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Infant Salvation Asserted By Jeremiah And Matthew

Discussion in 'General Baptist Discussions' started by Mark Osgatharp, Sep 14, 2005.

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  1. Mark Osgatharp

    Mark Osgatharp New Member

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    In Jeremiah we read:

    "Thus saith the LORD; A voice was heard in Ramah, lamentation, and bitter weeping; Rahel weeping for her children refused to be comforted for her children, because they were not. Thus saith the LORD; Refrain thy voice from weeping, and thine eyes from tears: for thy work shall be rewarded, saith the LORD; and they shall come again from the land of the enemy. And there is hope in thine end, saith the LORD, that thy children shall come again to their own border."

    Matthew tells us explicitly that this prophetic promise was given to the mothers of those children who were murdered by Herod:

    "Then Herod, when he saw that he was mocked of the wise men, was exceeding wroth, and sent forth, and slew all the children that were in Bethlehem, and in all the coasts thereof, from two years old and under, according to the time which he had diligently inquired of the wise men.

    Then was fulfilled that which was spoken by Jeremy the prophet, saying, In Rama was there a voice heard, lamentation, and weeping, and great mourning, Rachel weeping for her children, and would not be comforted, because they are not."

    Therefore we have irrefutable proof that children who died before passing the age of two will be restored to their parents.

    Mark Osgatharp
     
    #1 Mark Osgatharp, Sep 14, 2005
  2. bapmom

    bapmom New Member

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    I think thats stretching it a bit, Mark.

    The end of the prophecy in Israel seems to me to be switching to refer to the children of Israel coming back into their own land....not the specific children of Bethlehem being restored to their mothers.

    I just don't think thats what its saying.
     
    #2 bapmom, Sep 14, 2005
  3. Helen

    Helen <img src =/Helen2.gif>

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    bapmom, many prophecies were 'double headed', with two meanings. You could both easily be correct.
     
    #3 Helen, Sep 14, 2005
  4. Mark Osgatharp

    Mark Osgatharp New Member

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    Bapmom,

    The promise is of Israel coming into their own land, which will be in the resurrection (see Ezekiel chapters 36-38). The promise is that the children murdered by Herod will be restored to thier mothers.

    What comfort would it be to some grieving mother of Israel, whose baby had been murdered by Herod, that someone elses children who had not even been yet born would some day inhabit the land?

    The promise is so clear and plain and glorious I can't imagine anyone not believing it.

    Mark Osgatharp
     
    #4 Mark Osgatharp, Sep 14, 2005
  5. bapmom

    bapmom New Member

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    Well,

    maybe I will have to look at it more, myself.
     
    #5 bapmom, Sep 14, 2005
  6. TexasSky

    TexasSky Guest

    Mark's interpretation makes sense to me.
    Christ Himself said that we need to become like children.
     
    #6 TexasSky, Sep 16, 2005
  7. StraightAndNarrow

    StraightAndNarrow Active Member

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    Doesn't Mathew merely say that the first part of the scripture in Jeremiah, that the children of Rama were killed, was fulfilled? Why didn't he mention the promise of God?

    Are we saying that all children under the age of 2 are saved or only those with Christian parents? What would be the scriptural for the latter? What if one parent were Christian and the other an atheist? What if the child were conceived in sin?

    In other words, it's still not clear to me what happens to those who die as young children.
     
    #7 StraightAndNarrow, Sep 19, 2005
  8. Paul33

    Paul33 New Member

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    1 Cor. 7:14
     
    #8 Paul33, Sep 19, 2005
  9. StraightAndNarrow

    StraightAndNarrow Active Member

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    1Cr 7:12 But to the rest speak I, not the Lord: If any brother hath a wife that believeth not, and she be pleased to dwell with him, let him not put her away.
    1Cr 7:13 And the woman which hath an husband that believeth not, and if he be pleased to dwell with her, let her not leave him.
    1Cr 7:14 For the unbelieving husband is sanctified by the wife, and the unbelieving wife is sanctified by the husband: else were your children unclean; but now are they holy.
    1Cr 7:15 But if the unbelieving depart, let him depart. A brother or a sister is not under bondage in such [cases]: but God hath called us to peace.

    This is talking about separation and divorce and the reason why a believer should remain with an unbeliever (so they can be converted). Their children would then be holy because they have (two) Christian parents. Holy in this sense does not mean Christian. Children are not Christians because their parents are Christians.

    I believe this still leaves us with the issue of which children would be saved by God should they die young. Another related question is what is the age of accountability?
     
    #9 StraightAndNarrow, Sep 20, 2005
  10. Dr. Bob

    Dr. Bob Administrator
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    Makes Herod the Great a better soul winner than I am. :(
     
    #10 Dr. Bob, Sep 20, 2005
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