Can Christians respect atheists?

Let's start with another question: did the Nazis respect the Jews? I take it that everyone will accept the answer to this is a resounding NO. This answer is obvious from the simple observation that the Nazis believed that an acceptable action toward Jewish people, by virtue of their being Jewish, was for them to be burnt in ovens and gassed to death.

How is the Christian ideal toward atheists any different? Well, OK, perhaps it is actually a lot worse. Most Christians believe that I, by virtue of being an atheist, deserve a fate that makes the holocaust look like winning the lottery.

I fail to see any substantive difference between these two scenarios, and it is due to this that I believe it is perfetly rational of me to view Christians as my enemies, just as a Jew would see Hitler as their enemy.

Many Christians I have met however have been very nice and friendly people, and I truly don't believe that they, if they were at the heavenly controls, would choose to have me burn in agony forever.

Would you? And if so, what reason is there for me not to view you in the same light that a Jew viewed Hitler in?

 

Those christians who have negative feelings towards atheists should realize that christians also are atheists with respect to most of the Gods in past history. Christians are atheists with respect to Zeus, Baal, etc. Does that make christians bad people, to be atheists with respect to most of the Gods whose existence has been claimed by someone at some time in the past?

 

Just for Christians who say that God sends atheists to hell, not other Christians...

Well those Christians would believe that hell is a perfectly just and fair punishment and so be endorsing that. It would be like a neo-Nazi saying that the Jews deserved going to the concentration camps.

 

Kachana, God is not choosing to burn you in hell. It is your choice. You can choose to stop rejecting your salvation and be with The Lord in paridise, or you can choose the path you are on and earn eternal damnation. God loves you so much that he sent his Son to take the punishment of your sin on the cross with his holy precious blood. All you have to do is believe

This is the new covenant whereas with the old covenant we were dead in our sins because no-one is without sin and able to follow the law. This is why we call Jesus our "Savior."

John 316
"For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son,[1] that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.

 

Again, all you have to do is believe! Hell is a terrible place, and out of Christian love we are here giving you the Gospel. No-one wants you to go to hell-including God! That is why he sent his Son. The Gospel(or good news) is that you have salvation in Christ. You just need to believe. That is the only requirement! God is merciful, loving and just.

 

But, wishtolearn, we have a commandment from God. We call it, "The Great Commission."

Mark 16
15He said to them, "Go into all the world and preach the good news to all creation.

Matthew 28
18Then Jesus came to them and said, "All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me. 19Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit,

 

Ok, I guess death camps aren't a good analogy since Jews probably weren't set free if they renounced their faith.

But what about this:

And this:

I think it is against this board's rules to give links to the anti-Christian sites that said that though.

So the same thing could be said in those examples - those Christians mightn't want people to die - they'd rather the people converted.

You said before:
"God is not choosing to burn you in hell. It is your choice."

In the same way, it isn't the Christians choice to massacre those who don't repent... it is the choice of the unrepentant.

So do you think that God's ultimatum is different from the one that Charlemagne apparently gave the Saxon rebels? Of course, it isn't a Christian thing to do to threaten people with death, but on the other hand, that is what God is doing.

 

Oh if only it was as pleasant as murder, murder's a doddle! Instead, you deem it the perfect consequence of my life on Earth to spend eternity in a fate that would make a Klansman puke. It makes no difference that you don't personally put me in Hell, as you believe I should go there, and furthermore, you yourself have no influence in the matter so couldn't send me there or not anyway.

That's why I asked 'What would you do if you were the heavenly controls?'

If you say you'd send me to Hell, I stand by my analogy, if you say otherwise, it would appear that you disagree with God.

Just to hammer home the faulty distinction you are making between action and belief in this instance: some Nazis never murdered any Jews, they worked in other offices, but still supported that the perfectly acceptable fate for Jews was to burn in Hell. Should a Jew not hold the same contempt for these individuals as for other Nazis? Some racists don't actually beat up and harm blacks, but give their full support to those who do and think that a black man burning to death is a perfect consequence of that man being born into his race. Do you hold the greatest contempt for these individuals? If you do, what makes you any different as far as I am concerned.

There is nothing of substance to reply to here.

[ March 23, 2002, 08:46 AM: Message edited by: Kachana ]

 

Thanks for the reply Kim. You're the kind of Christian I was talking about that is truly caring and honest, and I just can't reconcile in my mind the thought that you believe it perfectly right for me to burn in a fire for eternity. Perhaps you don't believe that? Perhaps you think that I shouldn't go to Hell, that that infinite punishment would be way to harsh for me?

 

That is a bald faced lie! I'll prove it to you: 'I do not want to go to Hell'. QED. To say that I still choose to go to Hell is exactly as absurd as this:

Nazi to Jew: Do you want to burn in Auschwitz?

Jew to Nazi: No, I do NOT want to burn in Auschwitz

Nazi to Jew: Ok, I'm sending you to Auschwitz as that is your choice.

What differentiates your thinking from the Nazi's?

Nazi to Jew: You can choose to stop rejecting the true Aryan way and have cutting edge genetic and plastic surgery to be like us, or you can continue as you are and earn death in a fire in Auschwitz. Hitler loves you so much that he's willing no to kill you outright, but to let you change, all you have to do is accept our offer.

What's the qualitative difference?

 

Again, another type of Christian that I would be perfectly happy to see any of my children become.

[ March 23, 2002, 09:19 AM: Message edited by: Kachana ]

 

Clint: I don't think that it is too cool that kachana is calling us "Natzi's". You see how we try to reach out to then in Christian love with the Gospel and show them the way to salvation and we get called Natzi's? Look at the way she perverted my words.

quote:
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You can choose to stop rejecting your salvation and be with The Lord in paridise, or you can choose the path you are on and earn eternal damnation. God loves you so much that he sent his Son to take the punishment of your sin on the cross with his holy precious blood. All you have to do is believe
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Nazi to Jew: You can choose to stop rejecting the true Aryan way and have cutting edge genetic and plastic surgery to be like us, or you can continue as you are and earn death in a fire in Auschwitz. Hitler loves you so much that he's willing no to kill you outright, but to let you change, all you have to do is accept our offer.

What's the qualitative difference?

How can you reach out to someone like this? Yet, she is calling herself a Christian? This is the most peculiar brand of Christianity I have ever seen.

In Christ,

Mary

[ March 23, 2002, 09:30 AM: Message edited by: tulpje ]

 

These kinds of remarks are pitiful & inflammatory, not the basis of good debate or discussion, IMHO, on any board, let alone this one. Perhaps there is more TROLLING going on?

Mary: Is it time to shake the dust on this thread, too?
</font>[/QUOTE]She actually suggested that? I don't know Eagle. It hurts that I am trying to express to them the love of Christ and we are insulted so badly.