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Eschatology...what's your view?
- Thread starter Dustin
- Start date
Joseph_Botwinick
<img src=/532.jpg>Banned
Partial Preterist.
Ed Edwards
<img src=/Ed.gif>
Full Pretrib
Joseph_Botwinick
<img src=/532.jpg>Banned
Haven't been there in a while. I am gonna have to check in again and see what is happening.
Joseph Botiwnick
Joseph Botiwnick
Ed Edwards
<img src=/Ed.gif>
Pretrib pre-mill outline of time forward:
0. church age continues <== you are here!
1. rapture/resurrection event
2. Tribulation time
3. Second Advent of Jesus event
4. literal MK=millennial kingdom
5. new heaven & new earth
The time line according to Matthew 24
(Mount Olivet Discourse, also Matthew 25,
Mark 13, Luke 21):
0. church age continues <== you are here!
Matthew 24:4-15
1. rapture/resurrection event
Matthew 24:31-44
2. Tribulation time
Matthew 24:21-28
3. Second Advent of Jesus event
Matthew 24:29-30)
Not mentioned in Matthew 24:
(4. literal MK=millennial kingdom)
(5. new heaven & new earth)
The time line according to Revelation:
0. church age continues - Rev 2-3 <== you are here!
1. rapture/resurrection event - Rev 4:1 (type)
2. Tribulation time - Rev 4:2-19:10
3. Second Advent of Jesus event - Rev 19:11-21
4. literal MK=millennial kingdom - Rev 20:1-6
5. new heaven & new earth - Rev 20:7-22:5
The time line according to 2 Thessalonians 2:
0. church age continues <== you are here!
(implied, until the falling away)
1. rapture/resurrection
v.1 - gathering together unto him
v.3 - falling away
2. Tribulation time
(time of the man of sin)
3. Second Advent of Jesus event
v.1 - coming of our Lord Jesus Christ
v.8
Not mentioned:
(4. literal MK=millennial kingdom)
(5. new heaven & new earth)
BTW, I believed in the pre-tribulation rapture/resurrection
before i saw these three scriptures as pretrib.
So even if you can prove all three of these scriptures
in error, I'll still hope in the pre-tribulation rapture
as will 80% of Baptists and 60% of kindred Christians.
0. church age continues <== you are here!
1. rapture/resurrection event
2. Tribulation time
3. Second Advent of Jesus event
4. literal MK=millennial kingdom
5. new heaven & new earth
The time line according to Matthew 24
(Mount Olivet Discourse, also Matthew 25,
Mark 13, Luke 21):
0. church age continues <== you are here!
Matthew 24:4-15
1. rapture/resurrection event
Matthew 24:31-44
2. Tribulation time
Matthew 24:21-28
3. Second Advent of Jesus event
Matthew 24:29-30)
Not mentioned in Matthew 24:
(4. literal MK=millennial kingdom)
(5. new heaven & new earth)
The time line according to Revelation:
0. church age continues - Rev 2-3 <== you are here!
1. rapture/resurrection event - Rev 4:1 (type)
2. Tribulation time - Rev 4:2-19:10
3. Second Advent of Jesus event - Rev 19:11-21
4. literal MK=millennial kingdom - Rev 20:1-6
5. new heaven & new earth - Rev 20:7-22:5
The time line according to 2 Thessalonians 2:
0. church age continues <== you are here!
(implied, until the falling away)
1. rapture/resurrection
v.1 - gathering together unto him
v.3 - falling away
2. Tribulation time
(time of the man of sin)
3. Second Advent of Jesus event
v.1 - coming of our Lord Jesus Christ
v.8
Not mentioned:
(4. literal MK=millennial kingdom)
(5. new heaven & new earth)
BTW, I believed in the pre-tribulation rapture/resurrection
before i saw these three scriptures as pretrib.
So even if you can prove all three of these scriptures
in error, I'll still hope in the pre-tribulation rapture
as will 80% of Baptists and 60% of kindred Christians.
BobRyan
Well-Known Member
Dustin said:
Premill, Post Trib, literal 2nd coming, real millennium,
"First resurrection" of Rev 20:4 of the "blessed and holy" is in fact the "resurrection of the dead in Christ" ALSO seen by Paul in 1Thess4.
At the 2nd coming Christ raptures the church up in the air - to heaven to be with him WHERE He is -- in His Father's house- IN that place He has gone to prepare for us.
In Christ,
Bob
BobRyan
Well-Known Member
Peter tells us that the entire NT is focused on the singular event of the benefits of Christ's appearing.
1Pet 1[/b]
13 Therefore, prepare your minds for action, keep sober in spirit, fix your hope completely on the grace to be brought to you at the revelation of Jesus Christ. [/quote]
Matthew shows us how Christ lays out the timeline - perfectly to that singular event that the entire NT church focused on.
The time line according to Matthew 24
1. church age continues <== you are here! Matthew 24:4-15
2. Tribulation time Matthew 24:21-28
3. Second Advent of Jesus event Matthew 24:29-30)
4. rapture/resurrection event Matthew 24:31-44, Rev 20:4-5
5. Millennium - Rev 20:5-end
John Describes that central focus of the entire NT church in great detail in Rev 19-20 telling us that the "FIRST resurrection is the resurrection of the saints - the dead in Christ - the "Holy and Blessed" over whom the second death has no power.
Paul describes the central focus of the entire NT church in 1Thess 4 - telling the church to "Comfort one another with these words" as all the church is looking for that day when we will be rapture up to heaven - to the place "Christ has prepared for us" when the "DEAD in Christ" will be raised and all will finally be united and WITH Christ for ever. Reigning with Him in that place WHERE He has gone to prepare a place for us. His Father's house!
None of them describe a "Separated group of saints" in heaven while Christ rules a wicked and rebellious earth for 1000 years below.
In Christ,
Bob
1Pet 1[/b]
13 Therefore, prepare your minds for action, keep sober in spirit, fix your hope completely on the grace to be brought to you at the revelation of Jesus Christ. [/quote]
Matthew shows us how Christ lays out the timeline - perfectly to that singular event that the entire NT church focused on.
The time line according to Matthew 24
1. church age continues <== you are here! Matthew 24:4-15
2. Tribulation time Matthew 24:21-28
3. Second Advent of Jesus event Matthew 24:29-30)
4. rapture/resurrection event Matthew 24:31-44, Rev 20:4-5
5. Millennium - Rev 20:5-end
John Describes that central focus of the entire NT church in great detail in Rev 19-20 telling us that the "FIRST resurrection is the resurrection of the saints - the dead in Christ - the "Holy and Blessed" over whom the second death has no power.
Paul describes the central focus of the entire NT church in 1Thess 4 - telling the church to "Comfort one another with these words" as all the church is looking for that day when we will be rapture up to heaven - to the place "Christ has prepared for us" when the "DEAD in Christ" will be raised and all will finally be united and WITH Christ for ever. Reigning with Him in that place WHERE He has gone to prepare a place for us. His Father's house!
None of them describe a "Separated group of saints" in heaven while Christ rules a wicked and rebellious earth for 1000 years below.
In Christ,
Bob
Ed Edwards
<img src=/Ed.gif>
Ed Edwards
<img src=/Ed.gif>
Mel Miller: //None of them describe a "Separated group
of saints" in heaven while Christ rules a wicked and rebellious
earth for 1000 years below.//
Yes, you blew away a strawman that nobody uses.
But you blew it away so well
of saints" in heaven while Christ rules a wicked and rebellious
earth for 1000 years below.//
Yes, you blew away a strawman that nobody uses.
But you blew it away so well
Ed Edwards
<img src=/Ed.gif>
Dustin said:
Yes, so I wrote this up several years ago.
-------------------------------------------------
The correct eschatology: pretribulation rapture,
pre-millinnial Second Advent of Jesus (physical Millinnial
Kingdom) Futurist, is insperatable from the other Major
Doctrines. No Major doctrine is complete without the
pretirublation rapture/resurrection.
Recall these are the Major Doctrines:
Bibliology - The Study of the Bible
Theology - The Study of God the Father
Christology - The Study of God the Son
Pneumatology - The Study of God the Holy Spirit
Anthropology - The Study of Man
Hamartiology - The Study of Sin
Soteriology - The Study of Salvation
Ecclesiology - The Study of the Church
Angelology - The Study of Angels (& devils)
Eschatology - The Study of Last Things
Eschatology is interwoven with the other Doctrines
of the Bible. Obviously i spend all my time making
a living* and supporting the Pretribulation rapture/resurrection
eschatology on the internet, else i would write a book showing
how these great doctrines taught in the Bible all lead ONLY
to the correct Eschatology: pretrib, pre-mill, and futuristic.
(Well, till the Lord comes to glorify us at the pretribualtion
rapture/resurrection - Then the whole Gentile Church will be
Full Preterists
)*I've retired since I wrote this.
BobRyan
Well-Known Member
In my understanding of escatology - the "sequence" that we find in Matt 24 -- is exactly correct.
The "sequence" that we see in Rev 19 through 22 is exactly correct.
The "1000 years" we see in Rev 20 is real, literal and starts exactly where it says it does after the events of Rev 19 and after the "First Resurrection" - just as the 2nd coming is real and future to john's day so also the events of Rev 19 that describe the second coming and Rev 20 the 1000 years and the great white throne judgment.
But for everybody else here - they claim that the sequence in Matt 24, Rev 19-through-22, etc is all wrong. And some claim that the 1000 years coming after Rev 19 is all wrong and is not really a 1000 years.
Now without going too far into the details -- how do you get to the point of "it is all wrong as stated in scripture" and accept that - over just saying "nope - the sequence we find IN Matt 24 is exactly correct, the sequence given in Rev 19-through-22 is exactly correct" etc?
Seems like the "it is exactly correct" would have been the first choice.
Surely you must admit - that if you had never heard of any other way to turn it -- just picking up the text and reading it - you would at least START by saying "The sequence is exactly correct"
What say you?
In Christ,
Bob
The "sequence" that we see in Rev 19 through 22 is exactly correct.
The "1000 years" we see in Rev 20 is real, literal and starts exactly where it says it does after the events of Rev 19 and after the "First Resurrection" - just as the 2nd coming is real and future to john's day so also the events of Rev 19 that describe the second coming and Rev 20 the 1000 years and the great white throne judgment.
But for everybody else here - they claim that the sequence in Matt 24, Rev 19-through-22, etc is all wrong. And some claim that the 1000 years coming after Rev 19 is all wrong and is not really a 1000 years.
Now without going too far into the details -- how do you get to the point of "it is all wrong as stated in scripture" and accept that - over just saying "nope - the sequence we find IN Matt 24 is exactly correct, the sequence given in Rev 19-through-22 is exactly correct" etc?
Seems like the "it is exactly correct" would have been the first choice.
Surely you must admit - that if you had never heard of any other way to turn it -- just picking up the text and reading it - you would at least START by saying "The sequence is exactly correct"
What say you?
In Christ,
Bob
tragic_pizza
New Member
What LeBuick said.LeBuick said:
tragic_pizza
New Member
Unless it isn't.Ed Edwards said:
Full-preterist, a lonely place to be in Baptist circles.