Giving Under Compulsion?

[Rye]

I'd like to start off by saying the purpose of this thread is not to discuss how much one should give to their local church on any given Sunday. It is to discuss the method of how monetary contributions are collected.

Most Baptist churches I've been to practice the tradition of passing the plate around or will have the ushers will walk down the aisle to collect the offering. My question is, when examining this tradition more closely, could it be considered a violation of 2 Corinthians 9:7?

Each one must give as he has decided in his heart, not reluctantly or under compulsion, for God loves a cheerful giver. (ESV)

Passing a plate is a visible, public way of giving. Because of that, people can feel pressured to give. Other people can see whether someone gave or not and they might even be able to see how much they gave. Because other people are watching, they may give in order to impress onlookers or earn praise from others. This is the wrong motivation and could also be a violation of Matthew 6:3-4.

But when you give to the needy, do not let your left hand know what your right hand is doing, so that your giving may be in secret. And your Father who sees in secret will reward you. (ESV)

Passing around a plate every Sunday makes it obvious that the church is asking people to give. That being said, some non-denominational churches have what they call “agape boxes” located around the sanctuary for those to conveniently give as they wish in privacy. I see this as more honest approach to collecting offerings since it eliminates the possibility altogether and allows the church to simply trust that the Lord will provide for their financial needs.

 

[kyredneck]

That being said, some non-denominational churches have what they call “agape boxes” located around the sanctuary for those to conveniently give as they wish in privacy. I see this as more honest approach to collecting offerings since it eliminates the possibility altogether and allows the church to simply trust that the Lord will provide for their financial needs.

The Lexington church does this.

 

[Mikey]

I don't like an actual plate used, where the money is seen by all and people can see what you are giving. Also its often not very practical as the notes regularly fall off. I prefer the bags with handles, as it allows certain amount of discretion and keeps everything together. passing an offering bag/plate isn't compusion, you just pass the bag/plate along.

Many people do direct debits as their offerings, or they give once a month as a lump sum. So someone not giving money every Sunday doesn't mean they aren't giving.

 

[Rye]

So someone not giving money every Sunday doesn't mean they aren't giving.

True, however the point is that it could give someone the wrong idea that they are purposefully withholding their offering.

 

[Rye]

I prefer the bags with handles, as it allows certain amount of discretion and keeps everything together. passing an offering bag/plate isn't compusion, you just pass the bag/plate along.

I don’t see the difference, you’re still going to be seen dropping bills/envelopes in a container of some sort.

 

[Rye]

Many people do direct debits as their offerings, or they give once a month as a lump sum.

I don’t like electronic giving either. It creates a record of your giving and that is nobody’s business.

 

[37818]

There are churches that have offering boxes at entrances. And when offering is taken, offering bags with a handle is used instead of offering plates.

And one can give cash without an envelope.

 

[Rye]

And one can give cash without an envelope.

This is what I do. I don’t think it’s wise to attach your name to your givings since it creates the possibility of favoritism.

 

[Mikey]

still think the offering bags are more practical than plates and it does provide a person to provide an offering without people see what is being offered.

we not to make a scene when giving an offering, not that we hide our offering.

with regards to people knowing howmuch we give, there are indeed dangers, and i'd rather people not know. However this bings up ann issue. In the UK there is something called gift aid, that essentially a person who pays tax when giving to a charity (churches are considered charities) the charity can claim back the tax on the donation. however this would require the charity knowing how much the person gave, so to claim back the tax and would therefore receive more.

what's your thoughts on that?

 

[Rye]

what's your thoughts on that?

It sounds similar to what we have here. In the US, churches can have a 501c3 tax exemption which basically allows us to write off any cash donations on our tax returns. It does require the church accountant to keep a record of who gives and how much they give. At the end of the year, we would request a form that provides proof to the IRS in case of an audit.

I don’t particularly like this for a few reasons…

1. One stipulation for having a 501c3 tax exemption is that the pastors are not allowed to endorse a political candidate. I see this as a form of censorship.

2. It defeats the purpose of sacrificial giving if you’re going to get your money back anyway.

3. This was not practiced in church history until very recently and to be honest I don’t think churches should be run like businesses.

 

[Dr. Bob]

Our church has locked boxes for offering, but like others have mentioned, most give on line.

As a "senior", I give once a year as part of my RMD (required minimum distribution) that the IRS makes me withdraw from a business IRA account. It is added to my taxable income UNLESS I donate it to 501c3 charity. So I have my financial advisor give "X" to church, to missions, to local food pantry, pro-life center, etc. I would give to them anyway, but this is great way to use RMD. And no one at the church complains of ONE check coming instead of 52 checks

 

[Dr. Bob]

BTW, in modern Judaism, a minyan of at least 10 families must be gathered before a synagogue can be formed. Each family gives 10% of income into one bucket; reb gets that as income, then HE gives 10% for needed supplies, The building/utilities/upkeep are from another "bucket", usually underwritten by endowment or annuity from older, well-heeled members. Third "bucket" is for needy and special activities where the synagogue "tithes" to help other charities. Where I grew up, we supported families moving to Israel, the anti-defamation league, etc. Fight the hatred and antisemitism going on at our campuses and big cities.

I have a related topic and will start a new thread on "who knows what" about our giving.

 

[Scarlett O.]

This thread has me puzzled.

If one gives consistently, one needs a record of contributions for tax purposes - if they choose that and some do. We have a church financial secretary that keeps a private record of all contributions that come by check or a name on an envelope or online. Not even the pastor knows who gives what.

What has me puzzled is this concern that people are looking over the pew to see what others give!!! I've been at the same church my whole life - 63 years - and have sat almost everywhere in the sanctuary and have NEVER seen people spying on others to see what they give or someone waving their hundred-dollar bill in the air to boast. That's a foreign concept to me.

My Sunday School class keeps a "kitty" and members give alot, a little, or not at all every week. We don't CARE what you give. We collect to give to missions, give to those in need, and things like helping those driving to MD Anderson in Houston for cancer treatments with gasoline and food money.

Give or don't give. Give a lot or give a little. The church doesn't care about snooping into your giving. At least my church doesn't care.

 

[Rye]

We have a church financial secretary that keeps a private record of all contributions that come by check or a name on an envelope or online. Not even the pastor knows who gives what.

What prevents the pastor from finding out if he really wants to know?

What has me puzzled is this concern that people are looking over the pew to see what others give!!!

The purpose of the OP is to point out how some methods of collecting the offering can open the door to some very unethical behavior.

The church doesn't care about snooping into your giving. At least my church doesn't care.

If your church is run by honest people, that is a blessing and I’m genuinely happy for you. I’ve been a victim of financial abuse by a church I once attended and trust me, they care. They care a LOT.

 

[David Lamb]

I don’t like electronic giving either. It creates a record of your giving and that is nobody’s business.

But the record will only say that certain amount has been paid from your account to the church's account, not what the payment is for. It could be for books purchased from the church bookstall. Even if you give cash to your church, somebody may see (whether accidentally or deliberately) what you are putting in.

 

[Rye]

But the record will only say that certain amount has been paid from your account to the church's account, not what the payment is for. It could be for books purchased from the church bookstall. Even if you give cash to your church, somebody may see (whether accidentally or deliberately) what you are putting in.

The problem is that electronic giving has your name attached to it. The most anonymous way I have found is by putting cash in an offering box away from public view.

 

[Scarlett O.]

What prevents the pastor from finding out if he really wants to know?



The purpose of the OP is to point out how some methods of collecting the offering can open the door to some very unethical behavior.



If your church is run by honest people, that is a blessing and I’m genuinely happy for you. I’ve been a victim of financial abuse by a church I once attended and trust me, they care. They care a LOT.

I am very sorry, truly, that you were a victim of financial abuse by a church.

I wish more churches understood that when there is questionable behavior of ANY kind by a member or staff member of a church, the people have the OBLIGATION to whistle blow.

 

[Dave G]

It's nobody's business what God's people give to help those in need ( Matthew 6 ).
The Lord loves a cheerful giver ( 2 Corinthians 9 )...

And gifts are not given under compulsion.