Bush Admin admits another war.

[billwald]

None of you Bushites want to mention our new secret ground invasion of Pakistan 2 months ago?

 

[Don]

Not actually very secret, was it?

And Pakistan has made it clear they will not tolerate any further incursions.

 

[ReformedBaptist]

What ground invasion? What should we call the Obama camp? Obamamites? Obamamite...get us all killed. Obamamite...flip flop positions. hahaha!

 

[ReformedBaptist]

Ok, caught the article on Foxnews. Doesn't seem wise...politically speaking. But they are going after terrorists.

 

[poncho]

So then it's okay to violate another nation's sovereignty so long as we're "going after terrorists"?

 

[Squire Robertsson]

So then it's okay to violate another nation's sovereignty so long as we're "going after terrorists"?

Poncho, if a country can not control a force militarily attacking a neighbor the neighbor has the right to hot pursuit, c.f. Pershing and Villa. Currently, the Tribal Areas in Pakistan are operating with a foreign policy contrary to Islamabad's's. From what I see, Islamabad can not exercise its sovereignty in and over the Northwest Border areas.

 

[poncho]

Poncho, if a country can not control a force militarily attacking a neighbor the neighbor has the right to hot pursuit, c.f. Pershing and Villa. Currently, the Tribal Areas in Pakistan are operating with a foriegn policy contrary to Karachi's. From what I see, Karachi can not exercise its sovereignty in and over the Northwest Border areas.

Okay, I just checked a map Squire. The USA does not share a border with Pakistan. The USA does share a border with mexico and the mexican military and drug gangs cross over onto U.S. soil and use violence against U.S. citizens quite often from the reports I've read. This amounts to terrorizing U.S. citizens on their own property. Where's the hot pursuit into mexico after these terrorists?

 

[Squire Robertsson]

Okay, I just checked a map Squire. The USA does not share a border with Pakistan. The USA does share a border with mexico and the mexican military and drug gangs cross over onto U.S. soil and use violence against U.S. citizens quite often from the reports I've read. This amounts to terrorizing U.S. citizens on their own property. Where's the hot pursuit into mexico after these terrorists?

Poncho, you looked at the wrong part of the map. I'm refering to the supposed Afgan\Pakistani border. As for the point you raised, it's valid but not germane to this thread.

 

[Paladin]

Who can forget Barry's position on Pakistan

http://www.reuters.com/article/domesticNews/idUSN0132206420070801

 

[tinytim]

So then it's okay to violate another nation's sovereignty so long as we're "going after terrorists"?

I do believe that right after 9/11 Bush warned all countries that we are going after the terrorists...

He also said that if they are not for us they are against us....

He gave Pakistan warning to round up the Terrorists...

If a country won't do it... We have to.

so yes, if we are going after our enemies, and they are hiding out in a country, and the country will not round them up... we will.

But the pansy left say, "leave those terrorists alone, they have rights"...

 

[tinytim]

Who can forget Barry's position on Pakistan

http://www.reuters.com/article/domesticNews/idUSN0132206420070801

Wow... Apparently Obama and I agree on this.... Maybe he isn't the pansy I thought he was...

 

[dragonfly]

Poncho, if a country can not control a force militarily attacking a neighbor the neighbor has the right to hot pursuit, c.f. Pershing and Villa. Currently, the Tribal Areas in Pakistan are operating with a foreign policy contrary to Islamabad's's. From what I see, Islamabad can not exercise its sovereignty in and over the Northwest Border areas.

I agree. If I had a neighbor who would periodically damage my house, and the police wouldn't do anything to stop them; I would be forced to either move (wouldn't do that) or take matters into my own hands.

 

[targus]

If Obama were smart he would be taking credit for this.

He could say that he is glad that Bush is finally listening to him.

You know, kind of make himself look more preidential.

 

[billwald]

>Poncho, if a country can not control a force militarily attacking a neighbor the neighbor has the right to hot pursuit, c.f. Pershing and Villa.

Did the Mexican people forgive and forget?

 

[LeBuick]

Wow... Apparently Obama and I agree on this.... Maybe he isn't the pansy I thought he was...

You bet ya Tiny, glad you gave him credit.

You know he was the one who also called for reducing the troops in Iraq so we could put more in Afghanistan. No one is giving him credit for that call either.

 

[LeBuick]

If Obama were smart he would be taking credit for this.

He could say that he is glad that Bush is finally listening to him.

You know, kind of make himself look more preidential.

He tried but the media overshadowed it with McCain being right about the troop build up and how well it worked.

 

[Revmitchell]

If Obama were smart he would be taking credit for this.

He could say that he is glad that Bush is finally listening to him.

You know, kind of make himself look more presidential.

You better believe he is trying that both in Afghanistan and Iraq.

 

[poncho]

I do believe that right after 9/11 Bush warned all countries that we are going after the terrorists...

He also said that if they are not for us they are against us....

He gave Pakistan warning to round up the Terrorists...

If a country won't do it... We have to.

so yes, if we are going after our enemies, and they are hiding out in a country, and the country will not round them up... we will.

But the pansy left say, "leave those terrorists alone, they have rights"...

Pansy left? Don't you guys ever get tired of demonizing and scapegoating others? Part of my recent study on fascism has revealed that these two tactics along with a disreguard for human rights are symptoms of fascism.

The left doesn't say "leave those terrorists alone, they have rights" Tim you know that. What the left does say is everyone has rights, that's what our founding documents say, that's how our legal system was set up. Americans have always believed in innocent until proven guilty...and the right to a fair trial.

Until that is they started falling prey to non stop corporatist propaganda.

So many here have set themselves up as judge and jury convicting anyone who either disagrees with them or sees things differently as "terrorist" sympathizers or un patriotic and a danger to society. I'm not accusing you of being a fascist Tim I'm just saying be careful if you all keep walking down the path you seem to be going before long you may find yourself wearing black armbands and goose stepping to the tune of the Horst Wessel song.

Oh yeah and we all just know the "great leader" is always right...don't we Tim?

 

[targus]

The left doesn't say "leave those terrorists alone, they have rights" Tim you know that. What the left does say is everyone has rights, that's what our founding documents say, that's how our legal system was set up. Americans have always believed in innocent until proven guilty...and the right to a fair trial.

The problem is that I don't think that the Founding Fathers ever intended for those same rights to be extended to non-U.S. citizens captured on a foreign battlefield.

I thought that the world wide historical tradition has been that enemy combatants not wearing a uniform were executed - not read their rights then given a lawyer and a holding facility with the reading material and diet of their choice.

 

[NiteShift]

Pansy left? Don't you guys ever get tired of demonizing and scapegoating others? Part of my recent study on fascism has revealed that these two tactics along with a disreguard for human rights are symptoms of fascism.

The left doesn't say "leave those terrorists alone, they have rights" Tim you know that. What the left does say is everyone has rights, that's what our founding documents say, that's how our legal system was set up. Americans have always believed in innocent until proven guilty...and the right to a fair trial.

Until that is they started falling prey to non stop corporatist propaganda.

So many here have set themselves up as judge and jury convicting anyone who either disagrees with them or sees things differently as "terrorist" sympathizers or un patriotic and a danger to society. I'm not accusing you of being a fascist Tim I'm just saying be careful if you all keep walking down the path you seem to be going before long you may find yourself wearing black armbands and goose stepping to the tune of the Horst Wessel song.

Oh yeah and we all just know the "great leader" is always right...don't we Tim?

You've been questioning all along why Bush doesn't go after Bin Laden, who is believed to be hiding in Pakistan. And now that Bush has reportedly authorized Special Forces to go in, you switch over to the Bush is Fascist argument. So which is it to be? Bush Should go after Bin Laden wherever he is? Or Bush is a fascist if he does so?