UnchartedSpirit
New Member
Since we have everything we should know in the Bible, which gives us the chance of focusing back to him when we're tempted...Is it easeir for us to serve God outside of Eden?
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Does The Bible give us an advantage over Adam and Eve?
- Thread starter UnchartedSpirit
- Start date
Rufus_1611
New Member
UnchartedSpirit said:
Adam and Eve received the word of God directly, ours is written down and there's a bit more to it. I would think it would have been easier for Adam and Eve to serve God in Eden prior to their fall however, who among us could be certain we wouldn't be deceived or rebelled against God with that damnable serpent speaking in our ears. We have pretty clear teachings in the Bible today and the serpent is still whispering in folks ears and more often than not they are heading his counsel over God's, so I would say it is neither harder nor easier now than then.
ReformedBaptist
Well-Known Member
UnchartedSpirit said:
I think the answer to your question can be found in Hebrews. "For this man was counted worthy of more glory than Moses, inasmuch as he who hath builded the house hath more honour than the house." Heb 3:3
The New Covenant is more glorious than the Mosaic Covenant, and certainly more glorious than the Covenant which Adam was under.
UnchartedSpirit
New Member
what does the covenant have anything to do with our capibilities towards serving God?
ReformedBaptist
Well-Known Member
UnchartedSpirit said:
Well, there are six covenants mentioned in Scripture, to which are you referring?
UnchartedSpirit
New Member
I don't know any of them or why they're important at all, much less to this topic...that's why I asked....
Easier? I suppose that this is a question that cannot be answered. At least with any assurance of certainly. The garden account does not suggest that they had the same indwelling Spirit as we do as Christians. Even the OT saints did not have the Spirit as we do according to scripture. Jhn 7:39.
However at the same time the original two had no understanding of sin to deal with. They were pure in their created state left with only their own freewill to choose if God could be trusted in what He told them or to decide to follow their own desires. (Pure Freewill). There is no evidence that the Spirit was at work for, in, or through them.
So is it easier to serve God as a Christian? I would say yes because even if we fail we are not cast out as they were. We can serve with confidence without the threat of losing our standing with God even where we fail.
However at the same time the original two had no understanding of sin to deal with. They were pure in their created state left with only their own freewill to choose if God could be trusted in what He told them or to decide to follow their own desires. (Pure Freewill). There is no evidence that the Spirit was at work for, in, or through them.
So is it easier to serve God as a Christian? I would say yes because even if we fail we are not cast out as they were. We can serve with confidence without the threat of losing our standing with God even where we fail.
UnchartedSpirit said:
ReformedBaptist
Well-Known Member
UnchartedSpirit said:
Oh ok brother. I too have not been much taught regarding the covenants, but one thing is for certain, if God has dealt with man at all (and we know He has) He has dealt with them by covenant. Now, like many things there is controversy that surrounds this subject and certainly is not the OP of this thread. Perhaps a separate thread on the subject would be in order. What do you think?
One quote,
"“The doctrine of the covenant lies at the root of all true theology. It has been said that he who well understands the distinction between the covenant of works and the covenant of grace, is a master of divinity. I am persuaded that most of the mistakes which men make concerning the doctrines of Scripture, are based upon fundamental errors with regard to the covenant of law and of grace. May God grant us now the power to instruct, and you the grace to receive instruction on this vital subject.” C.H. Spurgeon
Does the bible give us an advantage over Adam and Eve?
No. We all disobey God's direct word.
We are human, which means we are sinners. The bible shows over and over and over again how God has communicated His will to us thru varies and sundry means (direct verbal communication, visions, prophecies, creation, Jesus, the written and inspired scriptures).... doesn't matter how He does it, we still disobey.
The real advantage is that God loves us and sent His Son to die for us, even though we didn't deserve it.
No. We all disobey God's direct word.
We are human, which means we are sinners. The bible shows over and over and over again how God has communicated His will to us thru varies and sundry means (direct verbal communication, visions, prophecies, creation, Jesus, the written and inspired scriptures).... doesn't matter how He does it, we still disobey.
The real advantage is that God loves us and sent His Son to die for us, even though we didn't deserve it.
Dewey Sturgell
New Member
Dear Reformed Baptist,you say that it is easier under the Grace Cov Please dont take this the wrong way, But our Brothers under the Grace cov. tells us to flee sin and warns us of its tempting powers: for me I find it like walking on thin ice which at any time I or others could fall, (For the spirit is willing but the flesh is weak ), Also the Preacher in ecc, tells us that all is vanity and vexing to the spirit, So Brother with love I ask how does one complete such an act of easiness, for I would like the secret for myself, I realize that you imply that its easier than the old testament but we only read about thier trouble, which in alot of the cases that I have read dont seem to be easy for the never had the spirit ,also thier punishments in alot of cases were very server But under the Grace cov God shows alot more mercy to usward than those of old, maybe im taking your statements wrong myself so please forgive if im impossing may the direct you to his loving Grace,amen PS iN regard to the question I see that we are flesh like those of the days of old which give me the impresson the we have it like the did living under the FLESH, which does'nt seem to be any easier but the same for we obtain more mercy than them of old, I love all the brothern in Christ peace and mercy be with you .amen
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JustChristian
New Member
ReformedBaptist said:
"This Man" was Jesus Christ. Of course he was counted of more glory than Moses. Is anyone more glorious than the Lord? This says nothing about one covenant versus another.
UnchartedSpirit
New Member
Let me put it this way....are me less prone to follow our own genetic/neruraloligical tendancies instead of God's than Adam and Eve were thanks to our more prolonged attention span to Him thanks to the Bible? Now does that question involve any stupid covenant anywhere?
ReformedBaptist
Well-Known Member
BaptistBeliever said:
I assumed most understood that the entire book of Hebrews is about setting the New Covenant over and above the Old. Without Christ there is no New Covenant. Sadly, many of do not understand God's covenants.
ReformedBaptist
Well-Known Member
UnchartedSpirit said:
Shame on you for blasphming the covenant of God.
ReformedBaptist
Well-Known Member
Dewey Sturgell said:
Where did I use the word easy? First, I think the OP question is odd. Second, God works with man by covenant. The New Covenant is more glorious than the old, as Hebrews is about, and certainly more glorious than the Adamic covenant.
But all this misunderstanding is understandable. Most of us have been spoon fed dispensationalism.
Dewey Sturgell
New Member
Now that was very funny ha ha ha ha ,you are so right you never wrote that it was easier my bad Brother please forgive, but some have been feed dispensationist of the Grace cov but for myself I have been feed eternalism, for all thinks that I see are from the predestinated side of thinks which comes as a higher standard, may the lord bless you brother, amen.ReformedBaptist said:
UnchartedSpirit
New Member
Lisetn I'm sorry but all this argumenting over the covenants and isms has nothing to do with my question and should be taken elsewhere. Many of the Hebrew covenants don't apply to us anyway except the universal ones such as the Ten Commandments...etc. I asked weither it was easier to know God through personal expierence which is all Adam and Eve had or through then Written word. I forgot that we have both actually....but I'd assume it'd be harder though just the word now anyway....that's how the Hebrews had it after Adam and Eve. Thank God though the scenario is repeted throgh Jesus who teaches to us from the word and gave us both ways of Knowing God!
JustChristian
New Member
ReformedBaptist said:
I don't think you understood my comment at all. Besides, this scripture says That Christ was more glorious than Moses. Where does it say that one covenant is more glorious than another?
ReformedBaptist
Well-Known Member
BaptistBeliever said:
Perhaps a more suitable word than glorious should be "better." I see Moses and Christ and representatives of their respective Covenants. The New Covenant is better than the old, and therefore more glorious. But the Scripture calls it a "better" covenant.
"But now hath he obtained a more excellent ministry, by how much also he is the mediator of a better covenant, which was established upon better promises." Heb 8:6
So "better" would be a more appropriate word than glorious.
Hebrews 8 applies Jeremiah 31 to the New Covenant in Christ (which the dispensationlists deny).