Did God ask Mary if it was ok with her to conceive Jesus?

[steaver]

Thinkingstuff was trying to convince me that God asked Mary if it was ok to place Jesus in her womb. Here is the passage, I see alot of "shalls" but don't see any questions besides Mary's.

"And the angel came in unto her, and said, Hail, [thou that art] highly favoured, the Lord [is] with thee: blessed [art] thou among women.

And when she saw [him], she was troubled at his saying, and cast in her mind what manner of salutation this should be.

And the angel said unto her, Fear not, Mary: for thou hast found favour with God

And, behold, thou shalt conceive in thy womb, and bring forth a son, and shalt call his name JESUS

He shall be great, and shall be called the Son of the Highest: and the Lord God shall give unto him the throne of his father David:

And he shall reign over the house of Jacob for ever; and of his kingdom there shall be no end.

Then said Mary unto the angel, How shall this be, seeing I know not a man?

And the angel answered and said unto her, The Holy Ghost shall come upon thee, and the power of the Highest shall overshadow thee: therefore also that holy thing which shall be born of thee shall be called the Son of God.

And Mary said, Behold the handmaid of the Lord; be it unto me according to thy word. And the angel departed from her.

Luke 1

 

[Tom Butler]

What I don't understand is the basis for even raising the question? Where did that idea come from?

 

[Zenas]

Dealing with this question is sort of like asking if the light goes out when you close the refrigerator door. We can't know the answer any more than we can know what this country would be like if Kennedy had not been shot. However, I do believe Mary could have said No.

 

[Walguy]

God chose someone who He knew would be willing. There was no need to ask permission, just to let her know she had been chosen. How did she feel about it?

"My soul magnifies the Lord, and my spirit rejoices in God my Savior, for he has regarded the low estate of his handmaiden."

Yes, this was a few months later, but it was how God knew she would react. Once she knew God had chosen her, she was 100% in and happy about it. To suggest God needed to ask Mary's permission is to make God not really God.

 

[Amy.G]

The angel said "you SHALL conceive". No she wasn't asked for her permission. But she loved God and was willing because she trusted Him.

 

[convicted1]

The angel said "you SHALL conceive". No she wasn't asked for her permission. But she loved God and was willing because she trusted Him.

Amen, Sissy, amen!! I would tell you to "preach it", but you're a woman, and women can't preach.....:laugh: :love2: :tongue3: :wavey:

 

[Melanie]

God chose someone who He knew would be willing. There was no need to ask permission, just to let her know she had been chosen. How did she feel about it?

"My soul magnifies the Lord, and my spirit rejoices in God my Savior, for he has regarded the low estate of his handmaiden."

Yes, this was a few months later, but it was how God knew she would react. Once she knew God had chosen her, she was 100% in and happy about it. To suggest God needed to ask Mary's permission is to make God not really God.

This is one of those questions that make my head hurt. Mary certainly was asked to be the mother of Jesus, otherwise it would have been a violation of a young woman. However, God knows all and knew therefore the outcome as it had been forseen. Mary of course was chosen before her birth so to speak. It is one of those Moebius loop things to my mind, or a mystery of Faith.


Easier to figure out why the bunny has a pancake on his head.

 

[Crabtownboy]

It is a theoretical question. We really have no way of knowing. Why? Because we do not know everything that took place in Mary's life up to that point. She may have been praying for just what happened. The Jews were looking forward to a savior. Perhaps many young women prayed to be the mother of that savior, in other words ask permission.

 

[Thinkingstuff]

Thinkingstuff was trying to convince me that God asked Mary if it was ok to place Jesus in her womb. Here is the passage, I see alot of "shalls" but don't see any questions besides Mary's.

If you are going to quote me then do so. Don't imply something I haven't said. What I said was by Mary saying "let it be" shows complicity which implies a choice. Note God didn't ask Adam or Eve if it was ok with them if he restricted the tree in the middle of the Garden. Yet they had a choice to obey or not. Mary chose to obey and its clear in her statement "let it be done to me according to your word." Mary could have just easily said "don't do it" However, your implication is no matter what Mary wanted God would impregnate her despite her will. And I asked you how is that different than rape. So next time ensure you accurately site me.

 

[WestminsterMan]

snip...
Easier to figure out why the bunny has a pancake on his head.

I always wondered what that was...

WM

 

[steaver]

However, your implication is no matter what Mary wanted God would impregnate her despite her will.

You scold me for misrepresenting your view and then go ahead and misrepresent mine. What's that called? My call is that Mary wanted to be the Messiah's mother just like thousands of other Jewish women. And God chose her. Saying no wouldn't even have crossed her mind.

God chose Mary. He didn't ask and He didn't present a choice like in the garden of Eden. Read the scripture again and count how many times the Angel says "shall".

 

[Melanie]

I always wondered what that was...

WM

:laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh:

 

[Thinkingstuff]

You scold me for misrepresenting your view and then go ahead and misrepresent mine. What's that called? My call is that Mary wanted to be the Messiah's mother just like thousands of other Jewish women. And God chose her. Saying no wouldn't even have crossed her mind.

God chose Mary. He didn't ask and He didn't present a choice like in the garden of Eden. Read the scripture again and count how many times the Angel says "shall".

You misunderstand the time. Thousands of Jewish women didn't want to be the mother of God's idea of Messiah. They wanted to be mother's of the Next David or Solomon. It is clear by how people kept asking about the kingdom they had in mind rather than what God had in mind. Only Mary was complicit with what God had in mind. And it is clear God wasn't picking from a plethera. Mary was created to have Jesus. And Mary was agreable to it. So yes God chose Mary and gave her the ability to choose as well. Look at the High Priest father of John. Zacharius chose not to believe. Mary believed and then obeyed. Thus she truelly is the second Eve for those apart of the kingdom. And how many times must I remind you that Mary said "let it be". There was a choice.

BTW how did I miss represent your position. According to you God chose Mary and said "I'm going to do this" without consulting her. According to you it was a forgone conclusion Mary would be impregnated no matter what she personally desired. And so the question is how is that different from rape. Or are you suggesting Mary was a Stepford wife a robot who was programmed to do God's bidding. In which case you've completely disavowed her personhood. IE she would no longer be a person but a program that could be discarded after birth.

 

[Crabtownboy]

You misunderstand the time. Thousands of Jewish women didn't want to be the mother of God's idea of Messiah. They wanted to be mother's of the Next David or Solomon. It is clear by how people kept asking about the kingdom they had in mind rather than what God had in mind.

That was the common belief of the day, that the Messiah would be an earthly, political leader. We cannot prove it one way or the other, but I expect that is what Mary believed. We know from several incidents in the NT that even after Jesus had begun his ministry that she did not really understand his mission. Also, we can see from the NT that the disciples did not really understand his mission either. He was forever having to correct them and after his death on the cross they were a defeated group who scattered, probably back to their homes and occupations.

Only Mary was complicit with what God had in mind. And it is clear God wasn't picking from a plethora. Mary was created to have Jesus.

This is a very nice thought and an article of faith ... unprovable either way IMHO.

And Mary was agreeable to it. So yes God chose Mary and gave her the ability to choose as well. Look at the High Priest father of John. Zacharias chose not to believe. Mary believed and then obeyed. Thus she truly is the second Eve for those apart of the kingdom. And how many times must I remind you that Mary said "let it be". There was a choice.

Yes it was her choice.

 

[Thinkingstuff]

That was the common belief of the day, that the Messiah would be an earthly, political leader. We cannot prove it one way or the other, but I expect that is what Mary believed. We know from several incidents in the NT that even after Jesus had begun his ministry that she did not really understand his mission. Also, we can see from the NT that the disciples did not really understand his mission either. He was forever having to correct them and after his death on the cross they were a defeated group who scattered, probably back to their homes and occupations.

Apart from the Wedding at Cana where does scripture show Mary not understanding Jesus' mission. I mean even the wedding at cana can be argued from both perspectives. Please give me your verses so I can ponder them.

This is a very nice thought and an article of faith ... unprovable either way IMHO

You are right its a matter of faith for me based on what I believe about God. Albeit I also have 2,000 years of belief from the Catholic Church I can access.

Yes it was her choice

I agree entirely

 

[steaver]

Apart from the Wedding at Cana where does scripture show Mary not understanding Jesus' mission. I mean even the wedding at cana can be argued from both perspectives. Please give me your verses so I can ponder them.

I remember some years back a movie called "Mary mother of Jesus" (I think that was the title) . It was a pathetic movie depicting Jesus as some sort of ignorant man not knowing or understanding who He was. At the end Jesus worried as to how He would fulfill such a great calling from God, as if He was disconnected from the Father (something totally unbiblical) . Then at the end He said something like this, "I know what I will do, I will teach the people with all the stories my mother taught me growing up". Like I said, pathetic!

The moral to this story is this, be careful what the movies tell you about Jesus. BTW, this movie was sponsored by a Catholic church. Don't know if they produced it or just put up the money, but what a load of trash. Sad.