coverings & such

[gekko]

hey - is it biblically wrong for a man to wear a hat in church?

does it depend on the motive for wearing the hat if it is wrong?

or is it wrong all together?

i'm speaking of 1corinthians 11.2-16

or is it fine for guy to wear a hat?

i dunno. my younger sister came up to me before the service and asked me to take my hat off - out of respect for God because we're in His house.

i refused and the day went on - but it got me thinkin.

am i respecting God any less than i am while wearing my hat?

just curious as to what your thoughts are on this.

thanks. God bless!

 

[J. Jump]

I think that is church tradition that men don't wear hats in church, but it's perfectly acceptable for women to do so. I would say that if it is offensive to a brother or sister in Christ, that I would honor their wishes as it is certainly not worth bickering about. And it's certainly not worth causing another to stumble over.

Just think of your situation. I don't know what your sister thought about you after you refused to take your hat off, but if sinful thoughts entered her mind you could have saved her that sinful moment, by merely taking your hat off.

Now as far as the house of God goes, the church building does not house God. Yes God should/can meet you there, but our bodies are actually the dwelling place of God via His Spirit. The church is not the Holy of Holies as in the old tabernacle/temple.

Hope that helps.

 

[gekko]

J.jump! it's been awhile. how are things?
-----

Just think of your situation. I don't know what your sister thought about you after you refused to take your hat off, but if sinful thoughts entered her mind you could have saved her that sinful moment, by merely taking your hat off.

yeah - i see what you mean. i don't know if i had offended anyone. in fact that's the first time anyone has ever come up to me and asked me to take my hat off in church - so i didn't really know how to respond to it.

i'll have to talk to her 'bout it.

I would say that if it is offensive to a brother or sister in Christ, that I would honor their wishes as it is certainly not worth bickering about. And it's certainly not worth causing another to stumble over.

i completely agree. again - first time it's ever happened and i don't know if anyone has been personally offended by it.

I think that is church tradition that men don't wear hats in church, but it's perfectly acceptable for women to do so.

hmm. i guess i'm not much into tradition then.

..........

God bless!

 

[Heavenly Pilgrim]

JJ: I think that is church tradition that men don't wear hats in church,

HP: YEE HAW!! You need to get on down to Cowboy Church! :laugh:

 

[Dustin]

Personally, I don't see the point in wearing a hat in church.

Just something I never thought of doing.

If you're outside for some reason, maybe, but I've never even thought of it, and I used to have quite a collection of Atlanta Braves caps.



Soli Deo Gloria,
Dustin

 

[webdog]

HP: YEE HAW!! You need to get on down to Cowboy Church! :laugh:

I was at one tonight. Our church launched Life Brand Cowboy church in Ohio. I wore a hat tonight
www.lifebrandcowboy.com

 

[webdog]

For those who think it's disrespectful for men to wear hats in church...do you keep a supply of hats available for women who attend who have short hair?

Another thing I don't get are those who think it's ok to wear hats to church...but then insist one who wears a hat must take it off to pray. Where is this in Scripture? Does the removal of the hat allow the prayer to leave the mind or something? I understand some do it out of "respect" or "reverance"...but this is purely tradition of man, IMO. They didn't have ball caps in Jesus' day. This is purely a cultural issue that some turn into a spirituality gauge.

 

[J. Jump]

You need to get on down to Cowboy Church!

Yes that would be the one exception to the tradition

 

[I Am Blessed 24]

When I was young, men removed their hats when entering ANY kind of building.

Sadly, that has gone the way of many other matters of etiquette...

 

[Heavenly Pilgrim]

Webdog: I was at one tonight. Our church launched Life Brand Cowboy church in Ohio. I wore a hat tonight

HP: You might be a little redneck if……………:laugh: :laugh:

We just might have a little more in common than you would like to imagine. :laugh:

 

[Heavenly Pilgrim]

I am blessed: When I was young, men removed their hats when entering ANY kind of building.

Sadly, that has gone the way of many other matters of etiquette...

HP: Could anyone dub a nice cowboy hat and a light mustache on the picture of I Am Blessed 16?:laugh: :laugh:

 

[I Am Blessed 24]

Heyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy! :laugh:

 

[webdog]

When I was young, men removed their hats when entering ANY kind of building.

Sadly, that has gone the way of many other matters of etiquette...

How did removing one's hat start off as good etiquette when going into a building...and what's the symbolism associated? Sounds kind of Barney Fife-ish.

I'm glad this has become extinct. Some men you wouldn't want to see their entire heads...the face is enough.

 

[tinytim]

I believe the tradition started with these verses..
I for one think a man should not pray with his hat on because of these verses..
And I can see the reasoning of taking the hat off out of respect for God in church because of these verses....

1 Corinthians 11:2-7
(2) I praise you for remembering me in everything and for holding to the teachings,[1] just as I passed them on to you.
(3) Now I want you to realize that the head of every man is Christ, and the head of the woman is man, and the head of Christ is God.
(4) Every man who prays or prophesies with his head covered dishonors his head.
(5) And every woman who prays or prophesies with her head uncovered dishonors her head--it is just as though her head were shaved.
(6) If a woman does not cover her head, she should have her hair cut off; and if it is a disgrace for a woman to have her hair cut or shaved off, she should cover her head.
(7) A man ought not to cover his head,[2] since he is the image and glory of God; but the woman is the glory of man.

 

[rbell]

I ask my guys to remove their hats.

But for us it is more as a sign of "submitting to one another in love."

It bothers some of our folk to see it. It's not a hill worth dying on...so why offend a Christian brother over a hat? Just take it off.

It's a good lesson for our gang about how a church family should think of each other first.

 

[Eliyahu]

There are more meaningful teachings on the head-covering in the Bible than the cultural background.

Men should not wear any hat or any other type of head-covering like Jewish Kefa while they pray or prophesying ( like sermon).

Women should wear the head covering during the praying or prophesying.

Read the Bible:

1 Corinthians 11:
1 Be ye followers of me, even as I also am of Christ. 2 Now I praise you, brethren, that ye remember me in all things, and keep the ordinances, as I delivered them to you. 3 But I would have you know, that the head of every man is Christ; and the head of the woman is the man; and the head of Christ is God. 4 Every man praying or prophesying, having his head covered, dishonoureth his head. 5 But every woman that prayeth or prophesieth with her head uncovered dishonoureth her head: for that is even all one as if she were shaven. 6 For if the woman be not covered, let her also be shorn: but if it be a shame for a woman to be shorn or shaven, let her be covered. 7 For a man indeed ought not to cover his head, forasmuch as he is the image and glory of God: but the woman is the glory of the man. 8 For the man is not of the woman; but the woman of the man. 9 Neither was the man created for the woman; but the woman for the man. 10 For this cause ought the woman to have power on her head because of the angels. 11 Nevertheless neither is the man without the woman, neither the woman without the man, in the Lord. 12 For as the woman is of the man, even so is the man also by the woman; but all things of God. 13 Judge in yourselves: is it comely that a woman pray unto God uncovered? 14 Doth not even nature itself teach you, that, if a man have long hair, it is a shame unto him? 15 But if a woman have long hair, it is a glory to her: for her hair is given her for a covering. 16 But if any man seem to be contentious, we have no such custom, neither the churches of God.

1) Paul explains the reason for the Head-Covering for the women, No-covering for the Men very well, not based on any cultural reasons, but based on the principle of Creation. If men cover their heads, it covers the glory of Jesus Christ. If women covers their heads, it covers the glory of men so that only the glory of Christ be demonstrated.

2) Some argue that the long hair can replace the covering as we read in v 15. Verse 15 is abused by many translators, but the word behind is "ANTI" which can be interpreted as 1) Opposition, 2) Replacement 3) For the sake of, 4) On top of, In addition. In this case, 4) th meaning applies. Otherwise, you will find the apparent contradiction with verse 6.
4th interpretation is found in John 1:16 ( Grace FOR Grace).

So-called Plymouth Brethren practices exactly as this Bible teachings, which is not difficult to obey.

Moreover, if you look at the photos taken before WWI, mostly the women attending the churches or visiting the offices wore the hats. Women's no-headcovering has just started since the industrialization and the employment of the women workers.

Jewish Kefa and Catholic head-covering for the clergies ( or so-called Monsignors) are WRONG!

 

[Shiloh]

For a guy to have a hat on in church is just BAD manners! A fellow doesn't eat with a hat on and when he goes into ANY building he takes his hat off. That includes "Cowboy" church. A fellow opens a door for a lady, gives a lady his seat if there is none available always lets a lady enter a building first. These are just some manners that have gone by the way side with our lazy society.
There are some things you do just because they are right!

 

[webdog]

For a guy to have a hat on in church is just BAD manners! A fellow doesn't eat with a hat on and when he goes into ANY building he takes his hat off.

I've worn a hat in plenty of restaurants.

A fellow opens a door for a lady, gives a lady his seat if there is none available always lets a lady enter a building first. These are just some manners that have gone by the way side with our lazy society.

Show me these Scriptures in the Bible that support this. These are all traditions of MAN.

There are some things you do just because they are right!

According to who? Who is the gauge what's "right"? Shouldn't Scripture be?

 

[webdog]

There are more meaningful teachings on the head-covering in the Bible than the cultural background.

Men should not wear any hat or any other type of head-covering like Jewish Kefa while they pray or prophesying ( like sermon).

Women should wear the head covering during the praying or prophesying.

Does your church pass out hats for the women to wear prior to each prayer? If not...why not? Why do we get to pick and choose what we do? If we claim to follow Sola Scriptura and require men to remove their hats in a church building, we better supply hats for women to wear too. Sounds like pure legalism to me.

 

[Eric B]

For a guy to have a hat on in church is just BAD manners! A fellow doesn't eat with a hat on and when he goes into ANY building he takes his hat off. That includes "Cowboy" church. A fellow opens a door for a lady, gives a lady his seat if there is none available always lets a lady enter a building first. These are just some manners that have gone by the way side with our lazy society.
There are some things you do just because they are right!

When I was young, men removed their hats when entering ANY kind of building.

Sadly, that has gone the way of many other matters of etiquette...

Yeah, people did little things like that that "made no sense", religiously; but still did many other things at the same time (like discriminating against whole other groups of people; men being too overbearing on their women and children, preachers controlling everyone through fear and being corrupt themselves, etc), and nobody thought anything about it. Now, we look back at those past generations as "good" or "right" compared with now, because of those outward signs of "etiquette". (plus outward "reverence" to God, such as public prayer, 10 Commandments, etc).
All of this is just like what Jesus scolded the Pharisees for; strainng at a gnat, and swallowing a camel; ignoring the weightier matters of the Law.
(And if that was based on 1Cor., it was missaplied by being extended to any kind of building).

There are more meaningful teachings on the head-covering in the Bible than the cultural background.

Men should not wear any hat or any other type of head-covering like Jewish Kefa while they pray or prophesying ( like sermon).

1) Paul explains the reason for the Head-Covering for the women, No-covering for the Men very well, not based on any cultural reasons, but based on the principle of Creation. If men cover their heads, it covers the glory of Jesus Christ. If women covers their heads, it covers the glory of men so that only the glory of Christ be demonstrated.

Many people today have dismissed this today as "cultural", but it just dawned on me. The Jewish head coverings are specifially for prayer, aren't they? Could the purpose of this command from Paul have been to distinguish Christians from Jews? And its "dishonorable", because it would be like a sign of rejection of Christ, and thus "cover His glory"?

How did removing one's hat start off as good etiquette when going into a building...and what's the symbolism associated? Sounds kind of Barney Fife-ish.

I'm glad this has become extinct. Some men you wouldn't want to see their entire heads...the face is enough.

I always thought it was unfair, because men are the ones who lose their hair, and might want to keep it covered, not women (though they do have their "bad hair days").

How is baldness, or the fortune of not having those genes "the glory of Christ"? This, and the thing about women having "the glory of man" also make this seem cultural, because noone understands it today. The Muslims would take this further in saying that a woman's entire face and body should be covered, and in terms of preventing lust from other men, that would seem to be more effective than just a hat covering part of their hair.