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Glimpse of a Certain View: A Brief Look Into the “Other” Camp

Discussion in 'Creation vs. Evolution' started by RighteousnessTemperance&, Jan 15, 2023.

  1. RighteousnessTemperance&

    RighteousnessTemperance& Well-Known Member

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    Some time ago, a famed atheist philosopher released a book that set his colleagues’ teeth on edge. By colleagues is meant fellow atheists. By book is meant Mind and Cosmos.

    This article eloquently, or at least amusingly, describes some of the reactions and why that book makes points hard to refute without being self-refuting.

    Naturally, the article is titled “The Heretic.”

    It takes a while to get to the controversial subtitle. But it’s an entertaining while. Really, it’s a good read.

    The Heretic
     
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  2. RighteousnessTemperance&

    RighteousnessTemperance& Well-Known Member

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    Last fall, a few days before Halloween and about a month after the publication of Mind and Cosmos, the controversial new book by the philosopher Thomas Nagel, several of the world’s leading philosophers gathered with a group of cutting-edge scientists in the conference room of a charming inn in the Berkshires. They faced one another around a big table set with pitchers of iced water and trays of hard candies wrapped in cellophane and talked and talked, as public intellectuals do. PowerPoint was often brought into play.

    The title of the “interdisciplinary workshop” was “Moving Naturalism Forward.” For those of us who like to kill time sitting around pondering the nature of reality—personhood, God, moral judgment, free will, what have you—this was the Concert for Bangladesh.​
     
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  3. RighteousnessTemperance&

    RighteousnessTemperance& Well-Known Member

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    ...
    There was little else to disturb the materialists in their Berkshire contentment. Surveys have shown that vast majorities of philosophers and scientists call themselves naturalists or materialists. Nearly all popular science books, not only those written by the workshoppers, conclude that materialism offers the true picture of reality. The workshoppers seemed vexed, however, knowing that not everyone in their intellectual class had yet tumbled to the truth of neo-Darwinism. A video of the workshop shows Dennett complaining that a few—but only a few!—contemporary philosophers have stubbornly refused to incorporate the naturalistic conclusions of science into their philosophizing, continuing to play around with outmoded ideas like morality and sometimes even the soul.

    “I am just appalled to see how, in spite of what I think is the progress we’ve made in the last 25 years, there’s this sort of retrograde gang,” he said, dropping his hands on the table. “They’re going back to old-fashioned armchair philosophy with relish and eagerness. It’s sickening. And they lure in other people. And their work isn’t worth anything—it’s cute and it’s clever and it’s not worth a damn.”

    There was an air of amused exasperation. “Will you name names?” one of the participants prodded, joking.

    “No names!” Dennett said.

    The philosopher Alex Rosenberg, author of The Atheist’s Guide, leaned forward, unamused.

    “And then there’s some work that is neither cute nor clever,” he said. “And it’s by Tom Nagel.”

    There it was! Tom Nagel, whose Mind and Cosmos was already causing a derangement among philosophers in England and America. ...​
     
  4. kyredneck

    kyredneck Well-Known Member
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    Thanks for posting this. Due to my ignorance of the 'isms of atheism' it's much for me to assimilate all at once. Perhaps it'll give me something to contemplate for a while. My older brother belongs to this tribe of intellectual atheists, hostile to any consideration of a creator. An incomplete perusal of the article and Amazon reviews of the book brings this to my mind:

    2 In the pride of the wicked the poor is hotly pursued; Let them be taken in the devices that they have conceived.
    3 For the wicked boasteth of his heart`s desire, And the covetous renounceth, yea, contemneth Jehovah.
    4 The wicked, in the pride of his countenance, saith, He will not require it. All his thoughts are, There is no God. Ps 10
     
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  5. RighteousnessTemperance&

    RighteousnessTemperance& Well-Known Member

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    Yes. Nagel seems refreshingly honest about his desire that there be no God.

    Try reading the article through just for the exercise. You may awaken in the night or in the morn laughing in the Spirit.

    Here’s a link to the same article, but perhaps more constantly accessible.

    The Heretic
     
  6. RighteousnessTemperance&

    RighteousnessTemperance& Well-Known Member

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    For all this and more, Thomas Nagel is a prominent and heretofore respected member of the country's intellectual elite. And such men are not supposed to write books with subtitles like the one he tacked onto Mind and Cosmos: Why the Materialist Neo-Darwinian Conception of Nature Is Almost Certainly False.

    Imagine if your local archbishop climbed into the pulpit and started reading from the Collected Works of Friedrich Nietzsche. "What has gotten into Thomas Nagel?" demanded the evolutionary psychologist Steven Pinker, on Twitter. (Yes, even Steven Pinker tweets.) Pinker inserted a link to a negative review of Nagel's book, which he said "exposed the shoddy reasoning of a once-great thinker." At the point where science, philosophy, and public discussion intersect — a dangerous intersection these days — it is simply taken for granted that by attacking naturalism Thomas Nagel has rendered himself an embarrassment to his colleagues and a traitor to his class.

    The Guardian awarded Mind and Cosmos its prize for the Most Despised Science Book of 2012. ...​
     
  7. RighteousnessTemperance&

    RighteousnessTemperance& Well-Known Member

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    ...His working assumption is, in today's intellectual climate, radical: If the materialist, neo-Darwinian orthodoxy contradicts common sense, then this is a mark against the orthodoxy, not against common sense. When a chain of reasoning leads us to deny the obvious, we should double-check the chain of reasoning before we give up on the obvious.

    Nagel follows the materialist chain of reasoning all the way into the cul de sac where it inevitably winds up. Nagel's touchier critics have accused him of launching an assault on science, when really it is an assault on the nonscientific uses to which materialism has been put. Though he does praise intelligent design advocates for having the nerve to annoy the secular establishment, he's no creationist himself. ...​
     
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