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Rock and a Hard place

Discussion in 'Pastoral Ministries' started by Jeff Weaver, Apr 12, 2005.

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  1. Jeff Weaver

    Jeff Weaver New Member

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    Howdy

    I seem to be between a rock and a hard place. Here is the deal. I have been filling in in a local church of late, the pastor has a child with serious health problems. Another local fellow has been coming by and expecting to get to preach. (It is our custom, though I realize not many share it). At any rate, this fellow grew up among this church, and they have known him all of his life. They have known me most of my life as well, and I have known the other fellow for 30 years. At any rate, this church has some members who object to the way this fellow delivers his sermon -- not what he says. He jumps around, stomps, claps, etc., and it is loud and very distracting. This church has always been very formal. This preacher wasn't always this way. He lost a son about 15 years ago, and for reasons I cannot comprehend, adopted Pentecostal mannerisms (but not their theology) about that time. Anyway, next meeting time I have been told that if he is allowed to preach, some plan to walk out. I don't want to offend anyone, but fear that will be the inevitable result. I have talked to the pastor about it, and he left it to me to do as I thought best. He is several hundred miles away right now.

    I know how I plan to handle it, but was wondering if anyone here had any ideas. I might learn something and change my mind.

    Help.
     
    #1 Jeff Weaver, Apr 12, 2005
  2. Gershom

    Gershom Active Member

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    Let him preach. I like to see and hear some stompin' and spittin'preaching every once in a while. As for the ones who say they'll walk out, let them know ahead of time. That way they can make plans to stay home and watch the Coral Ridge Hour instead.
     
    #2 Gershom, Apr 12, 2005
  3. Gershom

    Gershom Active Member

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    Can I git an Ameeeen?

    Ameeeen, pre-cher.
     
    #3 Gershom, Apr 12, 2005
  4. exscentric

    exscentric Well-Known Member
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    Personal opinion, the pastor should have made the decision or asked his board to handle it, not a fill in :)

    Since I'd guess you've prayed about it and I'd think the Lord has given you the solution, go for it and let us know how it went when the dust settles :)
     
    #4 exscentric, Apr 12, 2005
  5. Dr. Bob

    Dr. Bob Administrator
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    Pulpiteering antics might have attracted the side-show crowd for Billy Sunday, but have no place today in our churches. God is NOT glorified by jumping off pulpits, kicking microphones, screaming, walking on the backs of pews and other theatrics.

    Why not go to Willow Creek where they can add dancing and drama and pyrotechnics to spice up the preaching?

    What ever happend to proclaiming the Word of God instead of proclaiming the rhetorical skill or clownish antics of the preacher. HE must increase; I must decrease.
     
    #5 Dr. Bob, Apr 12, 2005
  6. go2church

    go2church Active Member
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    I would have to tell the guy BEFORE he showed up expecting to preach. It would be embarassing for him and distracting for the church. You should have those that don't like him call themselves, but if they are going to pull a "walk out" they may not be in the proper place maturity wise to handle this.

    Is there anyway you could ask him to tone it down?
     
    #6 go2church, Apr 12, 2005
  7. Jeff Weaver

    Jeff Weaver New Member

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    Dr. Bob

    Spot on. In fact, my plan of attack is to query this fellow about how Jesus conducted his ministry, and hopefully get him to realize that theatrics weren't part of his earthly minister or those of the apostles, as best I can tell.

    I hope to get him to realize himself that it isn't something that he should be doing, rather than hitting him over the head with a hammer.

    Hopefully it will work. If it doesnt, he will keep his seat, which will no doubt offend him, which I really dont want to do. But it is better to offend him, than those who might be in the pews who haven't grown in grace enough to over look those faults and failures.

    Pray for me. Thanks.
     
    #7 Jeff Weaver, Apr 12, 2005
  8. exscentric

    exscentric Well-Known Member
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    Ahh Dr. Bob you need to get out of Wyoming now and then, you're just behind the times - - - glad somebody is! Every time I say something about the goings on in some groups people just tell me I'm old fashioned - I reply "Yes, so what does that have to do with worship verses chaos :)"
     
    #8 exscentric, Apr 12, 2005
  9. Gershom

    Gershom Active Member

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    While I would not condone "jumping off pulpits, kicking microphones, screaming, walking on the backs of pews and other theatrics" as Dr. Bob exaggerated, I do not find it unbecoming for a preacher to get fired-up and stomp or clap or raise his voice.
     
    #9 Gershom, Apr 12, 2005
  10. WallyGator

    WallyGator New Member

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    Solution: The WWE is auditioning new talent. Sounds like a new career opportunity.
    :D :rolleyes: ;)
     
    #10 WallyGator, Apr 12, 2005
  11. Dr.Tim

    Dr.Tim New Member

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    To begin with, such an issue could be a church-splitter and therefore should be decided by the pastor himself. He can decide from hundreds of miles away, I just would not put that on the shoulder of the man doing pulpit supply.

    I probably do more running around than most preachers.. if it is done right, less people will complain. If your message comes across with the authority of the Spirit, usually the people will not complain, most will stand in awe. However, when all the jumping, stomping, and screaming does not seem to be genuine, the folks will complain.
    Re-run preachers (I can't figure you people out... you think God has a limited number of sermons for you?) often preach a great and powerful message the first time and then when you start the re-runs, you try to recapture that power and its just not there, and even though you are going through the same bodily motions, the message is not being used of the spirit at the same magnitude as the first time you preached it.

    I would call the man aside and let him know. Do not challenge him. Just tell him and do not argue with him if he insists on doing it the same way again. Putting questions to him will make it look like you, too, agree that his mannerisms are not good. Stay neutral and play messenger, dont respond any more than you have to.
     
    #11 Dr.Tim, Apr 12, 2005
  12. gopchad

    gopchad New Member

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    Some guys can stomp and snort and come across authentically, while others come off as nothing more than charlatins. Most stompers and snorters I have heard are using their antics to make up for a lack of depth in their preaching... not ALL but MOST.

    Chad
     
    #12 gopchad, Apr 13, 2005
  13. bobbyd

    bobbyd New Member

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    WallyGator, i'm ROFL!

    I can see it, "That's right satan, we're going to grab you with the holy headlock, and then nail you with the preaching powerbomb, followed by the 1-2-3 for the 666! And what are you going to do when Preacher-mania runs wild on you????"
    <insert your own version of the Howard Dean scream here>
     
    #13 bobbyd, Apr 13, 2005
  14. WallyGator

    WallyGator New Member

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    Amen, Brother, Preach on!
     
    #14 WallyGator, Apr 13, 2005
  15. gb93433

    gb93433 Active Member
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    I allowed a person like that to preach once and I never heard the end of it from the SYI crowd. I will never do that again.

    The best way to keep people listening is to have something to say. You will know when a man has been with God. He doesn't have to shoout stomp and spit and tell you all about it for you to recognize it.
     
    #15 gb93433, Apr 13, 2005
  16. Dr. Bob

    Dr. Bob Administrator
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    Exaggerated? Sadly, no. These are TYPICAL of the ifbX (independent fundamental baptist EXTREME) of the Jack Hyles type. The purpiteering antics are unreal.

    Hyles was known to promote kicking microphones - you weren't a good preaching until you done so. And at the 2005 Pastor's School at his church's brand new auditorium, one of the speakers climbed up and stomped on the pulpit. Kid you not.

    Reproach on the name of Christ. And young men, trained in that, want to throw chairs at the devil like Billy Sunday, swallow goldfish, and screech (not just raising voice or such like all preachers do) at the people.

    Reproach
     
    #16 Dr. Bob, Apr 14, 2005
  17. PastorSBC1303

    PastorSBC1303 Active Member

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    AMEN [​IMG]
     
    #17 PastorSBC1303, Apr 15, 2005
  18. Phillip

    Phillip <b>Moderator</b>

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    I have a good friend who sells microphones to churches at a reasonable price. Do you have these guy's(Hyles and his students) phone numbers? (Dynamic mikes can only take about three good kicks before they start distorting--condenser, even less). :D [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]
     
    #18 Phillip, Apr 16, 2005
  19. Plain Old Bill

    Plain Old Bill New Member

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    Huffing and puffing into the mike is distracting and adds nothing to a message of substance.Don't get me wrong I like good hard sin hating preaching but it can be easily overdone.Jumping up and down, throwing things around,kicking microphones and the like shows(to me anyhow)a more of a watch me than I have a word from The Word for you.Good luck with this gentleman.
     
    #19 Plain Old Bill, Apr 23, 2005
  20. Bro. James Reed

    Bro. James Reed New Member

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    Bumping this thread to find out how things went for Bro. Jeff with this man.
     
    #20 Bro. James Reed, Jul 6, 2005
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