Earthly Messianic Kingdom

This is I believe what would be referred to by dispensationalists like myself as hyper-dispensationalism. Jesus Christ came to do exactly what He did. The idea that God is finished with the Jews and has replaced them with the Church is rather far-fetched. It is true that there is no apparent prophetic indication of a church-age in the old testament, but that doesn't mean that God has somehow had to rethink His strategy. Most dispensationalists see that Israel is still going to be central to God's plan in the end times, and I'm sure that God knew it before the foundation of the world. The church is not the kingdom, the kingdom is still to come.

 

There are surely passages that teach a pre-trib removal of the church, but they are ignored because they teach a conditional rapture. We like to believe that God got mad at Israel for not keeping His commandments, so He took all their goodies away and gave them to us without any warnings whatsoever. So your right, there is no verse that says Jesus offered them the kingdom when He came the first time, it isn't so. He came to die for the sins of the world, of course.

Any time Jesus was questioned about the kingdom, He did not correct the idea that He was going to reign on the earth, just the idea that He was going to reign then.

John 18:36 Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world: if my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight, that I should not be delivered to the Jews: but now is my kingdom not from hence.

Acts 1
6 When they therefore were come together, they asked of him, saying, Lord, wilt thou at this time restore again the kingdom to Israel?
7 And he said unto them, It is not for you to know the times or the seasons, which the Father hath put in his own power.

But they were assuredly promised an earthly kingdom:
Psalm 132:11 The LORD hath sworn in truth unto David; he will not turn from it; Of the fruit of thy body will I set upon thy throne.

Who is referred to by thy? Why David, of course. Where is David's throne? It is in Jerusalem.

Jer 23:5 Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will raise unto David a righteous Branch, and a King shall reign and prosper, and shall execute judgment and justice in the earth.

Rev 5:10 And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth.

 

Apparently you just ignored the rest of His words. He said now is my kingdom not from hence. What does this mean? Is this Jesus admitting that He was going to set up an earthly kingdom, but since the Jews rejected him, now it is going to be a spiritual kingdom? Or is it not yet time for His earthly kingdom now?

 

So you don't know what now means in that verse? Your implying that Jesus came to set up His kingdom. I'm saying He came to die on a cross and preach the coming kingdom. Which is it?

 

To dispensationalists: Please define what 'kingdom of God/heaven' means?

In Christ
Rev. 22:20 -Amen!

 

The OT is replete with references to an earthly kingdom. In fact, it is the only kind of kingdom that existed and the kind of kingdom that was prophesied. The kingdom of God/heaven is the rule of Christ on this earth.

Before continuing this discussion, you need to read Alva J. McClain, The Greatness of the Kingdom. It will answer most of hte questions that are being asked here.

 

Pastor Larry,

You saying, OT metioned about earthly kingdom.

How about Daniel chapter 4 and 7 mentioned, kingdom, do these saying, it will be last for a thousand years?

In Christ
Rev. 22:20 -Amen!

 

You do really need a clarify verse to support your comment.

In Christ
Rev. 22:20 -Amen!

 

To follow this line of reasoning you would have to assume that all children of Abraham were of the promise. It is in the New Testament that we get the clarification about the children of the promise being by faith, not birth.

 

Guess: //The Church is often referred to as the ‘mystery parenthesis’ form of the Kingdom; mystery in that there is no prophecy in the Old Testament regarding the Church and parenthesis in that God found it necessary to interrupt His program for the Jews because their leaders rejected Jesus Christ as the Messiah and He was unable to establish the Messianic kingdom.//

Reality: 1 Peter 1:20 (KJV1611 Edition):

Who verily was foreordeined
before the foundation of the world,
but was manifest in these last times for you.

Christ's sacrifice for the Church was determined
by God before the foundation of the world,.
By contrast, God's promises for Israel, that only
comes from the foundation of the world.
The Israel parenthesis is in the Church Plan!

Heb 4:3 (KJV1611):
For we which haue beleeued do enter into rest, as hee said, As I haue sworne in my wrath, if they shall enter into my rest, although the works were finished from the foundation of the world.

Heb 9:26 (KJV1611):
For then must hee often haue suffered since the foundation of the world: but now once in the end of the world, hath he appeared to put away sinne by the sacrifice of himselfe.

 

These are bad questions. There is no need to answer
them. Thier answer, if known, would not edify
anybody.

Anyway, i had an answer i've been working on
all week. Maybe next week i'll have an
answer.

All: remember it is lots easier to ask
bad questions than to find good answers.

Here is ed's good question of the day:

Are you ready for the pretribulation week raptute/resurrection?

 

You willing
to let "Lucifer" go with it?

 

Nobody had any meaningful comments.
We can assume i spake God's truth here, eh?