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Did/Does God REALLY Love the World?

Discussion in 'Calvinism & Arminianism Debate' started by rigz, Apr 26, 2016.

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  1. rigz

    rigz Member

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    John 3:16 (KJV)
    For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. 17 For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved    .

    I've heard all sorts of arguments about whether the 'world' here means humanity in entirety or just the 'church', the believers who God before the foundation of the earth had Elected/Chosen to save.

    Let's assume 'world' here means the Elect and not everyone. We can say 'for God so loved the Elect......'Now, God's Love for the World is manifested in sending His Son to save them. But we all know very many will not be saved. The Elect are a tiny fraction of humanity.

    Can we conclude that God does not love the non-Elect in that He never gave His only Son for them that they may be saved? He did NOTHING for them remotely related to their salvation yet His Love here is in saving.

    PS
    This question is directed to you who think that somewhere before the foundation of the earth was laid, somewhere in eternity, God elected to save you and not the next guy. If you think God loves the non-Elect in ANY sense, please explain to me how this love is manifested because it clearly is not in the cross
     
    #1 rigz, Apr 26, 2016
  2. Internet Theologian

    Internet Theologian Well-Known Member

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    1 Timothy 4:10, For to this end we toil and strive, because we have our hope set on the living God, who is the Savior of all people, especially of those who believe.
     
    #2 Internet Theologian, Apr 26, 2016
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  3. rigz

    rigz Member

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    This is not helpful for obvious reasons; the same gang will argue that 'all people' is not ALL because not ALL are saved.

    But when you are enlightened enough to perceive salvation offer as available to ALL men yet only partaken of a few, then you have a point
     
    #3 rigz, Apr 26, 2016
  4. Internet Theologian

    Internet Theologian Well-Known Member

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    Hi 'rigz',

    You sound really familiar especially since you've just recently joined and began to go around and give me negative ratings. ;)

    But I digress and am not surprised.

    That said, Christ is Savior of all, but this sense doesn't always mean in Salvation from sins.
     
    #4 Internet Theologian, Apr 26, 2016
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  5. rigz

    rigz Member

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    I received one too many from you and I decided to return favor.

    I don't care for ratings and I find I decidedly funny that grownups do:)
    If you like 'likes' I can 'like' all your posts...can I go ahead and like ALL your 1,753 posts?

    So in what other 'sense' is Christ the savior of hell fodder?
     
    #5 rigz, Apr 26, 2016
  6. Iconoclast

    Iconoclast Well-Known Member
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    "rigz,

    John 3:16 (KJV)
    So...now you present what you believe to be another difficulty.....lets look at it this way.....as john who penned Jn 3:16 looked at it as the elect children scattered worldwide....not The Jew Only.......Jew and Gentile wherever they are in the world, scattered until the gospel draws them in.,Jn11;
    51 And this spake he not of himself: but being high priest that year, he prophesied that Jesus should die for that nation;

    52 And not for that nation only, but that also he should gather together in one the children of God that were scattered abroad.

    .

    Do you believe God loves the elect???
    Here is the flaw in your thinking....you mention the elect...we see they are scattered worldwide[jn11]....now you are trying to claim that Jesus came for the non elect?......make up your mind!Cautious

    If Jesus came for everyone as you would like to suggest.....WHY WOULD ANYONE BE CALLED ELECT?

    That would be redundant....
    So once again....how are non elect persons going to be saved? You jump all around like the troubled sea that cannot rest.

    Really????...does this look like a tiny fraction????

    5 And he brought him forth abroad, and said, Look now toward heaven, and tell the stars, if thou be able to number them: and he said unto him, So shall thy seed be.
    Sure we can....He is good to them mt5:45....but He has not set His saving love on them.

    Yes He did and it was only grace and mercy as none of us deserve it.ThumbsupThumbsupThumbsup
     
    #6 Iconoclast, Apr 26, 2016
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  7. rigz

    rigz Member

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    True but irrelevant
    Not just the elect but EVERYONE and this love is manifested in His attempt to save them

    Jesus came and died for EVERYONE. It is the claim that He only died for a few that is blasphemous. Before you attempt to correct me, try and comprehend what I'm saying. And feel free to ask for clarification



    Simple; because they have believed. The non-elect are the non-believers

    They are many but still fewer than the damned so much that Jesus said it!
    Matthew 7:13-14 (KJV)
    Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat: 14 Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.

    Can you please enumerate this 'non-saving' love God has towards the no -electBiggrinBiggrin

    Specifically, what does it accomplish in the lives of those God has eternally decreed to perish?


    Nobody deserves it I agree
     
    #7 rigz, Apr 27, 2016
  8. Squire Robertsson

    Squire Robertsson Administrator
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    Thread closed. Started by now banned member.
     
    #8 Squire Robertsson, Apr 27, 2016
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