Elopement--Is it a sin?

[ktn4eg]

A similar thread on parental approval or disapproval of potential marriage partners for their offspring led me to bring up the question of whether or not elopement of a Christian couple of legal age is something that God would endorse.

Is such a thing as elopement a violation of Ex. 20:12 ("Honor thy father and thy mother..."), which is also re-affirmed in Eph. 6:1-3?

 

[annsni]

I know couples who have had the blessing of both parents who eloped. Why would that be a sin?

 

[agedman]

A similar thread on parental approval or disapproval of potential marriage partners for their offspring led me to bring up the question of whether or not elopement of a Christian couple of legal age is something that God would endorse.

Is such a thing as elopement a violation of Ex. 20:12 ("Honor thy father and thy mother..."), which is also re-affirmed in Eph. 6:1-3?

After funding a rather expensive wedding, I have heard more than one parent say they wished they had opted for elopement and saved the money for something that lasted longer and could be divided in the divorce.

 

[preachinjesus]

So long as they've considered the realities of marriage and taken time to receive appropriate counsel, no eloping isn't a sin.

I also don't buy this notion that adult children are beholden to their parents' blessings. But that's another conversation.

 

[padredurand]

So long as they've considered the realities of marriage and taken time to receive appropriate counsel, no eloping isn't a sin.

I also don't buy this notion that adult children are beholden to their parents' blessings. But that's another conversation.

I was at my first duty station at Ft Carson CO. My wife was in her last semester of college. We had discussed marriage with both sets of parents before I left for basic training with no apparent objections.

My parents insisted on a summer wedding at their church with their pastor officiating. My folks were so poor the mice moved out but the demanded we get married under their terms. Momma had a list of almost 200 folks and the rationale why each of them should be invited.

Her parents insisted on a winter wedding so we wouldn't interrupt their vacation plans, at the church her father pastored, with him officiating. They were talking about footing the bill for a cake reception at the church hall. The in-laws had a list of almost 300 people if they only invited kin.

As time went on each side became more deeply entrenched that their way was the one that would prevail. In the middle of it nobody bothered to ask us what we expected or wanted.

On December 12 madre flew into Colorado Springs, spent the night in a motel and met me the next morning at the El Paso County clerk's office. We took the city bus to the 2d Brigade Chapel on base and were married by CPT John "the Baptist" Riggs. In a little more than a week it will be our 34th anniversary.

Parents don't always have God's will in mind when their kids decide to marry. Both madre and I have (had) godly parents. They provided wise counsel over the years on many subjects. In our case the idea that Helen's boy and Ray's daughter wanted to spend the rest of their lives together turn them into irrational people.

madre is the oldest of six kids. The younger five did not want to follow the error of the eldest so they had the fancy weddings, blow out receptions and storybook honeymoons. They are all divorced.

I am the youngest of four following the others into the world of the wedded. I am the only one married to the original.

We meant what we said for better, for worse; richer or poorer; in sickness and in health 'til death do us part. We believed then as we do now that our marriage was for two hearts to become one to serve the Lord. I believe that being true to our vows is more honoring to a parent than acquiescing just to keep the peace.

madre and I renewed our vows on our 25th anniversary. With the parents watching, our children stood with us and my FIL got to say the words over us.

 

[Sapper Woody]

So long as they've considered the realities of marriage and taken time to receive appropriate counsel, no eloping isn't a sin.

I also don't buy this notion that adult children are beholden to their parents' blessings. But that's another conversation.

I agree. When I got married in an actual ceremony, my MIL was literally scowling in pictures, because she hated me so much. We've mended our relationship since then. But at the time she did not want us to get married.

 

[Alcott]

"Elope?" That's a word we don't hear much any more. All too obvious, most young couples don't bother to go through any formalities if they want to 'get together.' I don't know how true the old image was of the couple waking up a preacher or JP in the middle of the night, and with his wife in curlers as the witness, they get married just before one or both fathers (or parents) show up, often with a shotgun. I think one of the The Walton girls started on that route, but didn't go through with it when she saw how "ugly" the whole setup was.

Great story, padredurand!

 

[OldRegular]

Expensive church weddings do not a marriage make. I suppose they are OK for redistributing the wealth!

 

[SaggyWoman]

I don't think it is a sin.

 

[Judith]

A similar thread on parental approval or disapproval of potential marriage partners for their offspring led me to bring up the question of whether or not elopement of a Christian couple of legal age is something that God would endorse.

Is such a thing as elopement a violation of Ex. 20:12 ("Honor thy father and thy mother..."), which is also re-affirmed in Eph. 6:1-3?

It would depend on how the parents felt about it. If they felt dishonored then they dishonored them and that would be sin. From a strictly economically standpoint it would be a blessing for the parents but not everyone sees it that way.

 

[kyredneck]

....I suppose they are OK for redistributing the wealth!

:thumbsup::laugh: The wisdom of OR!

 

[Squire Robertsson]

My maternal grandfather offered my dad 50 per cent of the wedding cost if the two would go to the county clerk's office.

 

[righteousdude2]

Agreed!

I know couples who have had the blessing of both parents who eloped. Why would that be a sin?

I guess it [eloping] depends upon if you are the one eloping, or the ones eloped upon! :laugh:

In a strict Christian atmosphere, I can see it being a sin, but it is one of those questionable, grey areas, sins! Something like the thousands of Jewish laws to keep the Ten, and if on Sabbath, your only cow feel into a ditch and was about to drown, would it be a sin to break Sabbath and save it?

Besides, what we do in Vegas, is supposed to stay in Vegas! :thumbs:

 

[agedman]

Is there any Scriptures or example in Scriptures showing elopement is righteous and parent honoring?

 

[sag38]

The scripture says that a man shall leave his parents. It does not say that he has to leave with their permission or their blessing. I would assume this also applies to the woman as well. According to Judith's interpretation one's parents have charge child until the parents die. By his reasoning seeking a parent's blessing would include marriage, in purchasing a home, what to major to seek in college, career choice, brand of vehicle, etc. When I moved from Alabama to Georgia my mom was very upset. She did not want me, my wife, and her grandson to move away. I did not have her true blessing. According to Judith I was sinning by moving even though I was 35 years old.

 

[agedman]

The scripture says that a man shall leave his parents. It does not say that he has to leave with their permission or their blessing. I would assume this also applies to the woman as well. According to Judith's interpretation one's parents have charge child until the parents die. By his reasoning seeking a parent's blessing would include marriage, in purchasing a home, what to major to seek in college, career choice, brand of vehicle, etc. When I moved from Alabama to Georgia my mom was very upset. She did not want me, my wife, and her grandson to move away. I did not have her true blessing. According to Judith I was sinning by moving even though I was 35 years old.

I can't speak for Judith, but I don't read that in the post she made on this thread.

I will say this as far as parental authority.

Wife authority is toward and support of the husband - not her parents.

Husbands are to leave the parents and cleave to the wife.

The parents may not like, may give advice (desired or not), perhaps offer support (even financial, physical) or not, but at no time is a parent the authority over the son when that son has "cleaved." I would suggest that perhaps the relationship change even extends to the business structure in some measure, too.

Upon marriage, the relationship of a father and son business perhaps should be considered as a true partnership and no longer as that of an owner and son.

Too often, young folks are all to in a hurry to cleave and ignore the leave.

The husband and wife are a team in which the membership does not include parents.

 

[Aaron]

Marriage is not about the couple only. It is about everyone.

How does this union honor my father and my mother?

How am I loving my neighbor as myself through this union?
​

If impartial, selfless and uncontrived answers can be given to the questions, above, then one is probably doing the right thing.

If one feels he has to sneak around to "get the woman he loves," then most likely, he is doing the wrong thing.

 

[thisnumbersdisconnected]

Marriage is not about the couple only. It is about everyone.

???

How do you balance that with ...

Genesis 2, NASB
23 The man said, "This is now bone of my bones,
And flesh of my flesh;
She shall be called Woman,
Because she was taken out of Man."
24 For this reason a man shall leave his father and his mother, and be joined to his wife; and they shall become one flesh.​

How does this union honor my father and my mother?

Does this include the overly protective parent whose adult child has outgrown the need for their constant (and unwanted) intrusion into their lives?

How am I loving my neighbor as myself through this union?

What business of your neighbor is it?

If impartial, selfless and uncontrived answers can be given to the questions, above, then one is probably doing the right thing.

An overly simplified view, I'm afraid.

If one feels he has to sneak around to "get the woman he loves," then most likely, he is doing the wrong thing.

And if he has one of those overly protective parents who thinks that, even though he is an adult, they can plan his life, intrude on his probably-God-given directives, and meddle in things that are none of their business?

I've seen many examples of this kind of parent. Most of their adult children are addicts who had to come to me for treatment. Fortunately, I had good, godly parents who gave me an example that I could share -- still do share -- with my clients.

 

[Aaron]

???

How do you balance that with ...

Genesis 2, NASB
23 The man said, "This is now bone of my bones,
And flesh of my flesh;
She shall be called Woman,
Because she was taken out of Man."
24 For this reason a man shall leave his father and his mother, and be joined to his wife; and they shall become one flesh.
​

​

Your question is, how does one balance it with your misunderstanding. There is no balancing act needed otherwise. What does it mean to "leave?" Does it mean dishonor?

But marriage is about society. It is the basic institution of government, and the institution through which new members of society enter. Those new members are the glory (or should be) of your parents. So, "leaving," doesn't mean you are disconnected from them, or that you are free to dishonor them.

(I'm simply alluding to some very straightforward, scriptural maxims and assuming you're literate enough to recognize them, but if asked, I can cite the references.)

Does this include the overly protective parent whose adult child has outgrown the need for their constant (and unwanted) intrusion into their lives?

Your little interpersonal conflicts are irrelevant to the discussion. The Commandment stands, you are responsible to obey it. So, the question is, how does your union honor your parents?

What business of your neighbor is it?

Again, the commandment is to love your neighbor as yourself. So if there is no thought at all for the good of your neighbor in a union for which you will demand of him to respect and honor and defend, you may be entering in too lightly and unadvisedly.

An overly simplified view, I'm afraid.

In other words, you don't know how to answer the question.

 

[thisnumbersdisconnected]

[/INDENT]Your question is, how does one balance it with your misunderstanding. There is no balancing act needed otherwise. What does it mean to "leave?" Does it mean dishonor?

No. The word in the Hebrew is 'azab and it means to abandon, forsake, loose, depart from, and (of course), leave. In other words, while not forsaking them to the point of neglect, nonetheless leaving behind their cares, concerns, worries and yes, directives, for living his own life.

But marriage is about society. It is the basic institution of government, and the institution through which new members of society enter. Those new members are the glory (or should be) of your parents. So, "leaving," doesn't mean you are disconnected from them, or that you are free to dishonor them.

It is no dishonor to cut the apron strings and no longer expect them -- or allow them -- to govern your life.

(I'm simply alluding to some very straightforward, scriptural maxims and assuming you're literate enough to recognize them, but if asked, I can cite the references.)

Woke up on the wrong side of bed again, I see.

Your little interpersonal conflicts are irrelevant to the discussion. The Commandment stands, you are responsible to obey it. So, the question is, how does your union honor your parents?

The question is, if God has put together a man and a woman in marriage, what business of his (or her) parents is it that they disapprove? If truly guided by the Spirit, without dishonoring them, the couple should marry anyway, if they are of legal age to do so. If every wedding was canceled whereby one set of parents or the other disapproved of the prospective spouse, there would be darn few weddings. That includes some very godly, Christian couples who would not have been wed.

Again, the commandment is to love your neighbor as yourself. So if there is no thought at all for the good of your neighbor in a union for which you will demand of him to respect and honor and defend, you may be entering in too lightly and unadvisedly.

Ridiculous. While my parents have the right of input, it is none of my neighbor's business.

In other words, you don't know how to answer the question.

It wasn't a question. It was an overly simplified statement to an effect that can be boiled down to "if it feels good, do it." Wrong answer.