Is Lordship Salvation (LS) A Logical...?

Well let me take up the challenge and see if my initial response has some weight. Frankly I summoned the response rather casually and quickly so if it lacks weight, then let that be a lesson learned for me to be more thorough in answering such significant matters.

On the other hand, if through discovery I reveal the validity of the strong connection, then the thumbs up will be in order (and do not fret, if no one gives me the thumbs up it has been resentfully pointed out that I am all too happy to reward myself with such iconic platitudes :laugh: ). Give me the next 24 hours to work on it. My lovely and I have dinner and a movie this evening and tomorrow after worship I am sure I can invest more time.

In the mean time, while I still have a few minutes, I will begin processing some thoughts and engage in some discovery to see if my theological instinct was reasonably on target.

 

Well, from John MacArthur (Perseverance) the following is stated:

John MacArthur, the most significant proponent of LS (he calls it a pejorative description) equates it to the doctrine of perseverance. I'd say that this recognition, coming from his own lips and connecting how he teaches the gospel to be "nothing other than the doctrine of perseverance" is rather weighty regarding the connection between the two.

But to be sure, MacArthur refers in direct contrast in this treatment of perseverance, to that which is antithetical to his position; that being what he labels "radical easy-believism".

Thanks John and hey I still have half an hour before the movie!

 

And I to think I imagined my discovery taking until tomorrow. Oh well, now I have The Angelic Conflict...conflict...to resolve. :laugh:

 

Something I learned about this whole debate was how sharply the division line is between LS and non-LS was related to the differences between Reformed or Calvinistic Theology and Dispensationalism.
Apparantly some have seen the dispensational understanding of God's covenants as being unconditional being related to a lack of covenantal obligation with regard to salvation.
I can provide a quote from Gentry's book, but it's lengthy and I'm lazy.

Obviously, MacArthur along with a few others would be dispensational and LS, but that is apparantly not the norm for the LS side.

 

and

I'll give you a :thumbs: for finding the quote so quickly and for quoting him fully and in context. Well done.
peace to youraying:

 

His church's doctrinal statement reads like dispensationalism as opposed to historic premil.
It teaches a pre-trib rapture and a distinction between Israel and the church.
Is that historic premil?

 

J.M. calls himself a leaky Dispensationalist .

 

MacArthur uses dispensational schematics but does not identify with the body and movement of "Dispensationalists" that has developed over the last 50 years, so I am certain that using the description of "Dispensationalist" in describing MacArthur would include too many views he does retain in his theological teachings.

 

And does it teach a pre-trib rapture as well?
I thought that they have a different timing for the rapture than dispensationalists.

 

Yes, he believes in a pre-trib rapture in the same manner as other dispensationalists.
Just as there are different groups of Calvinists there are different groups with regard toward dispensational theology. Many like the Charismatic groups on TV have taken beyond the biblical understanding and study into the twilight zone. Yet, unfortunately it is the minority who is typically used by other views to bash that view and proclaim THIS is what they ALL believe when in fact it is not close in most cases.

I taught a verse by verse through Rev (took a little over a year and are about to finish up soon) for our Wed Night bible study group and the main person I used as both a guide and study check is J. MacAuthur. I agree with 95 to 97% of his view and is what I have been taught as a Non-Cal in church and studied in School.