plain ole LACK OF SUBSTANCE AND EVIDENCE convinces me that KJVO is false. NNE is actually BOUND to the words in the AV 1611.

However, I will NEVER argue against anyone's right to use any valid BV he/she wishes, from PERSONAL PREFERENCE. But I WILL FIGHT, long as God enables me, against the false KJVO myth.

 

[kubel]

Amen robycop3,

A lot of KJVOs imply that they are bashed because they choose the KJV. That is simply not true. From my experience (as a KJVP), I have only received the bashing from the KJVO side (ironically we both still read the same version)! It's a fairly unique position to be able to choose the KJV out of preference and still not repeating the falsity of onlyism.

 

[Keith M]

I don't think anyone has bashed anyone for preferring the KJV or believing the underlying Textus Receptus is the best Greek text. However, preferring the KJV and trying to say it is the only valid English Bible version are two opposite poles. No one has the right to bash someone because of their Bible version preference, but many in the KJVO camp regularly fail to recognize this, playing judge and jury over everyone who prefers any version but the KJV.

Cranston is right. No one forced William to leave Baptist Board. He chose to leave rather than to offer one shred of real evidence to support the KJVO myth. He is one who would rather promote a lie than to accept the truth. Maybe William will find happiness on another board where the majority of participants accept the KJVO myth. But here at BB we label a myth as a myth, and there is no getting around that fact.

 

[Trotter]

//The myth has become important enough to break fellowship with other christians, .....// That is right brother. Now that William is gone we can work on running off the next KJVO on the list. Now who would that be, maybe Antennafarmer?

No one is trying, or was trying, to run anyone off. William was banned, and that after several warnings over calling people's salvation into question as well as attacking any other translation than the KJV.

Actually, I enjoy our posts. You post in a civil tone (from what I can pick up), and are not beligerant about your views. You show that not all KJVO are like William and his ilk.

No one forced William to leave Baptist Board.

As I said, William was banned after several warnings. So, yes, he was forced to leave.

 

[Keith M]

Even if he was banned because of the things you say, Trotter, William's departure was due to his own bad choices...

 

[robycop3]

My apologies....I musta missed where Wm. was banned. I do know that Philip warned him several times about posting copyrighted material w/o proper recognition, & that he called the salvation of others into question.

On boards moderated by me, calling someone's salvation into question will result in an instant ban. Salvation is a matter ONLY between each individual and GOD.

But I'm getting off the subject. There's only ONE valid reason why anyone should be bound to the words of the KJV: That reason is that there's no other BV available to that person.