• Welcome to Baptist Board, a friendly forum to discuss the Baptist Faith in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to all the features that our community has to offer.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

How it felt when I changed Day of Worship ....

G

Gerhard Ebersoehn

Active Member
Site Supporter
I read of "thousands of Seventh Day Adventists leaving the Church"; of an entire Sabbath-keeping Church movement that disintegrated. And I read of many who have come to believe the Seventh Day Sabbath - not necessarily through having become Seventh Day Adventists.

I would like to learn of their experience, not out of curiosity, but to see for what doctrinal reason or reasons they changed Day of Worship.
 
H

Heavenly Pilgrim

New Member
I am Blessed 17: Whatever day they choose to worship, SDA is still a cult.
Click to expand...
HP: That ie a very hard statement you make. I have always considered a cult to hold to some basic ideas. For instance, all cults, as I see and understand cults, deny the Deity of Christ. Do those of the SDA Church do that?

What is it in their stated faith or practice that would lead you to give us your stated opinion that they are indeed a cult?
 
Bethelassoc

Bethelassoc

Member
Here's one heretical belief:

27. Millennium and the End of Sin:
The millennium is the thousand-year reign of Christ with His saints in heaven between the first and second resurrections. During this time the wicked dead will be judged; the earth will be utterly desolate, without living human inhabitants, but occupied by Satan and his angels. At its close Christ with His saints and the Holy City will descend from heaven to earth. The unrighteous dead will then be resurrected, and with Satan and his angels will surround the city; but fire from God will consume them and cleanse the earth. The universe will thus be freed of sin and sinners forever. (Rev. 20; 1 Cor. 6:2, 3; Jer. 4:23-26; Rev. 21:1-5; Mal. 4:1; Eze. 28:18, 19.)
Click to expand...

From: http://www.adventist.org/beliefs/fundamental/index.html

David
 
I Am Blessed 24

I Am Blessed 24

Active Member
There are too many unscriptural doctrinal beliefs in the SDA for me to name, but there are several former SDA members on the BB. I hope some of them catch this thread.
 
BobRyan

BobRyan

Well-Known Member
#1. At some point you have to support your belief's "sola scriptura" instead of relying on man-made doctrines based on tradition and popularity alone.

#2. At some point you have to think about whether it makes sense to refer to any doctrine other than your own as "a cult"

Purgatory?
Rejecting Believers baptism?
Rejecting free will?
Accepting Free will?
Rejecting the false teachings of Calvinism?
Accepting Christ the Creator's Seventh-day memorial of Creation?
Accepting the fact that "the DEAD in Christ rise FIRST" at the FIRST resurrection described in Rev 20?

Simply tossing out non-sola-scriptura arguments like "those guys are a cult because they are unpopular or they differ with me" does not rely on anything but tradition and popularity. There is nothing "sola scriptura" about it.

I prefer substance to mere propaganda.

In almost every case - whenver someone changes to accept Christ the Creator's memorial of Creation made "FOR MANKIND" Mark 2:27 they have reached a moment (on at least THAT topic) where they saw the difference between scripture and propaganda-popularism. The Bible wins easily in those cases.
in Christ,

Bob
 
Last edited by a moderator:
H

Heavenly Pilgrim

New Member
Beth...: Here's one heretical belief:
Click to expand...
HP: Although I may or may not agree that such a belief is unfounded by the Word of God, does that necessitated those believing as such as belonging to a cult? I hardly think so. We all have many disagreements on this list as to what constitutes truth, just the same I cannot believe that gives any of us the right to name the other simply on that basis as a cult. To call those a cult on the basis I have seen so far, is simply a personal attack unless one can show clearly that the other is outside of ‘the faith.’
 
Bethelassoc

Bethelassoc

Member
Although I may or may not agree that such a belief is unfounded by the Word of God, does that necessitated those believing as such as belonging to a cult? I hardly think so. We all have many disagreements on this list as to what constitutes truth, just the same I cannot believe that gives any of us the right to name the other simply on that basis as a cult. To call those a cult on the basis I have seen so far, is simply a personal attack unless one can show clearly that the other is outside of ‘the faith.’
Click to expand...

I believe the statement of faith quoted earlier speaks for itself. As to what constitutes truth, if we allow truth to be whatever we want to make it, then cults do not exist.
 
2

2 Timothy2:1-4

New Member
Author Robert M. Bowman Jr. defines cult as
"A religious group originating as a heretical sect and maintaining fervent commitment to heresy. Source wikipedia


In the case of the SDA and Ellen G. White the heresy is that if you do not worship on Sat. you will die and go to hell. The SDA originated in heresy by the false teachings of Ellen White and has maintained them unto today.
 
H

Heavenly Pilgrim

New Member
QUOTE]2Tim: Author Robert M. Bowman Jr. defines cult as
"A religious group originating as a heretical sect and maintaining fervent commitment to heresy. Source wikipedia


In the case of the SDA and Ellen G. White the heresy is that if you do not worship on Sat. you will die and go to hell. The SDA originated in heresy by the false teachings of Ellen White and has maintained them unto today.[/QUOTE]

HP: Being classified as being part of what one might see as a ‘heretical sect’ is a very subjective thing. Try joining the discussion directly involving Cults, Christian beliefs and practices and give the questions of the OP a shot. I do not desire to derail this thread with a full blown discussion of what constitute a cult or being called a member of a cult. :)
 
BobRyan

BobRyan

Well-Known Member
2 Timothy2:1-4 said:
Author Robert M. Bowman Jr. defines cult as
"A religious group originating as a heretical sect and maintaining fervent commitment to heresy. Source wikipedia


In the case of the SDA and Ellen G. White the heresy is that if you do not worship on Sat. you will die and go to hell. The SDA originated in heresy by the false teachings of Ellen White and has maintained them unto today.
Click to expand...

At some point "actual fact" just has to enter this conversation!

Ellen white's statement "WHERE are the vast majority of God's saints to be found today? Outside the Adventist Church".

Ellen White never taught that non-Sabbath keepers go to hell. What she predicted is that SOME DAY in the future God WOULD make Sabbath a test for all mankind. BUT that is a PREDICTION -- if it does not come true then at best you can say it is a FAILED prediction -- not a doctrine. She was very specific as to events leading up to that point in time - one of them being a bridge of the gap between Protestant America and Catholicism (in her day these two groups were in serious conflict) and that America would become the leading world superpower, AND that concern for national security in American society would cause us to start restricting personnal freedoms - and that has come true. But a number of other milestones predicted on the way to the end-point are still on the timeline to happen

The SDA church has NO DOCTRINE that is not based "sola scriptura" I.E there is NO APPEAL at ALL to Ellen White as "the SOURCE" for any doctrine in the SDA chuch and never has been in all of time.

Another point is "heresy" is a subjective term meaning "differs with popular opinion" or "differs with my POV" in most cases. That is why you find Calvinists accusing Arminians here of heresy and Arminians accusing Calvinists of it. THINK people!!


Finally - SDAs argue that ALL prophets are subject to the TEST of a prophet sola-scriptura which means that we do NOT expect anyone with a doctrinal foundation OTHER than the one held by SDAS to view Ellen White as anything other than a false prophet.

This is all incredibly obvious - but then that is my role on this board - to state the obvious.

I realize of course that these are simply "inconvenient details" to be ignored when propaganda is the main point of a post.

In Christ,

Bob
 
Last edited by a moderator:
BobRyan

BobRyan

Well-Known Member
27. Millennium and the End of Sin:
The millennium is the thousand-year reign of Christ with His saints in heaven between the first and second resurrections. During this time the wicked dead will be judged; the earth will be utterly desolate, without living human inhabitants, but occupied by Satan and his angels. At its close Christ with His saints and the Holy City will descend from heaven to earth. The unrighteous dead will then be resurrected, and with Satan and his angels will surround the city; but fire from God will consume them and cleanse the earth. The universe will thus be freed of sin and sinners forever. (Rev. 20; 1 Cor. 6:2, 3; Jer. 4:23-26; Rev. 21:1-5; Mal. 4:1; Eze. 28:18, 19.)
Click to expand...

There is a thread on this board arguing for the truth of scripture regarding the "FIRST resurrection" Rev 20:4-5 and the fact that the "DEAD IN CHRIST rise FIRST" (1Thess 4) that basically makes the case sola scriptura as one might expect.

IF SOMEONE were actually ABLE to show this to be in error from the ACTUAL Bible they would be doing it on that thread!

Simply quoting a doctrinal statement here and saying "I find that unpopular so I say the word cult when I read it" is good propaganda tactic - but has no "substance".

If someone actually "had" a point to make on th subject they would be making it on the "FIRST Resurrection" thread.

But far be it from me to object to this kind of tactic here -- I am just pointing out the obvious -- again.

in Christ,

Bob
 
G

Gerhard Ebersoehn

Active Member
Site Supporter
I Am Blessed 17 said:
Whatever day they choose to worship, SDA is still a cult.
Click to expand...

GE:


It's easy to say it; even more dangerous to say it, come to think of it they too worship the same Lord Jesus Christ as you and I do who are not SDA. The day of resurrection will reveal a lot and surprise a lot and disappoint a lot.
 
carpro

carpro

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Quote:
Originally Posted by I Am Blessed 17
Whatever day they choose to worship, SDA is still a cult.




Gerhard Ebersoehn said:
GE:

So that's your whole and total doctrinal vocabulory and repertoire?
Click to expand...

A flowery vocabulary won't change the fact that she's right. The plain truth plainly spoken is most effective.

Many people use overly wordy responses to illustrate their own familiarity with the English language (boasting) and to obscure the truth rather than illuminate it.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top