Let's HANG Mel Gibson!

[blackbird]

Amen_corner!

My beef isn't with Rick or Billy or Mel! My beef is with unsound doctrine!

Titus 2:1 says, "But speak thou the things which become sound doctrine."

I want to preach in such a way---that when I pick up the "spiritual" telephone---I've got Jesus on the other line! And the only way to do that is to stay between the lines----from Genesis 1:1 to Revelation 22:21! If it isn't between those lines---leave it alone!

IOW---Jesus doesn't speak to us through a "Party Line"---but through a Direct line! No mystisism! No voodoo! No wild, unexplainable vision---"Well, it might or might not be, we don't know!" kind of stuff---but just pure unadulterated words from the Word!

 

[NaasPreacher (C4K)]

David,

You are doing a superb job stating what I feel is a biblical approach. Just to let you know that I am behind you.

Roger

 

[North Carolina Tentmaker]

Those of you who have big problems with the historical and Biblical inaccuracies of this film (which I find very minor), just wait for the sequels. This movie has made major money. Here is a prediction for you to see if I have the gift of prophecy.

Hollywood is going to come out with a pile of "Bible" films in the next couple years trying to cash in on what they see as an untapped market. However, the hollywood elite will change all the stories, deviate from the word of God, and make the films 'better' in their minds. Then the movies will bomb because they will stink. Then the producers will be bewildered why.

Just wait for the parody films to come out. I can't wait to see a musical comedy with Ben Stiller and Owen Wilson as 'James and John, Sons of Thunder.' Perhaps there will be a guest appearance of Snoop Dog as the prophet Isaiah, now that will be something to see.

 

[onestand]

I've come to the conclusion that those who oppose The Passion may continue to do so. It certainly does not change my thoughts and opinion of the movie, I felt and still feel it was a wonderful movie and I appreciate Mel for creating it.

 

[LadyEagle]

Well, ya'll might as well throw the hymn "Just as I Am" out, after you hang Mel. Rip it out of the Hymn Book. And don't forget "Amazing Grace," either - that one sure needs to go. Mel should have been perfect and made a perfect movie. Me, too. I'm waiting for my "perfection" to arrive before I try to share my faith. Jesus said He didn't come into the world to condemn the world - (John 3) - but He didn't say His followers couldn't condemn anyone, so carry on!

On further thought, most of the songs in the Baptist Hymnal will have to go, ripped out & burned, since they weren't penned by Baptists. A nix on "When the Roll is called up Yonder" where in the Bible does it say anything about a roll? The Bible says Lambs Book of Life, not a Roll! And "When we all get to Heaven" - not everyone is going to heaven, that is unscriptural! And don't get me started about Bill Gaither - and the King is Coming!

Where did these song writers get off with their disgusting creative liberty with theology - how dare they!

People are really being deceived by some of these hymns - it's time for the apostate church to wake up! Spew. Spew. [/sarcasm]

 

[dianetavegia]

YES YES YES LadyEagle! Exactly what I was talking about! I challenge all those 'if it's not in the Bible, God's can't use it' folk to head over to www.cyberhymnal.org and look up your favorites. Check them closely to make sure all the statements are right in the Bible cause you MIGHT NOT BE SAVED IF YOU WENT FORWARD TO MOST OF THEM.

I certainly hope NONE of you read the 'Left Behind' series. It's got some things that are extra Biblical! I heard tell of a pre-teen whose grandmother promised to buy him a Harry Potter collection if he's first read the 'Left Behind' series for teens. He got saved and then asked her NOT to buy Harry Potter. I'd better track her down and tell her he's NOT SAVED!

Now... we need to stop going to those Beth Moore seminars and studying her books cause she gives her own opinons and interprets things .... Gosh I know none of our 'not in the Bible people' would ever allow her books to be okay while hanging Mel Gibson!

Super Sarcasm intended!

Diane

 

[LadyEagle]

My nails are chipped. Must redo them this evening. I know, I know. But I'm one of those sinners Jesus came to seek & save - chipped nail polish and all.

 

[NaasPreacher (C4K)]

Well the sarcasm of this thread has convinced me that I will go to see the film when it comes out here the 25th.

 

[amen_corner]

Blackbird...

All thinking believers know about the messed up theology of this movie. Too many people are preaching to the choir. All these evangelicals that people are upset at for endorsing the movie aren't endorsing Catholic theology, as much as some people want to believe. They are endorsing the fact that people have an opportunity to see a film portraying the cross like never before. All those people who say it isn't "inaccurate" are simply referring to the fact that the Bible affirms that Jesus died on the cross. The Bible gives witness to Caiaphas, Pilate, Herod, the disciples, etc. But come on.

My beef is that so much energy has been wasted butchering this film, that any honest criticism has now been transformed into an obsession. There is warped theology in every expression of art, whether it be film, paint, sculpture, writings, whatever. The only pure theology is found in Scripture...and that is conditionally on which version of the Bible you use!

Why then spend all this time getting redfaced over something that everybody already knows? Does anyone really believe that Billy Graham has been duped? Does anyone really believe that those in the SBC have completely lost their theological compass, and have become covert evangelists for the Catholic church?

Everybody on this board has put their stamp of approval on something that was not theologically correct, albeit not always intentionally. In fact, I would be willing to bet that someone, anyone, from this board could inspect the home of any random poster, ANY poster, and point the finger and say, "blasphemy!" We could examine refrigerators, pantrys, checkbooks, TV channels, bookshelves, CD racks, artwork, etc, etc. I say it's time to drop the stones and reexamine our calling to transform the culture with the Gospel.

 

[uhdum]

Originally posted by amen_corner:
Blackbird...

All thinking believers know about the messed up theology of this movie. Too many people are preaching to the choir. All these evangelicals that people are upset at for endorsing the movie aren't endorsing Catholic theology, as much as some people want to believe. They are endorsing the fact that people have an opportunity to see a film portraying the cross like never before. All those people who say it isn't "inaccurate" are simply referring to the fact that the Bible affirms that Jesus died on the cross. The Bible gives witness to Caiaphas, Pilate, Herod, the disciples, etc. But come on.

My beef is that so much energy has been wasted butchering this film, that any honest criticism has now been transformed into an obsession. There is warped theology in every expression of art, whether it be film, paint, sculpture, writings, whatever. The only pure theology is found in Scripture...and that is conditionally on which version of the Bible you use!

Why then spend all this time getting redfaced over something that everybody already knows? Does anyone really believe that Billy Graham has been duped? Does anyone really believe that those in the SBC have completely lost their theological compass, and have become covert evangelists for the Catholic church?

Everybody on this board has put their stamp of approval on something that was not theologically correct, albeit not always intentionally. In fact, I would be willing to bet that someone, anyone, from this board could inspect the home of any random poster, ANY poster, and point the finger and say, "blasphemy!" We could examine refrigerators, pantrys, checkbooks, TV channels, bookshelves, CD racks, artwork, etc, etc. I say it's time to drop the stones and reexamine our calling to transform the culture with the Gospel.

Well said... amen!

 

[Elijah]

Originally posted by vaspers:
And some are obsessed with defending a heretical, violence-lovers, mystical nonsense movie.

If the shoe fits wear it, including me.

Dear Christian friend Elijah, look at what yer online namesake did. He was a controversial guy. He shook up the traditional religious pew potatoes.

I will not "get over it." Expressing my honest opinions, in as gentle a manner as I can, whilst remaining firm and provocative, is FUN.

One must be unique and provocative online, or one will disappear. Web blogs are not for the timid or those who crave to "fit in" with the mainstream. Online communities have always been the home of provocative eccentric mavericks.
Like the Bible Elijah and Elisha and Jeremiah.

All I'm saying is if you evaluate The Passion by strict Biblical standards, and still rave about it, more power to you.

But if you simply say, "It made me weep into my popcorn. It was stunning. Now I finally appreciate what Christ suffered for me (God's Word alone wasn't enuff). What an exciting film. Great music. Great cinematic photography. Great acting. Great sub-titles. Great surrealistic special effects." ......

....then you may be in danger of using the wrong standard to judge spiritual things.

That's all I meant.

Peace, Joy, and Love in Christ!

Vaspers, Of course the Word of God is enoughh to lead a person to Christ (I preach from nothing but the word). But what of those who dont go to church that see this movie out of curiosity, and it lights a spark in them to check a little deeper into this Jesus that the movie is based on? Mel is a Catholic, you cant blame him for seeing things from a Catholic perspective. We should be a little more carefull about using words like "heretical" to define things we oppose (thats a pretty strong word). Would the movie "the ten commandments" fit your criteria for a Biblical movie? Not in every detail, but, I still think it was great.
And I am by no means a mystical violence lover, nor am I an eccentric maverick, and could really care less if this makes me disappear online. what I meant by "get over it" is you just seem to be a bit overly obsessed with this. Shouldnt let it get to you so. If you dont like it dont watch it, simple as that, but,,,there has been some good come as a result of this movie, and God bless Mel for taking the financial risk that he did in making it. I believe the Lord has blessed him accordingly. And thats my "opinion" and I'm sticking to it.
And Vaspers...Have a good day!

 

[Phillip]

Originally posted by Elijah:
Vaspers, Of course the Word of God is enoughh to lead a person to Christ (I preach from nothing but the word). But what of those who dont go to church that see this movie out of curiosity, and it lights a spark in them to check a little deeper into this Jesus that the movie is based on? Mel is a Catholic, you cant blame him for seeing things from a Catholic perspective. We should be a little more carefull about using words like "heretical" to define things we oppose (thats a pretty strong word). Would the movie "the ten commandments" fit your criteria for a Biblical movie? Not in every detail, but, I still think it was great.
And I am by no means a mystical violence lover, nor am I an eccentric maverick, and could really care less if this makes me disappear online. what I meant by "get over it" is you just seem to be a bit overly obsessed with this. Shouldnt let it get to you so. If you dont like it dont watch it, simple as that, but,,,there has been some good come as a result of this movie, and God bless Mel for taking the financial risk that he did in making it. I believe the Lord has blessed him accordingly. And thats my "opinion" and I'm sticking to it.
And Vaspers...Have a good day!

Amen and Amen!

I do not understand why people cannot see the opportunity to discuss Christ with millions of people. We would rather bash the film.

The United States is in a LOT more trouble than a movie made by Mel that has some Catholic icons in it. "Oh yeah, Jesus wiped his face on a cloth." "Oooooooh, Mary kissed Jesus' foot while on the cross" (Wasn't kissing someone's foot a sign a respect in the NT?) Oh, what a horrible assasination to our doctrine of Christ!

I'm not a preacher, so witnessing, especially one-on-one does not come easy for me. This film has opened an opportunity for me as a witness. Giving me an opportunity to discuss Jesus with non-believer friends without the stigma of talking about Christianity in todays modern work climate.

I will say one thing. If any of you Passion smashers are asked a question (by a co-worker or other non-believer) about this Jesus that was in this Mel Gibson movie and you spend most of your time explaining to them how the film got things "all wrong" -- because there were some Catholic things in the movie, then you have just lost that opportunity to show the real Lord and Savior to your friend.

I highly suggest you leave the film bashing with your other Christian friends and when your co-worker asks you about that movie about that Jesus that got whipped and mangled that you jump right in there and ask them if they know why Jesus had to suffer so much, and why he had to die.....Then, you could almost count on it that you can reach for your Bible, without being scorned, and that person will most likely listen to you explain how He gave his life for everybody who believes on him.

When you are dead and in heaven, which question do you think Jesus might ask you?:

1)"Did you go see that corrupt, new-age, Catholic movie by that Mel guy that showed all the gore of my beating in Jerusalem?"

Or do you think Jesus might ask you:

2)"Your old friend, Fred, over at the factory died last night and went to hell. I remember about ten years ago when you were alive, that he asked you about that Mel Gibson movie he saw and you told him that it was all New-age, Catholic blasphemy. He was searching for ME, why did you not lead him thus? Did I die just for you?"

Folks, whether we LIKE IT or NOT, MILLIONS are going to see this movie-------how WE ACT and use the opportunity...I think we just might be held accountable.

John 9:49 And John answered and said, Master, we saw one casting out devils in THY name; and we forbad him, because he was NOT WITH US.
John 9:50 And Jesus said unto him, "Forbid him not: for he that is not against us is for us."

I was also quite shocked at the post that mentioned the person wanted to not hear non-believers and wanted a straight line to God without non-believer influence. As Jesus said .....come down from that tree, sinner, I'm going to dine at YOUR house today!

 

[Elijah]

Originally posted by Phillip:
]

Amen and Amen!

I do not understand why people cannot see the opportunity to discuss Christ with millions of people. We would rather bash the film.

The United States is in a LOT more trouble than a movie made by Mel that has some Catholic icons in it. "Oh yeah, Jesus wiped his face on a cloth." "Oooooooh, Mary kissed Jesus' foot while on the cross" (Wasn't kissing someone's foot a sign a respect in the NT?) Oh, what a horrible assasination to our doctrine of Christ!

I'm not a preacher, so witnessing, especially one-on-one does not come easy for me. This film has opened an opportunity for me as a witness. Giving me an opportunity to discuss Jesus with non-believer friends without the stigma of talking about Christianity in todays modern work climate.

I will say one thing. If any of you Passion smashers are asked a question (by a co-worker or other non-believer) about this Jesus that was in this Mel Gibson movie and you spend most of your time explaining to them how the film got things "all wrong" -- because there were some Catholic things in the movie, then you have just lost that opportunity to show the real Lord and Savior to your friend.

I highly suggest you leave the film bashing with your other Christian friends and when your co-worker asks you about that movie about that Jesus that got whipped and mangled that you jump right in there and ask them if they know why Jesus had to suffer so much, and why he had to die.....Then, you could almost count on it that you can reach for your Bible, without being scorned, and that person will most likely listen to you explain how He gave his life for everybody who believes on him.

When you are dead and in heaven, which question do you think Jesus might ask you?:

1)"Did you go see that corrupt, new-age, Catholic movie by that Mel guy that showed all the gore of my beating in Jerusalem?"

Or do you think Jesus might ask you:

2)"Your old friend, Fred, over at the factory died last night and went to hell. I remember about ten years ago when you were alive, that he asked you about that Mel Gibson movie he saw and you told him that it was all New-age, Catholic blasphemy. He was searching for ME, why did you not lead him thus? Did I die just for you?"

Folks, whether we LIKE IT or NOT, MILLIONS are going to see this movie-------how WE ACT and use the opportunity...I think we just might be held accountable.

John 9:49 And John answered and said, Master, we saw one casting out devils in THY name; and we forbad him, because he was NOT WITH US.
John 9:50 And Jesus said unto him, "Forbid him not: for he that is not against us is for us."

I was also quite shocked at the post that mentioned the person wanted to not hear non-believers and wanted a straight line to God without non-believer influence. As Jesus said .....come down from that tree, sinner, I'm going to dine at YOUR house today! [/QB][/QUOTE]

Not a preacher huh? That sounds like part of a pretty good sermon to me.

Excelent points that you make, and do keep the positive attitude, you will be a much more effective force for Christ that way.
P.S.- P.M. me some time, I am very familiar with your home church and know people who go there.

 

[vaspers]

I, and other Anti-Passionites, as far as I can recall, have never declared that opportunities to witness are to be neglected, or shunned...

...when has any Anti-Passionite said, "I refuse to witness to any lost soul who sees this film and asks me questions about it!" ??????

but I have said that The Passion is going to make witnessing HARDER, not easier. What? How can this be so? Unbelievable! Why "harder"???

If you love Mel Gibson and his fringe cultish church and big action-packed Hellywood movies with non-biblical weirdnesses and ultra-violence with no real context...

...by all means, go see the Passion film a hundred million times.

If you think The Passion is a great "evangelism tool" then take billions of lost souls to it, and spend years explaining, "No, that's not what really happened, Mel added that. No, Mary did not suffer with Christ in any Co-Redeemer sense, Mel implied that. No, Jesus did not dangle on a chain from a cliff, that's Mel's morbid Jesus-despising imagination. No, Mary would not have kissed the feet of a dead or dying Christ,getting blood in her mouth like a vampire, that's from masochist Emmerich's psychotic delirium. No, the Bible describes that scene differently from the film's version. No. No. No. No. No. No....etc."

I got better tings ta dewwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww.

 

[Elijah]

Vaspers my friend, you miss my point entirely, and dont believe that I could explain it any clearer. Debate is a good thing, but in this case , we both got our minds made up. But hey, I did find something I agreed with you on, on another thread. Wow! common ground for Elijah and Vaspers, what is the world coming to?

 

[Phillip]

Originally posted by vaspers:
I, and other Anti-Passionites, as far as I can recall, have never declared that opportunities to witness are to be neglected, or shunned...

...when has any Anti-Passionite said, "I refuse to witness to any lost soul who sees this film and asks me questions about it!" ??????

but I have said that The Passion is going to make witnessing HARDER, not easier. What? How can this be so? Unbelievable! Why "harder"???

If you love Mel Gibson and his fringe cultish church and big action-packed Hellywood movies with non-biblical weirdnesses and ultra-violence with no real context...

...by all means, go see the Passion film a hundred million times.

If you think The Passion is a great "evangelism tool" then take billions of lost souls to it, and spend years explaining, "No, that's not what really happened, Mel added that. No, Mary did not suffer with Christ in any Co-Redeemer sense, Mel implied that. No, Jesus did not dangle on a chain from a cliff, that's Mel's morbid Jesus-despising imagination. No, Mary would not have kissed the feet of a dead or dying Christ,getting blood in her mouth like a vampire, that's from masochist Emmerich's psychotic delirium. No, the Bible describes that scene differently from the film's version. No. No. No. No. No. No....etc."

I got better tings ta dewwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww.

First of all, don't give me your song and dance about "you guys never said that you would use the opportunity to witness". The reason I say that is that I have brought up that "opportunity" many times and all I get is "how corrupt that film is". I know exactly how you are going to respond to someone who asks you about that film. NEGATIVELY and then that person asking you the questions is going to turn you off...in their mind, RIGHT THEN!

In fact, you actually said two different things when you said you would use the opportunity to witness, then you turned around and siad "take your billions of lost to see it, blah blah blah".

Okay, let me ask, are you a preacher or a worker in the secular world? (This is not an insult, because it very well may be possible that if you are a preacher, you do not realize that discussing Jesus on the job is now a MAJOR problem.) To me, it HAS made witnessing easier. I've been there? How many people have asked you about the movie?

Our church did just that with its youth, but it wasn't billions, it was about eight. They brought their lost friends. Before they went our youth minister read the story out of the Bible that they would see. THey saw the movie and returned to the church. They were served pizza (okay, okay, ya gotta do that with kids today) and our pastor then lead several to the Lord. They will be Baptized next week and I don't recall the pastor having to explain anything to any of them except that it was not in the Bible that Jesus talked with Satan in the garden of Geth. but that Mel was using symbolism to show Jesus bruise the head of the serpeant. Mel also used that particular scene for Satan to ask Jesus how he thought one man could die on the cross and save the sin of all mankind....this was his way of showing what the film was all about. (Unless, you were getting popcorn at the time.)

Now, explain to me specificially what would be so difficult to explain to the lost and while you are doing that you have just let me know that you are not going to bother to take the time to take someone to the show and explain it to them. Are those teenager's souls worth it? If eight were saved? If three were saved? If ONE was saved?

Be specific, just WHAT are you going to have to spend all of your time and effort correcting about the movie to a lost person, before you can lead them to Christ?

 

[Phillip]

Originally posted by vaspers:

I got better tings ta dewwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww.

Then I assume you are out witnessing right now.

 

[Elijah]

I hope I dont break any BB rules here (feel free to edit this post if need be) but I recieved an extra hatefull e mail from one Tim Bunyan, who I have never corresponded with before. I do not appreciate hate full e mails being sent to my personall e mail adress. I enjoy a good debate (just ask Vaspers). But please keep it on the BB.
Below is that e mail that I recieved. Again if this breaks any BB rule then by all means edit;


"Faith comes by hearing, not by seeing
a stinking movie.
It seems to be just another ecumenical
attempt to bring in the New World One
World Religion.
In Isaiah 52:14 the bible says that His
visage was so marred more than any man, this stinking Hollywood movie
crowd still has no idea of the real suff-
erings of the cross.
And no where in the Bible does it tell
the worldly lost crowd to go and tell
the Gospel nor for God`s people to flock
to it in droves. Just imagine what all
that money wasted on that stinking
movie could do in the hands of a bible
believing missionary!
My bible still says in I Corin. 1:21 that
God is pleased only by the Preaching
of the gospel...that`s what God chose .
Man chose movies, plays and so-called
"Christian" rock concerts. Those things
are enough to make Jesus vomit.
II Corin. 6:17 Wherefore come out from among them, and be ye separate ,
saith the Lord... This world says come on in and join us while we mock the bible and make Mel Gibson rich... I think it
ought to be done God`s way.


The real Jesus of the KJB
Bro. Tim Bynum
John637vhbc@wmconnect.com

 

[uhdum]

Originally posted by Phillip:

First of all, don't give me your song and dance about "you guys never said that you would use the opportunity to witness". The reason I say that is that I have brought up that "opportunity" many times and all I get is "how corrupt that film is". I know exactly how you are going to respond to someone who asks you about that film. NEGATIVELY and then that person asking you the questions is going to turn you off...in their mind, RIGHT THEN!

In fact, you actually said two different things when you said you would use the opportunity to witness, then you turned around and siad "take your billions of lost to see it, blah blah blah".

Okay, let me ask, are you a preacher or a worker in the secular world? (This is not an insult, because it very well may be possible that if you are a preacher, you do not realize that discussing Jesus on the job is now a MAJOR problem.) To me, it HAS made witnessing easier. I've been there? How many people have asked you about the movie?

Our church did just that with its youth, but it wasn't billions, it was about eight. They brought their lost friends. Before they went our youth minister read the story out of the Bible that they would see. THey saw the movie and returned to the church. They were served pizza (okay, okay, ya gotta do that with kids today) and our pastor then lead several to the Lord. They will be Baptized next week and I don't recall the pastor having to explain anything to any of them except that it was not in the Bible that Jesus talked with Satan in the garden of Geth. but that Mel was using symbolism to show Jesus bruise the head of the serpeant. Mel also used that particular scene for Satan to ask Jesus how he thought one man could die on the cross and save the sin of all mankind....this was his way of showing what the film was all about. (Unless, you were getting popcorn at the time.)

Now, explain to me specificially what would be so difficult to explain to the lost and while you are doing that you have just let me know that you are not going to bother to take the time to take someone to the show and explain it to them. Are those teenager's souls worth it? If eight were saved? If three were saved? If ONE was saved?

Be specific, just WHAT are you going to have to spend all of your time and effort correcting about the movie to a lost person, before you can lead them to Christ?

Wonderful post, Phillip.. you are right on!

God bless!

 

[texmedic]

Guess we better throw our bibles out. They are not perfect, only in the origional autograph. Guess we better throw out all the pastors too.... they are not perfect........ where do we stop? If anyone is going to evangelize then they better be perfect? Give me a break. Tex