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FBF: Homosexual Clergy and Churches? ABOMINATION!

Discussion in '2003 Archive' started by I Am Blessed 24, Apr 14, 2003.

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  1. I Am Blessed 24

    I Am Blessed 24 Active Member

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    (I am posting this here because, sadly, some IFB churches are falling into this evil trap.)

    Leviticus 18:22, 20:13, Romans 1:18-32, 1 Corinthians 6:9-11

    The ABOMINATION of "homosexual" clergy and churches.

    Over the past 43 months of Liveprayer, I have refused to fall into the traps that so many
    national ministries have fallen into, and that is simply bashing those who have CHOSEN homosexuality as their sexual preference to incite the faithful and generate dollars.

    I have clearly stated in many past Devotionals that homosexuality is a sin, and that FACT is not even debatable. But today I MUST speak out on "churches" that support this sexual choice, and ANY denomination or ministerial organization that would even consider having someone who has
    chosen this as their sexual preference to be ordained into their fellowship.

    Let me say right up front, that the Bible clearly teaches there is NO division of sin. Sin is sin in God's eyes. THE BIBLE TEACHES THAT TO GOD,
    ALL SIN IS EQUAL. Those who commit the sin of homosexuality commit a sin no greater, and no less, than someone who chooses to commit the sin of gossiping. Sin is a choice!

    The two greatest lies the pro-homosexual
    community has put out are that
    1) homosexuality is something that you are "born with"
    2) 10% or more in our society are homosexual.

    First, modern science has CLEARLY rejected and been unable to prove that ANYONE is "born gay". IT IS A CHOICE!!!! PEOPLE CHOOSE TO ENGAGE
    IN HOMOSEXUAL BEHAVIOR!!!! LIKE ALL SIN, ONCE YOU DO IT LONG ENOUGH, IT MAY SEEM 'NATURAL', BUT IT IS STILL A CHOICE THAT YOU MAKE.

    Also, all legitimate studies done by the non-homosexual community clearly show that less then 1% of the population EVER engage in this type of
    sexual choice.

    To have a "church" that accepts this sinful choice, to have a ministerial body that accepts people as clergy who make this choice, you MUST reject the inspiration and inerrancy of God's Word. There is no difference in having a
    "church" that accepts those who make the choice to engage in homosexual behavior, as a "church" that would accept those who make the choice to commit adultery. How popular would THAT church be!!!

    To have an institution represent God, to have people represent God, who have clearly REJECTED God, is an ABOMINATION!!! It makes me sick every time that I hear of a "church" that accepts
    homosexuality as an acceptable sexual choice, and even more sick when I hear of a denomination
    or ministerial organizations that accepts people who choose to engage in this type of sinful sexual behavior to be in spiritual leadership.

    Sadly, the voice of sin in our culture has almost an unlimited national platform in which to try and get people to accept that their view is
    correct. The Bible is our ultimate authority in ALL matters. The Bible clearly says that God condemns the choice of homosexual behavior as sin, and an abomination. You either believe God, or reject God. The choice is that simple.

    Can those who choose to engage in this behavior go to Heaven? Of course!!! Just like those who chose to commit murder, those who choose to commit
    adultery, those who choose to engage in ANY sin can go to Heaven.

    It is your faith in Jesus Christ that saves you. But IF you choose Jesus as your Savior, it is hard to believe that you can engage in continual sinful activity. It is hard to believe that you can blatantly sin against the God that you proclaim to love.

    While your faith in Christ may save you
    eternally, your rebellion against God will make you an instrument that God can never use to reach others for the Kingdom, and you will go through this life without knowing the true joy, the true peace, the real abundance that this life can offer when you are living in accordance with God's word.

    Churches that tell people it is OK to engage in habitual sinful activity like homosexuality are an abomination to God. To have any denomination or ministerial organization accept those into the ministry who are living a life of blatant rebellion to God makes a mockery of the ministry. You can't cut out the parts of the Bible that you
    don't like. Once you start down that road, you have made yourself God.

    However, we live in a free society. If people who have chosen to engage in homosexual activity want to have their own church, they have every right to. Just like those who worship satan can have their own church.

    As those who follow Christ, we have a responsibility to pray for them, for God to open
    their hearts to the truth of His Word, and to turn from their sin. Only God can change hearts, and for those who are in bondage to the sin of
    homosexuality we must pray for them to open their hearts and turn from their sin.

    Until Jesus returns, we will always have those who choose a perverted form of sex with those of their own gender, just like we will always have
    those who choose to pervert sex by having it outside of the bonds of marriage. While we can never accept their choice since it is clearly against God's Word, we must pray for them, just like we must pray for everyone who is battling any sin in their life.

    For those reading this who are currently fighting homosexuality, let me tell you that God has never stopped loving you, and is simply waiting for you to turn from your sin and come back to Him.

    We serve a God of deliverance from sin, a God of forgiveness, and a God of restoration. Millions have turned from the sin of homosexuality and found complete restoration and fulfillment in
    living a life according to God's plan. What He did for someone else, He can do for you!

    I pray today that you hear these words, and choose to find freedom from your sin today. That freedom is only a prayer away!

    In His love and service,
    Your friend and brother in Christ,
    Bill Keller

    Blessings,
    Sue

    [ July 04, 2003, 10:17 PM: Message edited by: Squire Robertsson ]
     
    #1 I Am Blessed 24, Apr 14, 2003
  2. Dr. Bob

    Dr. Bob Administrator
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    Thanks for sharing the message, Sue.

    I would sure say "AMEN" to the message against mincing words or trying to find some sort of illogical "biblical" rationale for such a perverse and abominable practice.

    Some men's sins go open before to judgment. I try to keep mine well hidden. :eek:
     
    #2 Dr. Bob, Apr 14, 2003
  3. Watchman

    Watchman New Member

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    All of this is quite true. God never changes, and therefore never changes His views on any subject: an abomination back then is still an abomination today. A sinner doesn't need to be placaded in his sin and told that it is, "Allright, that's the way you are." What he needs is repentence, that is: 180 degrees about, "Lord, my way is wrong, your way is right" and receive Jesus into their lives. If they still have problems in this area (Or any believer with anything wrong in their lives) He is able to deliver. It is not, "I am gay and that's the way it is," it is that you do not HAVE to be gay (Or adulterer, drunkard, etc...). Admit that you are a sinner, if it is too powerfull for you, tell it to God; is anything impossible for Him? Tell Him you cannot do this on your own, that you need Him. If we ask according to His will, He hears us and it is certainly not His will to live like this.
    Believe me I know.
     
    #3 Watchman, Apr 15, 2003
  4. christfollower55

    christfollower55 New Member

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    Homosexuality is an "ABOMINATION" unto God!!! And Dr. Bob, all of man's sins will be made public at the throne... You can't hide those sins from GOD!

    God Bless America
     
    #4 christfollower55, Apr 15, 2003
  5. time like this

    time like this New Member

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    A person given to this life style should not be preaching the gospel. it is not acceptable in the sight of God. given this we much reach out to them in love, by love i mean tell them the truth according to God word that never changes. "REPENT" this is a word that people do not like to use. this is the first fruit that we must bear, brint to the altar of God thru Christ Jesus. To deal any other way we miss handle the power and purpose of the gospel. i do beleive they can be saved and delivered from that life style,just as drug users,prostitutes,and liars. this battle can only be one by submiting to the power of the word. This battle is not against flesh and blood but it manifests in flesh and blood.
     
    #5 time like this, Apr 16, 2003
  6. I Am Blessed 24

    I Am Blessed 24 Active Member

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    ITA. When a sin is brought to light, the sinner will either REBEL or REPENT. If it is the first, then I would certainly question his salvation. If it is the latter, it will no longer be a problem. This goes for ANY sin.

    Blessings,
    Sue
     
    #6 I Am Blessed 24, Apr 16, 2003
  7. mozier

    mozier New Member

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    Wow.

    Two days, and Rev. Joshua hasn't made a comment on this post!

    He's slipping.


    mozier
     
    #7 mozier, Apr 16, 2003
  8. J.C.

    J.C. New Member

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    Agreed, both are lies. [​IMG]

    I have met a couple of people through my place of work who not only chose to live the homosexual lifestyle, but were outspoken about it.

    These men claimed to be honest about their "natural" attraction towards men and for that reason, felt that it was okay. I politely disagreed with this reasoning. I meet beautiful women from time to time and, believe it or not, my initial reaction to their beauty is to reach out and touch them, hold them, and more (you get the idea :rolleyes: ). Many people (not all), if honest, will admit that they have similar thoughts when in this situation. The thing is, though, I don't act on my thoughts. Why, because it is wrong and due to God's strength in my life, I resist. The Bible is clear that, for me, a married man, to act in this way is sin (as well as it is to even dwell on that thought and lust). It is just as much sin for me to commit adultery as it is for someone to have sexual relations with someone of the same gender. I have a choice to sin, so do they. Is it natural for me to have that sinful thought given in my example? Yes. Is it natural for someone to be attracted to the same gender? Quite possibly. Does acting on either natural thought make it right? Absolutely not! It is against God's Word to do so. Bottom line.

    These people ask me how can they change. I tell them that only through prayer can God help change what is natural to them to line up with His plan for them.

    I can't argue with a persons claim to be attracted to the same gender just because I am not. Does everyone have the same "thorn in the flesh"? I think not; for me, I don't struggle with alcohol, gambling, gossiping, etc., but do with sexual immorality. I claim to have had a salvation experience some 17 years ago when the Holy Spirit moved heavily in my heart convicting me of sin and convincing me of the reality of Jesus' gift for my life. No one can say it didn't happen. Just the same, I feel that we have to agree with the homosexual that what they do might actually feel natural to them (please understand me, "natural" does not mean "okay", just something that they are inclined to do). But we can't stop there. We must share God's Word, His forgiveness, and count on God to move in their life and help them overcome this natural (to them) feeling.

    It's late. I hope I clearly conveyed my feelings about this sinful choice that homosexuals make. [​IMG]

    And, as with any other sin with which some lost person is involved, we should, through Jesus, love the person, not their sin. [​IMG] It might seem like I am "tooting" my own horn, but these guys were amazed that I didn't treat them like they had the plague. I always stood my ground and they knew that I did not approve of thier choice to sin, but treating someone poorly because they are caught up in sin, is simply wrong.

    "He who is without sin, cast the first stone..."
     
    #8 J.C., Apr 17, 2003
  9. I Am Blessed 24

    I Am Blessed 24 Active Member

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    Good post JC. I think the example above would fall into the category, "If it feels good, do it." And you are right, to a lost man, that thinking is natural. We, as Christians, are not here to condemn the sinner; but we ARE here to condemn the sin.

    Blessings,
    Sue
     
    #9 I Am Blessed 24, Apr 17, 2003
  10. J.C.

    J.C. New Member

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    After a decent nights sleep I think I conveyed my feelings okay late last night. [​IMG]

    On Sue's second point:
    Why would they want to claim that more than 10% of the population is homosexual? I believe it is because there is strength in numbers. If lots of people are doing it, it can't be that bad. :(

    Well, as my momma used to say, if lots of people jump off a cliff, it doesn't make it right. :eek:
     
    #10 J.C., Apr 17, 2003
  11. latterrain77

    latterrain77 New Member

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    Hi "I Am Blessed 16". Do you think one should be as strenuous concerning liars, thieves, adulterers (heterosexual ones), those who sow discord, and false witnesses, as you suggest about homosexuals? How about folks who dishonor their parents? Should we be as critical of them as you suggest concerning the homosexual? Should we be as strident against those who put material gods above the TRUE GOD (such as the corrupt corporation CEO, the local con-artist, the lover of filthy lucre and the two bit hustler)? Should we view the man who covets and lusts after his neighbor's wife in the same light as you suggest about the homosexual? How about the guy who lusts and covets after his neighbors new Mercedes Benz? Just asking. Thanks! latterrain77

    [ April 17, 2003, 09:22 PM: Message edited by: latterrain77 ]
     
    #11 latterrain77, Apr 17, 2003
  12. time like this

    time like this New Member

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    77

    You are right we have to tow the same line with sin.
     
    #12 time like this, Apr 17, 2003
  13. I Am Blessed 24

    I Am Blessed 24 Active Member

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    77: Shame on you. :rolleyes: If you had read all my posts on this thread you would have seen the above statement. I will repeat my last line. "This goes for ANY sin."

    Blessings,
    Sue
     
    #13 I Am Blessed 24, Apr 17, 2003
  14. C.S. Murphy

    C.S. Murphy New Member

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    77 what is your intended point here?
    Murph
     
    #14 C.S. Murphy, Apr 18, 2003
  15. latterrain77

    latterrain77 New Member

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    Hi "i am blessed." Thank you for your reply. The topic of your thread is "Homosexual Clergy and Churches? ABOMINATION!" So you are saying that your topic could equally have been titled; "Clergy Who Dishonor their parents and churches? ABOMINATION!"? Or, "Clergy and the Churches Who Sow Discord? ABOMINATION!"? Thanks! latterrain77
     
    #15 latterrain77, Apr 18, 2003
  16. I Am Blessed 24

    I Am Blessed 24 Active Member

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    77: I have stated my opinions. I am with Murph. Just what is your intended point here? Are you FOR homosexual churches and clergy?

    :rolleyes:
    Sue
     
    #16 I Am Blessed 24, Apr 18, 2003
  17. latterrain77

    latterrain77 New Member

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    Hi "murph." I have no "point" per se - just questions. I'm trying to identify the Biblical concept of "Abomination" and was hoping "i am blessed" (or perhaps you) could explain this further. Thanks! latterrain77
     
    #17 latterrain77, Apr 18, 2003
  18. latterrain77

    latterrain77 New Member

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    Hi again "i am blessed." But you haven't answered my questions. Could your topic title equally have said; "Clergy Who Dishonor their parents and churches? ABOMINATION!"? Or, "Clergy and the Churches Who Sow Discord? ABOMINATION!"? Thanks! latterrain77
     
    #18 latterrain77, Apr 18, 2003
  19. C.S. Murphy

    C.S. Murphy New Member

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    There is infact a laundry list of abominable things listed in the Bible but homosexuality is definately one of them:

    13 If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them.
    Lev 20:13 (KJV)

    Now I don't know your intent or motivation but your questions concern me. If you are simply stating that there are many abominations then fine but if you are saying something else please explain your reasoning.

    Murph
     
    #19 C.S. Murphy, Apr 18, 2003
  20. latterrain77

    latterrain77 New Member

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    Hi Murph. Why are you concerned? I'm simply asking questions - trying to tie the Biblical pieces together. Be at ease, I'm a 100% believer in the absolute inerrancy of the Bible. I'm also determined to reach truth through the Bible alone.

    I'm well aware of ALL the uses of the word abomination in the Bible but perhaps others are not. I'm also aware of the Leviticus 20: 13 verse that you quoted (and I thank you for quoting it). To be consistent with my questions however, perhaps it might have been prudent to also quote Leviticus 20: 10 where the sin of heterosexual adultery was shown to be grounds for the same punishment (death) that was also applied to homosexuality in the text that you quoted:

    "And the man that committeth adultery with another man's wife, even he that committeth adultery with his neighbour's wife, the adulterer and the adulteress shall surely be put to death" (Lev. 20: 10).

    Also, since Proverbs 6: 16-19 clearly illustrates 7 MAIN abominations (none of which is homosexuality by the way), I asked the questions of "i am blessed" if it is equally abominable for Clergy or churches that engage in these Biblical abominations as it is any other abomination. Thanks Murph! latterrain77
     
    #20 latterrain77, Apr 18, 2003
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