KJB1611reader
Member
I am not Reformed nor Calvinist.
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I am not Reformed.
- Thread starter KJB1611reader
- Start date
I am not Reformed not a 5 point Calvinist. I believe the "TULI" of the TULIP are false doctrines. Which points of the TULIP do you disavow?
KJB1611reader
Member
I believe once saved, always saved, thus as a "set aside in Christ saint" I will preserve and never perish but have eternal life.
KJB1611reader
Member
Unless you provide an explanation of the difference, I do not see any difference, once a person is saved, they cannot by any action of themselves or others, lose that eternal salvation. If you add bogus views, like a person could stop believing in Christ and still be saved, then that would be a difference. Or that once saved, a person cannot backslide, that would be a difference.
Do you believe a person can be saved, transferred spiritually into Christ, Romans 6:3, and then by some means become unsaved?
atpollard
Well-Known Member
It is OK ... We will all be perfected when we are with him.
[Then you will be, but it won't matter any more.]
atpollard
Well-Known Member
So what happened when Adam sinned?
(or are we all JUST LIKE pre-fall Adam?)
I mean, Total Depravity is just the opposite of "I can live a sinless life and save myself" ... so I am always skeptical of people that claim to reject it.
Mathetes66
Member
Calvin did not come up with the TULIP; followers after him did. I am not a believer in the TULIP nor a Reformationist nor a Protestant. I am a simple disciple & follower of the Lord Jesus Christ & His teachings. I am a Biblicist. Total depravity is a man-made term & doctrine. It is not in Scripture. Its not a term you find in Scripture. Do all mankind have a sinful nature, the old man, the old self? Yes. They are in the image of Adam. (Gen 5:1-3). Can we save ourselves or boast before God? No. Can we seek after and grope after God? Yes. Can we cry out to Him? Yes. But we need to be born again, a second time, from above by the Spirit of God. We must become like little children in our faith. God knows each heart.
Really? Wow. Thank you for that. Never would have guessed it.
Silverhair
Well-Known Member
I doubt that anyone on this board would think they can live a sinless life and save themselves, but I am sure they have been accused of it.
Are people depraved, yes. Do they sin to the greatest extend that they can, I doubt it. Can they hear the call of God and respond, yes.
Some that use the term total depravity actually mean total inability.
That is actually when the Calvinists will stop following Calvin and start following Jesus.It is OK ... We will all be perfected when we are with him.
[Then you will be, but it won't matter any more.]
Has someone quoted John Calvin?That is actually when the Calvinists will stop following Calvin and start following Jesus.
Have you ever read anything by John Calvin?
David Lamb
Well-Known Member
I obviously don't know every single Calvinist who has ever lived, but what I can say is that none that I have met follows Calvin rather than following Jesus Christ. It would be just as ridiculous to claim that all Arminians follow Arminius rather than Jesus Christ.That is actually when the Calvinists will stop following Calvin and start following Jesus.
Follow the thread. It makes sense. I only did to him what he did to someone else. And he hasn’t complained yet. I think he understood what I did.
Yes. I have read large portions of his Institutes.
I agree with you there. It was a comment directed back at aptollard’s comment and not really meant to be applied across the board.
But as they say, “If you throw a rock in a pack of dogs, the one that yelps is the one that you hit.”
atpollard
Well-Known Member
I got the joke!That is actually when the Calvinists will stop following Calvin and start following Jesus.
I think that it would be more accurate to accuse the REFORMED of following Paul and the FREE WILL(ers) of following John.
It is where each places the greater emphasis.
C: "Romans 9"
A: "But John 3"
C: "I see your John 3 and raise you an Ephesians 2"
A: "I counter with 2 Peter 3"
C: "I call Foul! You cannot use 2 Peter 3 for that ... it is about the second coming."
[both begin name calling ...]
Posted for the purpose of obfuscation. Word play. Real Calvinists affirm all 5 points, but genuine Calvinists sometimes waver on 1 or 2 points. Anyone make up false claims.