Seeking to Understand Revelation

Friends,

IV. Setting for Understanding the Book of Revelation

Plague Six (Gathering to Armageddon) Climaxes the Great Tribulation!
Seal Six Occurs "in the Days After the Great Tribulation". Mark 13:24!!
Vials 6 &7, Rev.16:12-17, Immediately Precede Seal 6, Rev.6:12-17!!!

Lastday events fulfill God’s promise to the Martyrs who come out from under the Altar, sing their victory song and enter heaven’s Temple after the Two Prophets join them. Rev.6:9-11; Rev.11:9-11; Rev.7:9-11; Rev.8:1-5. These events add to the setting to understand the Book of Revelation. Everything that relates to the Hour Christ comes to avenge their blood leads to the climactic destruction of those who persecute Saints until the last Day. These things, recorded in 100 verses of Revelation, begin with the above scripture and are set in the context of the Day of God’s wrath on one of the days “immediately after the great tribulation, i.e., in the days whenever the Two Prophets will have finished their task”. Rev.10:6-7; Rev.11:6-7.

The expectation of Christ’s imminent return is found in the context of armies already gathered to Armageddon. Prior to Christ’s coming these armies kill a third of mankind in the 6th Trumpet and invade Israel in the 6th Plague. The Lamb opens Seal 6 on “one of the days immediately after the great tribulation”. Mark 13:24. The 6th Trump and 6th Plague complete the great tribulation! With the 7th Plague, a great voice out of the Temple from the throne decrees: “It is Done”!! Rev.16:17. This word in the Perfect Tense indicates the End of the Age has come. The decree signals when (ote) to launch warnings of Seal 6!!!

Events of the Day of the Lord follow the 6th Trumpet and 6th Plague as millions threaten to destroy Israel at the HOUR to Reap. Rev.14:14-19. The “HOUR of Trial” follows like a “snare, suddenly, on all mankind”! Rev.3:10; Luke 21:34-35. A dramatic awakening occurs as the Prophets rise up to heaven and 7,000 of the Beast’s Elite Guard are killed in that Hour!! Rev.11:12-13. Ten chapters prior to the decree, on the same day, 7 classes of men hiding in the hills from armies of Satan, acknowledged the “DAY of God’s and the Lamb’s wrath had come”!!!


Rev.16:12-17 and Rev.6:12-17 climax the great tribulation. Rev.6:15-17 and Rev.16:15-17 show the contrast of despair and blessed hope on the last day!

At this Decree from the Temple, “It is Done”, the Lamb opens Seal 6 for Lastday events. It’s a simplistic view that 7 Trumpets follow 7 Seals and 7 Plagues follow 7 Trumpets! God’s wrath comes at the 7th Trumpet on the last day!! The Day of the Lord begins with the 6th Seal!!!


The 7th Plague suspends in the air while Seal 6 remains open and armies of the 6th Plague are incarcerated at the Hour to Reap! Rev.14:15. God’s patience ends as the smoke-filled Temple clears for judgment!! After the unknown (hotan) half-hour for the Court of Seal 7, the Hour of wrath occurs at the 7th Trumpet!!!

Beast-worshipers may repent during the 6th Trumpet and 4th and 5th Plagues! Rev.9:20-21; Rev.16:9-11. Instead they blaspheme God!! They invade Israel!!!


With God’s patience exhausted, the Lamb opens the 6th Seal for events of “The Day of Wrath! God’s Hour of Judgment has come”!! No one enters the Temple until the Last Plague empties and the Martyrs sing the victorious song of Moses!!!


"The Temple of the Tabernacle of Testimony opens” for their witness and the Judgment of the Court! Rev.8:1-5; Dan.7:22. In that HOUR of Trial God will “exterminate the sinners”!! Believers will be "kept from the hour of testing coming on all the inhabitants on all the face of all the earth"!!! Rev.14:7; Rev.15:1-8; Rev.7:9-17; Rev.11:15-19; Rev.19:15-21; Isa.13:9-11; Rev.3:10; Luke 21;35.

Mel Miller www.lastday.net

 

Friends,

I. Christ Returns on an Unknown DAY “After the Great Tribulation”

When Jesus stated: “No one except the Father knows the DAY He comes”, He stipulated His return to earth will occur on “one of the days immediately after the great tribulation”! The 1290 days of Daniel’s great tribulation (Dan.12:1,11) will be “cut short”; Revelation shortens the Endtime to 1260 days (Day #1260, when the Two Witnesses are killed, is not the Lastday)!! They will rise up from death “after 3½ days” and be caught up to heaven in the sight of many peoples around the earth. The unknown DAY of Christ’s coming must occur on or after one of the 3½ days following day #1260 (Events of that Day begin with Seal 6 warning of His imminent presence)!!! Matt.24:36; Matt.24:29-31; Mark 13:24-27; Luke 21:24-27; Dan.12:1,11; Rev.11:3-12; Rev.6:9-14; Rev.7:9-14.

By a Jewish idiom, any part of a day may be considered a whole day and night. Just as Jesus was in the grave “3 days and 3 nights” (Matt.12:40; but only 2 nights, parts of Friday to Sunday); so the last day is one of the days after day #1260. The last day occurs after the great tribulation ends…but it may occur within or after 84 hours from the hour the Two Prophets are killed. Jesus was in the grave about 40 hours rather than 72 hours. These two could rise up to heaven within 60 hours or after 84 hours!

To illustrate, Matthew and Mark say it was “after 6 days” between Mark 9:1 and 9:2 for the revelation by Jesus of “some to not taste death” until they saw His transfiguration on the Mount. Luke says it was “about 8 days”. Luke 9:28. He counted an extra day before six PM for day one and an extra day after six PM on day seven. Again, after Cornelius sent for Peter it took three days for Peter to reach him; but Cornelius counted four days. He saw the time from day one’s 9th to the 12th hour (3 to 6 PM) as an extra day!! Acts10:3-30.

This partly explains why no one can know the last Day in advance. Another reason is that only the Father knows on which day the last martyr will be killed. Rev.6:9-11. On an unknown Hour of the last day after Seal Six opens, God avenges their blood. That’s the Day of God’s wrath when rebellious Beast-worshipers face the wrath of God Almighty; after His victims gather to Armageddon!!! First comes Rev.16:12-17. Second comes Rev.6:12-17.

Mel Miller www.lastday.net

 

Ed,

I submit your replies are totally inconsistent! On the subject of Charting Revelation,
you did not dispute my following statement that YOU believe Christ is coming TWICE as a thief”!! Instead you question if He is coming as King ONE TIME for resurrection, one time for rapture and with one set of rewards for one wedding!!!

My Quote:
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Mel Miller: //My friend, your view requires two resurrections of ALL the dead in Christ, two times to rapture all the Saints, two ends of the Age, two last days, two last trumps, two glorious comings of Christ, two sets of rewards, two weddings of the Lamb (a so-called 2nd being announced just before Christ descends to destroy His enemies) and two comings “as a thief”! //
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YOU AGREE with me in which you could not have said the truth better:

Your Quote:
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“Wow, I wish I could have said it that good. My backup scripture is Rev.19:16: (KJV 1611 Edition): `And he hath on his vesture, and on his thigh a name written, king of kings and lord of lords'".
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THEN YOU ASK A QUESTON:

“Is Messiah Creator God limited to one and only one resurrection, one & only one rapture, one & only one glorious comings of Christ, one & only one set of rewards, and one & only one weddings of the Lamb”?
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INCONSISTENCY shows up in failing to include ONE Time coming as a Thief:

Jesus is "coming as a thief" just one time! That's when armies have been gathered to Armageddon!! Rev.16:14-16. There's no way you can place Armageddon BEFORE the tribulation period!!!

God's wrath occurs when armies are gathered to Armageddon! That's when
Jesus "blesses those who watch for His coming as a thief"!! God's wrath occurs
after the last Plague empties in the air"!!! Rev.16:12-17.

Therefore, I repeat that Rev.16:12-17 will be fulfilled before Rev.6:12-17!
The Day of Wrath begins before the Hour of Wrath!!
Seal Six signs occur before the 7th Trumpet proclaims: "God's wrath has come"!!!

Mel Miller www.lastday.net

 

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Your statement is interesting. Last August, on a thread about making
sense of the text based on contextual considerations, you wrote:

Quote:
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"I subscribe to and strongly encourage the historical-grammatical hermeneutic over the "plain sense" hermeneutic. I also try to keep my interpretations in check. The thinking being that just because I employ a hermeneutic that I percieve to be better than some other hermeneutics, doesn't mean my interpretations are perfect. I continually need to be humbled to learn from others who arrive at different interpretations, whether they use the historical-grammatical hermeneutic or not, while challenging their interpretations with good hermeneutics and prayer.
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If the context of Rev.16:12-17 does not contain a definite sense of the
"order of events," I would like your interpretation of why the attitude of one not "knowing the Day of the Lord will come as a thief" differs from
that of believers who will "know the Day of the Lord is near and not be overtaken as a thief"!

The context is the gathering to Armageddon! Christ's message for us is
that "we watch with imminent expectation for His imminent Presence"!!
It seems to meet there is a climactic moment here in order of events!!!

There must be something in the context that unbelievers will not "know" but that believers will know! That something, in my opinion, includes the
tenses and moods of Greek words which are often overlooked!! I would
like to know if you agree with me that the very force of "gegonen", the perfect indicative of 1096, hides a special message for interpretation!!!

Mel Miller www.lastday.net

 

Golden Dragon,
Quote:
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“Notice verse one and two, it says that our knowledge of the timing has nothing to do with what is written since we know that the day will be like a thief in the night.

But in verse 4 of I Thess.5, the day will not overtake us like a thief since we will be ready when it comes. So the day will come upon us like a thief, but will not overcome us because we will be ready when it comes”.
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Friend,
My two-fold concern still remains because you give no reason for stating the timing has “nothing to do with what is written nor with what we know”! I would like your interpretation of WHY the attitude of one not "knowing the Day of the Lord comes as a thief" will differ from that of Believers who will "not be overtaken as a thief"!! You may disagree with me that there are specific signs accompanying the “gathering to the plains of Armageddon” by which Believers will “know the end is imminent”!!!

This “fact” I take delight in discussing! It concerns the nature of the explicit order of events in Revelation!! God's timing is laid out exactly!!!

I am convinced the word translated “It is Done” conveys the message by which Believers will know everything required of the Lord’s coming, from Rev.6:12 to Rev.16:17, must be fulfilled as of the armies already gathered to Armageddon! Christ comes to fulfill the 4-fold decree of the 7th Trumpet (Wrath, Resurrection, Rewards, Retribution) when the armies are gathered to Armageddon!! That gathering is in the past tense, indicating that Believers will be “watching (present tense) for Christ coming”; not watching for Armageddon!!!

We will not be on the earth when Christ “destroys the destroyers of earth”!
Anticipation of His coming is in the present tense in the context of armies already
having been gathered for the slaughter!! Rev.16:14-16. When God decrees: “It is
Done,” in the perfect tense, all that is described as “having come” (past tense; from Rev.6:12 to Rev.20:6) must be included as taking place within the hours that remain
on the last day…for the perfect tense certifies past action with continuing results!!!

Mel Miller www.lastday.net

 

Gold Dragon,

What you write applies to “times in general” during this present age UNTIL specific signs occur that point unmistakably to Christ’s imminent return! “Things written will help with epochs” when specific “appointed endtime and lastday signs” occur!!
Stating “the timing has nothing to do with what is written” may be very misleading!!!

As Jesus left earth the disciples were told they would not know the “appointed times”. I believe this was revealed so they would finish the task given to them and not be misled to think He may come “at any moment” independently of specific Signs He had given them. But once these signs occur, He stated they would “know the end is near”. Matt. 24:33. In Rev.16:14-16 He was even more explicit about when the “any-moment” aspect kicks in. His instructions for “times in general” do not include the command to “watch”. Only on the “DAY OF GOD ALMIGHTY” does Jesus refer to His “any-moment” Presence.

That’s the context with “armies having been gathered to Armageddon (aorist indicative; past tense) and the present-tense activity of “watching for His coming when we see the things happening in the sun, moon and stars”… followed by events of 100 verses in the Book of Revelation to be fulfilled from noon to twilight! Amos 8:8-9; Zech.14:6-9. Believers on the East Coast will know breakfast will be their last meal on that Day; those in Israel will know that lunch will be their final meal and those in China will know that supper will be their last meal.

The special character of Lastday Signs emphasizes that, in fact, the only “any-moment” expectation is strictly embedded in the context of 22 major events in Revelation that will be fulfilled on the 12-Hour-Day of God’s and the Lamb’s Wrath. On that day Jews will “look up and stand erect when these things begin to happen” (included in “It is Done”; perfect tense); “knowing their redemption is near”. Luke 21:28. “As these things continue happening, they know their kingdom is near and will keep begging (present participle) to escape and to prevail, until all things happens, and to stand before the Son of Man”. Luke 21:31,32,36. None of these 22 major events begin to occur until armies are gathered to Armageddon! (See my Centerpiece at www.lastday.net).

If is therefore unrealistic to not recognize the anticipatory role of the Lastday signs…including the actually presence of Jesus Himself in the case of the Jews who “mourn” when He appears!

Mel Miller

 

Gold Dragon,

An interesting, incorrect, observation you made creates misunderstanding.

Originally Posted by Mel Miller
In Rev.16:14-16 He was even more explicit about when the “any-moment” aspect kicks in. His instructions for “times in general” do not include the command to “watch”. Only on the “DAY OF GOD ALMIGHTY” does Jesus refer to His “any-moment” Presence.


Your incorrect observation:
"I don't see any thing in verses 14-16 to suggest a change from pre "any-moment" to post "any-moment".
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Jesus commands Believers to "watch" in the light of specific signs which
Believers will have ALREADY seen! But the "any-moment" expectation depends on having seen the armies gather to Armageddon!! That's why He uses the PAST tense to describe the Sign that causes the Elect to realize the "any-moment" aspect by "watching" (using the PRESENT tense)!!!

I did not imply there will be a "pre-any-moment" expectation that could precede the gathering to Armageddon or that could change to a "post-
any-moment" expectaton of Christ's Presence! The PRESENT tense for
"watching" begins when the Armies invade Israel!! This same principle also applies to prior signs...not to induce an "any-moment" expectation...but only to indicate a sequencial order that is NOT part of an "any-moment" expectation of His Presence!!!

I didn't expect you to understand my reference to Luke 21:25-36 because
the entire "expectation" in this passage relates ONLY to what men will see
after the signs in the sun, moon and stars on the 12-Hour-Day Christ must
appear with all the Saints! The Elect, not mentioned in Luke's account, will have already appeared with Him when the Jews "look up, stand erect and begin to watch"!! As the Jews continue to observe the 22 major events that "happenS" on that day, they will "know their kingdom is near and be begging to escape all these things and prevail to stand before the Son of Man"!!!

Thanks for your participation.

Mel Miller www.lastday.net

 

Friends,

After making the "big jump" (for many) from a view of an "any-moment" Rapture, irrespective of specific signs, to the view of an "any-moment"
Second Coming (which includes Resurrection, Rewards and Retribution),
we can work backwards in the order of events for Keys to Revelation!

A basic Key is the length of the Day of the Lord!!

Most of us assume that Day includes 7 years of Tribulation!!!

II. When is the Day of the Lord?

The difference in my view and that of many Christians concerns the length of the Day of the Lord. Is that Day equal to the tribulation of 7 years or even to the 42 months of great tribulation? Or does it include events of the last day only, i.e., the Day and Hour Christ “comes in flaming fire to destroy all who refuse to repent; and to rescue all who believe”?? John 6:38-40; Mark 13:24-27; Matt.24:29-31. And be “admired” by millions who believe when they suddenly see Him in His glory???

God rescues every Believer and extends His mercy to all who “mourn and beg for mercy on that day”! 2 Thess.1:7-10; Joel 2:32; Luke 21:34-36; Luke 17:30-33;
Rom.11:32. “We look for the blessed hope and glorious appearing of our great God and savior Jesus Christ; when both the living and dead will be judged at His appearance and kingdom”!! Titus 2:13; 2 Tim.4:1. This applies to all believing survivors to the End!!! Rev.2:25-27.

Mel Miller www.lastday.net

 

Ed ED,

Thanks for confirming that your View of a 7-Year-Day of the Lord has no
Scriptural basis but actually denies the word of Jesus that the signs of that Day occur "immediately after the Great Tribulation"! Matt.24:29,36.

On that single 12-Hour-Day many Scriptures will be fulfilled!!

The Lamb’s wedding and wedding supper are announced seconds before Heaven opens and Christ descends to climax the following 26 sets of 9-11's!!!

Isa.6:9-11; Isa.11:9-11; Isa.13:9-11; Isa.40:9-11; Rev.6:9-11; Rev.7:9-11; Rev.10:9-11; Rev.11:9-11; Rev.12:9-11; Dan.7:9-11; Dan.12:9-11; Zech.12: 9-11; Zech.14:9-11; Rev.14:9-11; Rev.16:9-11; Rev.17:9-11; Rev.19:9-11;
2 Thess.1:9-11; Isa.55:9-11; Isa.61:9-11; Jer.30:9-11; Jer.31:9-11; Jer.33:9-11; Ezek. 43:9-11; Hos.1:9-11 and Amos 9:9-11.

It doesn't take multiple Days and Years to execute God's Wrath! You need to
stick with God's plan to "destroy the destroyers of earth on the Day Christ comes
in flaming fire for RETRIBUTION on His enemies" and to RESURRECT and REWARD the Saints and manifest His glory!! Your view of God's plan presents a jig-saw puzzle approach to the climactic nature of His Wrath!!!

Mel Miller www.lastday.net

 

Friends,

May I challenge anyone who rejects the premise that armies must be
gathered to Armageddon before Christ comes in glory to RESURRECT/
REWARD Believers and to bring RETRIBUTION on those who blaspheme
His name!

There must be someone on this Forum who disagrees with this premise and can show whether the very same people who are involved in the
5th, 6th, 7th SEALS are NOT also involved in the 5th, 6th, 7th TRUMPET Judgments as well as in the 5th, 6th, 7th PLAGUES!!

Those who survive five months of torment in the 5th Trumpet Plague, having been unable to find death, continue their blasphemies and kill a third of mankind rather than repent of their evil deeds! Those who survive the 3rd Plague continue their blasphemies in the 4th Plague, while being scorched with fire, kill the saints and give not God glory!! In the 5th Plague, they gnaw their tongues in pain and blaspheme God and refuse to repent!!!

In the 6th, they "gather to Armageddon" while Believers watch, not for Armageddon, but they watch and wait with their clothes on to show the any-moment imminency of Christ's coming!

The Martyrs, who wait under the Altar in heaven until the last one has
been killed, wait patiently during Seals 5-7, Trumpets 5-7 and Plagues
5-7! We should show respect to God's plan to "demonstrate that His deeds are holy and righteous" for 1260 days until there is no remedy for mankind's lawlessness!! Only then will God "deliver us from tribulation because we are worthy"; rescue all who "beg to escape and choose
Israel a second time" to be His special people!!! 2 Thess.1:5-11.

Mel Miller www.lastday.net

 

Friends,

Please note, in the accompanying thread on Seeking to Understand the
Book of Revelation, I have started that quest by looking at "Events of
the Last Day".

Mel Miller www.lastday.net

 

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Ed, Thanks.

Yes, I was referring to the new thread on an Outline of Prophetic Events.
BTW, we have not yet discussed our differences over the time the Two
Witnesses demonstate "God's Kingdom Power and Authority of His Christ"!

Mel Miller

 

Friends,

Since no one responded to my Outline of Prophetic Events on another thread, I wish to place that Outline here for a more comprehensive
approach to Understanding Revelation:

A. PRE-Endtime Events
I. Seal #1
.....1. Spread of Democracy; Creation of Babylon the Great
.....2. Babylon the Great rules earth first half of final Seven
.....3. Covenant of Dan.9:27
.....4. War of Ezekiel 38-39.

B. Endtime Events
I. Seal #2 – Midweek of Daniel’s 70th Seven
.....1. Peace taken from earth – Rev.6:4
.....2. War in Heaven - Satan cast to earth – Rev.12:7-9,12-17
.....3. Ten Kings destroy Babylon – Rev.17:16; Rev.18:8
.....4. AC defiles Temple; rules 42 months – Dan.12:11; Matt.24:15; Rev.13
.....5. Two Prophets’ 1260-Day task coincides with Great Tribulation.
II. Seals #3 to #4; Trumpets #1 to #4.
III. Seal #5 – Martyrs’ Prayer; Short time remains
IV. Trumpet #5 with 5 months of torment - Rev.9:1-12
V. Plagues #1 to #5
VI. Trumpet #6 – Armies from East kill third of Mankind
VII. Plague #6 – Armies invade Israel – Rev.16:12-16
VIII. Beast kills Two Prophets – Rev.11:7

C. Lastday Events
I. Plague #7 – “It is Done” – Rev.16:17 - Suspends in the air.
II. Seal #6 – Day of Wrath "has come" – Matt.24:29-30; Rev.6:12-17
III. Firstfruit, 144,000, sealed and rescued – Rev.7:1-8; Rev.14:1-5
IV. Hour of Judgment and Reaping "has Come" – Rev.14:6-20
V. Great and Wonderful Sign – Victory Songs of Rev.15:1-4
VI. Two Witnesses arise; ascend to heaven – Rev.11:11-12
VII. Great quake kills 7000 in Jerusalem – Rev.11:13-14
VIII. Multitudes praise God & Lamb in Temple – Rev.15:5; Rev.7:9-17
IX. Seal #7 – Court of Judgment – Dan.7:9-22; Rev.8:1-5; Rev.16:18-21
X. Trumpet #7 – Coronation of Christ – “God’s Wrath has come”
“The appointed time to:
.....1. Judge the dead
.....2. Reward the saints
.....3. Reward the prophets
.....4. Reward the small and great ... all who fear God
.....5. Destroy the destroyers of earth" – Rev.11:18.
XI. Rejoicing in heaven – Rev.18:20 to Rev.19:10 - "Wedding has come"
XII. Christ descends; Resurrects saints; Destroys wicked – Rev.19:11-21.
.......1. Jesus "brings the souls in heaven with Him" - I Thess.4:13-14
.....2. Jesus "gathers elect from earth to heaven" – Mark 13:27
.....3. Jesus "sends angels to gather elect from the heavens" – Matt.24:31
.....4. "All the Saints come with Jesus" - I Thess.3:13; Rev.17:14.

Mel Miller www.lastday.net