Featured How To Get To Heaven When You Die

Of course not frodo. Most here are Bible believers. The statements of faith in my signature make it pretty clear where I stand on the Bible! Many have grown up in churches that have preached the gospel in the fashion that you have above.

To spark some thought... what of the new birth? I know you are familiar with John 3 and Jesus' words to Nicodemus. We know that one must be born again to see the kingdom of God. Is this done then by praying a prayer and really meaning it? Friend, many a poor sinner has prayed very sincerely and seen nothing. Some have gone away disillusioned thinking our faith is nothing.

However, one cannot make a decision to be born. Someone once called what evangelicals teach in this fashion "decisional regeneration" and its a very fitting label. It suggests that if I assent to certain facts in my mind, feel sorry for my sins, and pray a prayer, and really really mean it, then I am born again and I am to never, never doubt it. I believe this line of reasoning produces many, many false converts.

So, while no true Christian would deny any part of the Scriptures you have referred to, many would say that the typical "Romans Road" and "Accept Jesus in your heart" presentation is not biblical. So, I would encourage you to look to John 3. See how Jesus describes being born again in that he likens it to the wind. Read further throughout the Gospel of John and you will see that it is impossible for men to come to Christ on their own. We are so completely ruined by the fall that we do not have the ability to see or to seek.

Do not accept a decision as the fulcrum of your new birth. The new birth is the action and work of God. We are not born of the will of the flesh or man, but of God. Has this happened to you? If not, you will not see heaven. And if not, cry out to the Lord Jesus to do for you what you cannot do for yourself.

This is what many of us contend for.

 

Really? This is how you start a presentation of the glorious gospel of Jesus Christ? By saying it's so easy and only takes a few minutes???

This is peddling the gospel. Selling it without inconveniencing the buyer. SMH.

Mark 10:45
Again Jesus said to them, “Children,how hard it is to enter the kingdom of God!"

 

Greektim..., ask that thief on the cross just how hard it is to attain salvation.

 

Right... let's make the exceptional situation the norm. How's that workin' out for ya???

Let's ask it this way. Did Jesus ever do anything like this when he preached the gospel of the kingdom? No! He turned people away with the hard difficult truths for discipleship costs everything or nothing and one must count the cost. That takes time and thoughtful consideration (not to mention the Spirit's conviction and regeneration) for the gospel to take root.

As for the thief, it is unclear how much prior knowledge he had of Jesus. Certainly some. But we do know he was granted repentance. But the appeal of Jesus was not that it would only take a few minutes cause it is so easy. He was seeing just how hard it was for salvation. He witnessed first hand the costly value of God's grace. The OP simply cheapened it to a sales pitch.

 

That thief was in the midst of crucifixion. That's a hard way to get clarity about the nature of the world, his own nature, and the nature of the Man Who was hanging next to him.

 

You forgot to end your post with the appropriate

 

Wow.

28 Come unto me, all ye that labor and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.
29 Take my yoke upon you, and learn of me; for I am meek and lowly in heart: and ye shall find rest unto your souls.
30 For my yoke is easy, and my burden is light. Mt 11

GT, please, share with us this 'hard way' to Christ. By all means YOU tell us what we must do to go to heaven.

 

More likely he was an erring child of God caught thieving which was a 'sin unto death'.

 

Yeah... wow... Scripture actually says it is hard.

Did you read where Jesus says to enter the narrow gate and the DIFFICULT road??? In Luke's account, Jesus says "strive".

So now we need to accord this issue of salvation as both easy and difficult.

It is funny you mention this issue. I was just reading Piper about this very thing. In one sense, faith in Jesus is easy. The burden of Jesus is light b/c faith means that it is not by human effort (keep in context Mt. 11 and what was the labor/heavy laden Jesus was referring to). At the same time, it is so ridiculously hard b/c it pricks against our very nature. Believing that the grace of God can overcome all of the difficulties in life and that God did it all for us not by our good works is not at all easy. Thus the struggle with entering the kingdom by grace through faith.

 

Somewhere I remember reading something about the free gift of eternal life..... and your Mark 10:45 is not the same as mine:

For the Son of man also came not to be ministered unto, but to minister, and to give his life a ransom for many.

 

Not gonna lie... not sure where 10:45 came from (other than subconsciously since it is such an important passage for Mark). I meant Mark 10:24 (I just looked down at my Bible a 3rd time to confirm this time).

Free gift as in you don't earn it. It is by grace through faith. That doesn't make it easy. Unless you buy into easy believism?

 

Just way to much work to get saved, no wonder folks aren't interested

 

I think this thread is evidence why unsaved people hate christianity so much.

Because even on the most fundamental and basic issues of the Bible(on a forum dedicated to one particular denomination no less), there is wild disagreement and lack of unity.

 

I'm not GreekTim, but this is easy.

The passage that Tim quoted took place immediately after the rich young ruler walked away from Jesus after hearing that he had to lose his life (his status/authority, his wealth, and leave his home) in order to enter into the life that Jesus offered.

After he walked away, Jesus pointed out how difficult it is for someone who has everything the world can give (youth, wealth, status/authority) to leave it behind for the sake of the message of Jesus.

The verses that you quote are a beautiful invitation to the life of Jesus - one of my favorite passages in scripture. But let's pay attention to what Jesus is saying:

• We are invited into rest (v.28)
• We are to take His yoke upon ourselves. (v.29a) A yoke is a device created to harness the power of an animal for a specific purpose, often to haul freight or persons. When Jesus offers His yoke, He is offering to have say over your energies and your will. He will walk beside us and teach us (that is, "learn of/from Me" (v. 29a), His ways and His work.
• We will find that he is a gentle and humble teacher, and we will find rest as His apprentices/disciples in the path of life (v.29b)
• As your teacher, you will find His yoke is easy and His burden is light (v.30)

Notice that it is the YOKE that is easy but entering into the kingdom of God (that is, losing your life for the sake of becoming a disciple of Christ) is hard.

Of course, if salvation is presented as a transaction involving a bit of mental assent to an atonement theory, then difficult times and transformation by Jesus can be avoided. But then there is also a very good chance that the gospel has never been presented, heard, or responded to, and we plunge people through the waters of the baptistry and they find the back door and leave, thinking they know everything there is to know about Jesus when they haven't heard anything He has said in context.

 

This reminds me of so many people who I have talked to over the years who assert that baptism is essential for salvation. If I point out the thief on the cross, they tell me that he had probably been baptized at some point before.

You are simply speculating to try to make your case. I don't have to speculate about the thief on the cross. Jesus tells us how to enter into His life, and it is NOT what was presented in the OP.

Am I saying that EVERYTHING in the OP is wrong? Of course not. But the whole presentation makes a number of fatal assumptions about the nature of the Kingdom of God, the nature of salvation, and the object of saving faith.

It paints the picture that salvation is a transaction - like a ticket or a travel reservation - for a journey that only happens at death. It completely ignores all of Jesus' teaching of the kingdom of God/heaven in favor of a medieval dualism that makes the heavens the place of the immortal and immaterial and the earth as the place of the mortal and material. The two are tied together in Jesus and also in everyone who enters into the new life that Jesus offers (the kingdom of God).

 

There is effort, but no earning.

Jesus set it up this way for extremely good reasons, so don't blame mere humans.

Luke 13:22-30
Then Jesus traveled throughout towns and villages, teaching and making his way toward Jerusalem. Someone asked him, “Lord, will only a few be saved?” So he said to them, “Exert every effort to enter through the narrow door, because many, I tell you, will try to enter and will not be able to. Once the head of the house gets up and shuts the door, then you will stand outside and start to knock on the door and beg him, ‘Lord, let us in!’ But he will answer you, ‘I don’t know where you come from.’ Then you will begin to say, ‘We ate and drank in your presence, and you taught in our streets.’ But he will reply, ‘I don’t know where you come from! Go away from me, all you evildoers!’ There will be weeping and gnashing of teeth when you see Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, and all the prophets in the kingdom of God but you yourselves thrown out. Then people will come from east and west, and from north and south, and take their places at the banquet table in the kingdom of God. But indeed, some are last who will be first, and some are first who will be last.”

 

In my experience with people who have turned from Christendom to atheism, there seems to be a common thread of disbelief that develops because Christianity "doesn't work" and/or Christians aren't any better - or sometimes worse - than everyone else. When I've been able to have the conversation, I have discovered that each one of them understand the gospel in terms of a transaction instead of a calling into a life with Jesus. I am attempting to address this very issue with my posts.

Yes, shocking isn't it. The evil one has sown a different gospel into the churches and has fooled many good and honest people into perpetuating it. The answer is not to ignore it or attack those who have been sown with bad seed, but to sow good seed in hopes that those who are being calling into the kingdom will hear, and those who are sowing bad seed will stop and get good seed.

Matthew 13:24-30
Another parable He put forth to them, saying: “The kingdom of heaven is like a man who sowed good seed in his field; but while men slept, his enemy came and sowed tares among the wheat and went his way. But when the grain had sprouted and produced a crop, then the tares also appeared. So the servants of the owner came and said to him, ‘Sir, did you not sow good seed in your field? How then does it have tares?’ He said to them, ‘An enemy has done this.’ The servants said to him, ‘Do you want us then to go and gather them up?’ But he said, ‘No, lest while you gather up the tares you also uproot the wheat with them. Let both grow together until the harvest, and at the time of harvest I will say to the reapers, “First gather together the tares and bind them in bundles to burn them, but gather the wheat into my barn.”’”

 

This is the problem with your premise. Christ was NOT offering him eternal life if only he would sell all his possessions and give to the poor. It was "If you want to be perfect, sell all and follow me". Join his group. Become a disciple. NOT go to heaven.

Did you have to sell all you have and give it to the poor to attain eternal life?

 

Well, you missed the point. God's children pre AND post cross are capable of doing everything [SINNING] they're told NOT to do. Is it so hard for you to swallow that the thief on the cross was already a child of God?

It's a mystery to me where you evangelicals draw the line where the OT Saints suddenly became bound for hell with the advent of Christ, or something like that. Maybe I'll articulate it better later.