Christian Tradition

[Yeshua1]

Correct. Many here at the BB are former Catholics (as I am) and an example of "traditional teachings" would be the Marian (the mother of Jesus) Dogma:

1.) She is the mother of God
2.) She is a perpetual virgin.
3.) She was conceived without Original Sin.
4.) She was assumed into heaven.

http://www.catholicnewsagency.com/resources/mary/general-information/the-four-marian-dogmas/

There is a fifth Marian Dogma in the works. The pope must proclaim it ex cathedra before it is binding upon all Catholics.

This one is quite offensive to non-Roman Catholics but is an example of how diverted from the scripture tradition may become.

While it is not officially a Roman Catholic dogma it is unofficially approved and even promoted (or should it be said that it is allowed) by some of the RCC hierarchy. It is controversial among some Catholic theologians and an embarrassment to some of the laity, if you read the URL and explanation you will see why.

5.) She is the CoRedemptrix, Mediatrix and Advocatrix.

http://www.catholicplanet.com/CMA/

This is an example of the OP (IMO) and not an object of discussion.
That would have to come in another BB thread post preferably Other Christian Denominations.

HankD

This is why the Church of Rome has to have verbal/oral tradition equally authoratative as the Bible, as most of their doctrines and beliefs cannot be found just in the Bible itself!

 

[Martin Marprelate]

"Service at the Metropolitan Tabernacle" The Christian, 22 April 1875, p. 31:

If there was an 'American organ' present that day, Ira Sankey brought it with him.

Spurgeon felt that the use of instruments in the normal corporate worship of the church increased the natural tendency toward externality, superficiality and formalism in worship as well as in one's perception of the nature of Christian faith. "When the organ peals out its melodious tones, but the heart is not in the singing, dost thou think that God has ears like a man, that can be tickled with sweet sounds?" He asked. Don't think that God is as impressed with wordless sounds and mechanically-produced tones and harmonies as we might be. "He is spiritual; the music that delights Him is the love of a true heart, the prayer of an anxious spirit. He has better music than all your drums and organs can ever bring to Him. If He wanted music, He would not have asked thee, for winds and wave make melodies transcendentally superior to all you chief musicians can compose." Such music he compared to the unwarranted lighting of candles in a church.......... He pictured the dissenting congregation with a choir composed of five or six to "sing the glory of themselves" while the congregation sits still not daring to "Spoil music so magnificent." [Thomas Nettles, Living by Revealed Truth, pages 262-263. Quotations from Spurgeon from sermon preached in Newington July 13, 1890 and from M.T.P. 1861, 218.

Spurgeon was very sympathetic toward Moody and Sankey, and certainly in December 1881, when he himself was convalescing in France, he turned a Lord's Day service over to them. Perhaps he also did it in 1875, though Nettles does not mention it.

 

[Van]

Traditions as used today refer to the interpretations of scripture by men and organizations, rather than what the apostles delivered as the New Testament. Christian doctrine or teachings must arise from and never conflict with scripture. But the teachings of men, about scripture, belong to a subset, i.e. the traditions of men.

Efforts to embellish long held but uninspired views of church leaders, as authoritative are without merit.

 

[Bluefalcon]

One of my favorite songs is "Tradition," Fiddler on the Roof.

 

[JonC]

Traditions as used today refer to the interpretations of scripture by men and organizations, rather than what the apostles delivered as the New Testament. Christian doctrine or teachings must arise from and never conflict with scripture. But the teachings of men, about scripture, belong to a subset, i.e. the traditions of men.

Efforts to embellish long held but uninspired views of church leaders, as authoritative are without merit.

Sometimes, but not necessarily all of the time. Tradition also means the passing down of truth from one generation to the next. Some examples of tradition include, more locally, hymns that span generations (passing down doctrine through specific songs that transcend or unite several generations). Others are more wide spread Christian Tradition in the from of doctrine (e.g., the doctrine of the Trinity; of Justification; of Righteousness). We do not always need to dismiss the teachings of saints that have gone before us - sometimes we can learn from them. But these these tradition fall under Scripture and are always up for review.

 

[Van]

Yes, I agree, JonC, Hymns are uninspired and are enjoyed by multiple generations. I love "All is well with my Soul." Sometimes they are spot on, and sometimes reflect mistaken doctrine. But because of their beauty, their off the mark lyrics are not challenged.

Same thing can be said of the art masterpieces, so often presenting a "biblical picture" but off the mark, like a young John writing.

But to look closer to home, lets consider the tradition of justification by "faith alone." Some might embellish that "tradition" with the "gift of faith alone" or others with works to sustain salvation.

On the other hand, we have the tradition of scripture alone.

 

[Martin Marprelate]

The whole counsel of God concerning all things necessary for His own glory, man's salvation, faith and life, is either expressly set down or necessarily contained in the Holy Scripture, to which nothing is to be added at any time, either by new revelation of the Spirit, or by the traditions of men (2 Tim. 3:15-17; Gal. 1:8-9)

The acceptable way of worshipping the true God has been instituted by Himself (Deut. 12:32), and therefore our method of worship is limited by His own revealed will. He may not be worshipped according to the imagination and devices of men, nor the suggestions of Satan. He may not be worshipped by way of visible representations, or by any other way not prescribed in the Holy Scriptures (Exod. 20:4-6)

2nd London Baptist Confession of Faith, 1689. Chapter I, Art. VI; XXII, Art. I.

'He who is ignorant of what happened before he was born is destined to remain always a child'- Cicero.

 

[John of Japan]

If there was an 'American organ' present that day, Ira Sankey brought it with him.

Spurgeon was very sympathetic toward Moody and Sankey, and certainly in December 1881, when he himself was convalescing in France, he turned a Lord's Day service over to them. Perhaps he also did it in 1875, though Nettles does not mention it.

I just finished a biography of Moody, and yes, Sankey took a small organ to England when they went.

Moody admired Spurgeon greatly, and was greatly influenced by him. They became close friends, with their wives being very close also.

 

[Yeshua1]

Traditions as used today refer to the interpretations of scripture by men and organizations, rather than what the apostles delivered as the New Testament. Christian doctrine or teachings must arise from and never conflict with scripture. But the teachings of men, about scripture, belong to a subset, i.e. the traditions of men.

Efforts to embellish long held but uninspired views of church leaders, as authoritative are without merit.

Would yo see a big difference between though the Creeds/Confessions, and ytaditions such as it it used by Church of Rome?

 

[Yeshua1]

Sometimes, but not necessarily all of the time. Tradition also means the passing down of truth from one generation to the next. Some examples of tradition include, more locally, hymns that span generations (passing down doctrine through specific songs that transcend or unite several generations). Others are more wide spread Christian Tradition in the from of doctrine (e.g., the doctrine of the Trinity; of Justification; of Righteousness). We do not always need to dismiss the teachings of saints that have gone before us - sometimes we can learn from them. But these these tradition fall under Scripture and are always up for review.

The baptist view of scripture alone is to be the authority and inspiration from which all doctrices and practices come from though does NOT mean that we fail to consult and use other sources, such as what earlier saints held to as truth, commentaries, lexicons etc....

 

[Jerome]

when he himself was convalescing in France, he turned a Lord's Day service over to them

Yes, Sankey played his organ at the Metropolitan Tabernacle, and while convalescing in France, Spurgeon worshiped similarly:

From the Pulpit to the Palm-Branch: A Memorial of C. H. Spurgeon, p. 34:

Mrs. Spurgeon played the piano, while the friends sang some of her favorite hymns from [Sankey's] Sacred Songs and Solos, and Mr. Spurgeon closed the engagements of the evening with a prayer that will long be remembered by all who were present.

 

[Jerome]

http://www.godrules.net/library/spurgeon/NEW9spurgeon_e21.htm

On Wednesday evening, May 29, about 2,500 persons were present at the Tabernacle for an evening of sacred song and addresses, by our evangelists and the evangelistic choir. The pastor took the chair, and opened the meeting with prayer; and after the hymn, “Come to Jesus” had been sung, spoke of the success which had rested upon the labors of our brethren, Clarke and Smith, notably at the Tabernacle last February. A large amount had then been expended for printing, advertising, free teas and the like; so that instead of sending up a contribution towards the College Evangelists’ Fund, as most churches that receive a visit had done, there was a deficiency of about £26, which would no doubt be cleared off that evening. The time then passed most pleasantly with solos, choruses, and anthems from “The Flowers and Fruits of Sacred Song,” Mr. Smith singing the solos and occasionally leading the congregation with his cornet, Mr. Frisby conducting the evangelistic choir, and Mr. Buckley accompanying. Each of the evangelists also spoke briefly of their work, their difficulties, their success, and their Savior.

 

[Martin Marprelate]

These will not have been Lord's day services.

 

[Jerome]

What will?