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Protestants still follow the pope
- Thread starter Gerhard Ebersoehn
- Start date
Were you but so observant when you read the Scriptures!
Bro Tony said:
GE:
Yes, I admit, given how we have become brain-washed.
BobRyan
Well-Known Member
Amy.G said:
Agreed. Week day one is a good day for each individual to store up savings.
Agreed - a farewell service was held one time in Acts -- on week day one.
In Acts 2 we are told that they met every single day to break bread "from house to house".
Agreed. On Week day one - Christ was risen.
And in Acts 13 "Sabbath AFTER Sabbath" they came together to hear the Word of God in a formal worship service.
in Christ,
Bob
tragic_pizza
New Member
Quick survey:
People whose minds have been changed by the 100,000 threads on Saturday or Sunday being the day of worship: Zero.
Please just agree that one side or the other is wrong, and let's talk about something interesting for a change.
People whose minds have been changed by the 100,000 threads on Saturday or Sunday being the day of worship: Zero.
Please just agree that one side or the other is wrong, and let's talk about something interesting for a change.
Amy.G said:
GE:
LIE! There is NOTHING of "Now when He rose early on the first day of the week, they came to the tomb when the sun had risen." NOTHING, of either: "...when He rose early on the first day of the week" or, "they came to the tomb when the sun had risen" in KJV - or in the Greek. DOUBLE L_I_E!
tragic_pizza said:
GE:
How wrong you are! You may not (I say 'may not', because I don't believe you) know about them.
And it's not that the subject does not interest you - otherwise you would not have made this post and others - you simply don't have anything to contribute. You FEAR it! But fear won't rid you of its irritation. It will haunt you like a repeating nightmare to your death-bed.
What are you talking about?????Gerhard Ebersoehn said:
Mark 16:9 (King James Version)
Now when Jesus was risen early the first day of the week, he appeared first to Mary Magdalene, out of whom he had cast seven devils.
Mark 16:9 (New King James Version)
Now when He rose early on the first day of the week, He appeared first to Mary Magdalene, out of whom He had cast seven demons.
Mark 16:9 (Holman Christian Standard Bible)
Early on the first day of the week, after He had risen, He appeared first to Mary Magdalene, out of whom He had driven seven demons.
Mark 16:9 (English Standard Version)
Now when he rose early on the first day of the week, he appeared first to Mary Magdalene, from whom he had cast out seven demons.
Mark 16:9 (New American Standard Bible)
Now after He had risen early on the first day of the week, He first appeared to Mary Magdalene, from whom He had cast out seven demons.
BobRyan:
"Agreed - a farewell service was held one time in Acts -- on week day one."
GE:
Agreed - a farewell MEETING CONTINUED this time in Acts -- on week day one. REASON: Paul's departure the next morning - travelling business-like it sounds like! SAYS NOTHING of "CONGREGATING FOR HOLY COMMUNION" 'on week day one' though. It - the Perfect implemented - IMPLIES though, that one 'meeting' had begun the day before - on the Sabbath week day seven - and its result - "being together still" - lasted through into the present of "the evening (it) having been of the First Day".
"Agreed - a farewell service was held one time in Acts -- on week day one."
GE:
Agreed - a farewell MEETING CONTINUED this time in Acts -- on week day one. REASON: Paul's departure the next morning - travelling business-like it sounds like! SAYS NOTHING of "CONGREGATING FOR HOLY COMMUNION" 'on week day one' though. It - the Perfect implemented - IMPLIES though, that one 'meeting' had begun the day before - on the Sabbath week day seven - and its result - "being together still" - lasted through into the present of "the evening (it) having been of the First Day".
Amy.G said:
GE:
What are you talking about?????
I am NOT talking about anything you have here properly quoted. I am talking of the misquote used literally in the posts I responeded to; They are two different things altogether!
BR:
"Agreed. Week day one is a good day for each individual to store up savings."
GE:
Agreed! And why? Because they wouldn't use the Sabbath for money work, but for worship, and the First Day of the week offered the first opportunity for doing as Paul advised the believers.
Nice to find something we two could really agree on!
"Agreed. Week day one is a good day for each individual to store up savings."
GE:
Agreed! And why? Because they wouldn't use the Sabbath for money work, but for worship, and the First Day of the week offered the first opportunity for doing as Paul advised the believers.
Nice to find something we two could really agree on!
Amy.G said:
GE:
Then kindly explain me wrong re Mt28:1 and all the rest of the Scriptures concerning "God thus concerning the Seventh Day having spoken"?
Then explain to me how God exercising the exceeding greatness of His power when He raised Christ from the dead, is not God "on the Seventh Day finish(ing) ALL His works? Is not "God on the Seventh Day reviv(ing)"?
Quote - it doesn't matter whose! :
"I mixed up two verses"
GE:
Herein we see the universal blunder, from pope to pauper commit; the pope consciously; the poor in the sheer ignorance of their poverty. For the pope as a judgment unto himself; for the pigmies to their justification.
What do we see herein: All the so-called 'resurrection-Scriptures' thrown into one hat, and as they are drawn, put together to make up one story of one and the same event at one and the same moment in time. A mess, made of it. A mess we are commanded to believe and teach. No thanks!
"I mixed up two verses"
GE:
Herein we see the universal blunder, from pope to pauper commit; the pope consciously; the poor in the sheer ignorance of their poverty. For the pope as a judgment unto himself; for the pigmies to their justification.
What do we see herein: All the so-called 'resurrection-Scriptures' thrown into one hat, and as they are drawn, put together to make up one story of one and the same event at one and the same moment in time. A mess, made of it. A mess we are commanded to believe and teach. No thanks!
Nothing??Gerhard Ebersoehn said:
Acts 20:7-12 And upon the first day of the week, when the disciples came together to break bread, Paul preached unto them, ready to depart on the morrow; and continued his speech until midnight. And there were many lights in the upper chamber, where they were gathered together. And there sat in a window a certain young man named Eutychus, being fallen into a deep sleep: and as Paul was long preaching, he sunk down with sleep, and fell down from the third loft, and was taken up dead. And Paul went down, and fell on him, and embracing him said, Trouble not yourselves; for his life is in him. When he therefore was come up again, and had broken bread, and eaten, and talked a long while, even till break of day, so he departed. And they brought the young man alive, and were not a little comforted.
No business meeting here. There are but two things mentioned: preaching and the breaking of bread (Communion). Someone is not reading their Bible's very careful.
I wonder, will someone remind me why it is so important to observe Saturday as the Lord's day and not Sunday? For as far as I know the Sabbath was made for ma and not man for the Sabbath. Therefore the very institution of one day in seven was for "rest". In that our bodies need rest and that this rest includes spiritual rest in prayer and worship of God. So does it really matter what day that rest is? After all the original command was for Israel. Unless you think that the Lord brought us out of the land of Egypt as it states in the law.
Also I think the evidence does show that the early fathers (correct me if I'm wrong) also observed the first day of the week (the Lord's day) as their holy day. I admit it is tradition for Christians to recognise Sunday as the Christian Sabbath. Mainly because it was also the day of Pentecost. Or the 50th day after the Passover, when also the Holy Spirit came down upon the Church. (Leviticus 23:15-16)
Also I think the evidence does show that the early fathers (correct me if I'm wrong) also observed the first day of the week (the Lord's day) as their holy day. I admit it is tradition for Christians to recognise Sunday as the Christian Sabbath. Mainly because it was also the day of Pentecost. Or the 50th day after the Passover, when also the Holy Spirit came down upon the Church. (Leviticus 23:15-16)
BobRyan
Well-Known Member
grahame said:
In Exodus 16 God tells Israel "Tomorrow is the Sabbath" ... Manna fell for 6 days but not on "THE" seventh day.
So in Exodus 20 instead of God saying "Pick one day in Seven and then rest on the day you so choose - He says remember THE Sabbath day to KEEP it holy".
In Genesis 2 God says "HE BLESSED the Seventh day -- He Sanctified it and made IT Holy".
Your argument seems to be "He blessed the IDEA of one day in seven being for rest now select the day of your choosing" - correct?
Notice that on the first day of the week we celebrate the resurrection of Christ -- Question - what day comes BEFORE the WEEK-Day One?
Using Exegesis - the understanding of the author and the audience WHICH day of the week was being referenced when Christ said "THE SABBATH was MADE for mankind"? Do we have ANY indication that the Jews of that time took this to mean "pick some day in seven as your day of rest"???
Then why is it so well "accepted" to make stuff up when it comes to this topic as if we did not know anything at all about sound principles of Exegesis when it comes to Bible study??
First of all no text in all of scripture says "week-day-one is the Lord's Day". But we do have Mark 2:28 "The Son of Man is LORD of the Sabbath" and we do have Isaiah 58 telling us that the Sabbath is "the Holy Day of the LORD". (but then that is just scripture)
You have done well to recognize that what is done today is a man-made tradition set in place of the 4th commandment.
But that takes us to Mark 7 where Christ condemns the practice of replacing the commandments of God with man-made traditions does it not?
In Christ,
Bob
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BobRyan
Well-Known Member
There are 2 classic ways (maybe 3) to turn against Christ the Creator's Sabbath Commandment.
1. Is to use the RC claim that God's Law can be "EDITED" so the Sabbath Commandment can be bent to point to weak-day-one instead of THE Seventh-day.
This version claims to STILL HONOR Christ's Commandment - but just in an edited form. It was the model used in the dark ages.
2. Is to DOWNSIZE the Commandments - claiming not to accept Christ's Sabbath commandment AT ALL!!
DHK gave us a good example of that in his "I prefer the NINE Commandments" over the TEN.
3. Some take version to and add the twist "Whatever is not REPEaTED gets DELETED" as if that was a Bible doctrine that you can use when comparing NT to OT.
Sadly for them - the 3rd commandment is not repeated in the NT but the 4th commandment IS quoted in part in the NT as are many others.
In Christ,
Bob
1. Is to use the RC claim that God's Law can be "EDITED" so the Sabbath Commandment can be bent to point to weak-day-one instead of THE Seventh-day.
This version claims to STILL HONOR Christ's Commandment - but just in an edited form. It was the model used in the dark ages.
2. Is to DOWNSIZE the Commandments - claiming not to accept Christ's Sabbath commandment AT ALL!!
DHK gave us a good example of that in his "I prefer the NINE Commandments" over the TEN.
3. Some take version to and add the twist "Whatever is not REPEaTED gets DELETED" as if that was a Bible doctrine that you can use when comparing NT to OT.
Sadly for them - the 3rd commandment is not repeated in the NT but the 4th commandment IS quoted in part in the NT as are many others.
In Christ,
Bob
You still haven't answered why Pentecost was on a Sunday. This also was set down in the law. Also why do you not recognise that the lawwas clearly for Israel and not for the rest of mankind. This is clear because of what God says at the beginning of the commandments. The law was not written for Gentiles originally, but for Israel. Many things changed with the coming of Christ. For christ is the end of the law for believers. (Rom 10:4)BobRyan said:
In other words he is the fulfilment of the law. Everything is centred in him. He is the resurrection and the life. He also is our rest. He is the eternal Sabbath, the antitype for the shadow which was the Sabbath of the Old Testament.
We have a reference to the Lord's day in Revelation chapter 1.Bob said:
You must come up with an explanation of that if that wasn't the seventh day. If it was the Sabbath as you contend, Then why did not John use the word "Sabbath"? Do Adventist replace the word Sabbath with "Lord's day"? Or do they still use the name Sabbath. I contend that John used the term "Lord's day" because it was the day the Lord rose from the dead, Which logically was the first day of the week and not the Sabbath, or seventh day as some suggest.
Although what I said was tradition. We nevertheless can gain quite a lot from observing what the early church did in the years just after the apostles. ie, the early fathers. When we read the New Testament in fact not much is said about keeping any Sabbath at all. But we do have specific verses that refer to the law in relation to gentiles or non Jews. (Acts 15:5)
(Acts 15:24)
As a passing interest, do you tell people they must be circumcised as well? I'm not sure what the teaching of Adventists is on this? I know that you observe many parts of the law (some indeed pertain to health) which predate scientific discoveries by thousands of years.
(Acts 15:19)
I know this is to do with circumcision. But it does mention the keeping of the law also. My understanding is admittedly a traditional one and we do not have any specific commandment concerning the Sabbath day except that which was given to the Jews in the Law. But the very fact that not much emphasis is seen in the NT about the Sabbath day except in the case of the Jews who had believed really points to the fact that our rest is in Christ He is our rest. Just out of unterest, many of the Puritans kept both the seventh day and the eighth day holy. They kept the seventh in preparation for the eighth. But most of the Old Testament is to do with Israel anyway. The bringing in of the Gentiles. although prophesied in the OT, is only seen when it was revealed to Peter the apostle. Furthermore Paul the apostle used Abraham as an example of salvation without the law for the very fact that salvation is by grace alone. For Abraham was not a Jew. Neither did he keep the law. I can't recall if he every kept one day holy or not. But revelation is progressive and we do not necessarily carry on exactly as they did in those days. After all John does say, "The law was given by Moses, but grace and truth came by Jesus Christ". So there is a natural progression from the old to the new.
We also read in Colossian 2:13-17
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