The Bible Answer Kid
New Member
So recently, I saw some Seventh-Day Adventists on television. Some of their beliefs sounded almost cult-like. I was wondering if anybody could help me out here. What are their beliefs? Why are they wrong?
-
Welcome to Baptist Board, a friendly forum to discuss the Baptist Faith in a friendly surrounding.
Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to all the features that our community has to offer.
We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!
Seventh-Day Adventists
- Thread starter The Bible Answer Kid
- Start date
- Status
dispen4ever
New Member
Go to http://google.com and type in "seventh day adventist" . Look for the responses that call the 7th dayers a cult, or disagree with them. It will take some time to understand where they are coming from.:type:
What's cult-like about thinking you need to keep the commandments?
Rv:12:17: And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.
Rv:14:12: Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.
Rv:22:14: Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.
Rv:12:17: And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.
Rv:14:12: Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.
Rv:22:14: Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.
David Michael Harris
Active Member
As Christians we do not need to to be Jews.
We are Christians and need to live according to Christian teaching, Christ fulfilled the demands of the law for us. We are in Christ.
N
NE is put right with God through the law, it is impossible.
Open your eyes people.
David
We are Christians and need to live according to Christian teaching, Christ fulfilled the demands of the law for us. We are in Christ.
N
NE is put right with God through the law, it is impossible.Open your eyes people.
David
BobRyan
Well-Known Member
For many Christians today there is the "need" to insert ideas about the "good Bible" vs the "bad Bible" in the way they relate to scripture without ever admitting to it - or speaking the terms "out loud".
For them it is "being like a cult" to read and honor anything from the "bad Bible" so they look for those who will "agree not to read or promote or honor" texts from what they regard as "the Bad Bible".
Seventh-day Adventists do not engage in such acts of "gaming the text of scripture" and so they do not divide up God's Word between "good and bad". That means that they end up showing much more honor and respect to what others view as "the bad Bible" than is often tolerated by those handing out "cult labels".
For a good example of one such "bad bible" verse never to be promoted from the pulpit of the "Bible dividing" groups we go to Romans 2
Romans 2
13 for it is not the hearers of the Law[/b] who are just before God, but the doers of the Law will be justified.
14 For when Gentiles who do not have the Law do instinctively the things of the Law, these, not having the Law, are a law to themselves,
15 in that they show the work of the Law written in their hearts, their conscience bearing witness and their thoughts alternately accusing or else defending them,
16 on the day when, according to my gospel, God will judge the secrets of men through Christ Jesus.
Adventists fully accept and embrace that text which leaves them open to fully embracing others like it - like the one in the very next chapter of Romans --
"Do we then make void the Law of God by our faith? God forbid! In fact we Establish the Law" Rom 3:31
And once you start down that path - then you find the Word of God being accepted "all over the place" even in places where the "Commandments of God" get honored.
I Jn 5:2-3
2 By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God, and keep his commandments.
3 For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous.
Rev 12:17 17 And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.
Rev 14:12 12 Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.
Rev 22:14 14[b] Blessed are they that do his commandments,[/b] that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.
The question is - can you really embrace and accept and honor such texts without leaping off into "salvation by works" or is it best to just turn a blind eye and regard them "in practice" (but never in spoken word) as "the bad Bible" - to avoid the error of salvation by works?
That is where many simply walk away on this supposing that a partial-Bible is better than none at all.
But Adventists choose that fine line of accepting ALL of the Word of God while also rejecting salvation by works. Not a very popular view.
In Christ,
Bob
For them it is "being like a cult" to read and honor anything from the "bad Bible" so they look for those who will "agree not to read or promote or honor" texts from what they regard as "the Bad Bible".
Seventh-day Adventists do not engage in such acts of "gaming the text of scripture" and so they do not divide up God's Word between "good and bad". That means that they end up showing much more honor and respect to what others view as "the bad Bible" than is often tolerated by those handing out "cult labels".
For a good example of one such "bad bible" verse never to be promoted from the pulpit of the "Bible dividing" groups we go to Romans 2
Romans 2
13 for it is not the hearers of the Law[/b] who are just before God, but the doers of the Law will be justified.
14 For when Gentiles who do not have the Law do instinctively the things of the Law, these, not having the Law, are a law to themselves,
15 in that they show the work of the Law written in their hearts, their conscience bearing witness and their thoughts alternately accusing or else defending them,
16 on the day when, according to my gospel, God will judge the secrets of men through Christ Jesus.
Adventists fully accept and embrace that text which leaves them open to fully embracing others like it - like the one in the very next chapter of Romans --
"Do we then make void the Law of God by our faith? God forbid! In fact we Establish the Law" Rom 3:31
And once you start down that path - then you find the Word of God being accepted "all over the place" even in places where the "Commandments of God" get honored.
I Jn 5:2-3
2 By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God, and keep his commandments.
3 For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous.
Rev 12:17 17 And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.
Rev 14:12 12 Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.
Rev 22:14 14[b] Blessed are they that do his commandments,[/b] that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.
The question is - can you really embrace and accept and honor such texts without leaping off into "salvation by works" or is it best to just turn a blind eye and regard them "in practice" (but never in spoken word) as "the bad Bible" - to avoid the error of salvation by works?
That is where many simply walk away on this supposing that a partial-Bible is better than none at all.
But Adventists choose that fine line of accepting ALL of the Word of God while also rejecting salvation by works. Not a very popular view.
In Christ,
Bob
Last edited by a moderator:
BobRyan
Well-Known Member
Notice how much "agreement" there is in the NT among Gospel writers - writing AFTER the cross about the Gospel of Jesus and John writing in Revelation?
John 15:10-11 10 If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love.
11 These things have I spoken unto you, that my joy might remain in you, and that your joy might be full.
John 14:15 (quoting from the 10 commandments) “IF you love Me Keep My commandments”
[/quote]
Christ quotes from the 3rd commandment for the statement above.
Christ said that HIS commandment and the Father’s Commandment are one and the same
Notice that John promotes this theme not only with his recording the pre-cross statements of Christ the hCreator – but also the post –cross teaching.
John 15:10-11 10 If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love.
11 These things have I spoken unto you, that my joy might remain in you, and that your joy might be full.
John 14:15 (quoting from the 10 commandments) “IF you love Me Keep My commandments”
[/quote]
Christ quotes from the 3rd commandment for the statement above.
Christ said that HIS commandment and the Father’s Commandment are one and the same
Notice that John promotes this theme not only with his recording the pre-cross statements of Christ the hCreator – but also the post –cross teaching.
David,
That is silly, you cant just discard all the many Bible verses in the New Testament that say we must keep the commandments. Dont you think you might have misunderstood something about this subject somewhere along the way?
Whjat exactly do you think that it means when it says over and over that we must keep the commandments?
David what is the biblical definition of SIN? it is transgression of the Law, correct?
1Jn:3:4: Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law.
well are we free to sin (transgress the law) now?
Rom:6:15: What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid.
NO
Claudia
That is silly, you cant just discard all the many Bible verses in the New Testament that say we must keep the commandments. Dont you think you might have misunderstood something about this subject somewhere along the way?
Whjat exactly do you think that it means when it says over and over that we must keep the commandments?
David what is the biblical definition of SIN? it is transgression of the Law, correct?
1Jn:3:4: Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law.
well are we free to sin (transgress the law) now?
Rom:6:15: What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid.
NO
Claudia
I dont understand whats so difficult about the idea that we are saved by grace but just because we are saved by grace doesnt mean we discard the law.... Hellooooooooooooooooooooooo
1Jn:3:4: Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law.
well are we free to sin (transgress the law) now?
Rom:6:15: What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid.
NO
I guess people think we are a cult because we dont answer YES to the above question. If thats the case Im happy Jesus is my Cult Leader.
1Jn:3:4: Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law.
well are we free to sin (transgress the law) now?
Rom:6:15: What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid.
NO
I guess people think we are a cult because we dont answer YES to the above question. If thats the case Im happy Jesus is my Cult Leader.
Samuel Owen
New Member
I just finished watching 12 DVD disks of SDA teachings, a friend (I guess??) left with me. They are far worse than I had ever known. Just a quick view of some of their doctrine.
1. Of course it is well known they say we must keep the Sabbath, but they consider those who don’t have taken the mark of the Beast also.
2. They believe in Soul Sleep, that is the soul remains in the grave with the body until resurrection day.
3. They believe in Annihilationism that is no everlasting Hell, the non-believer just simply ceases to exist.
4. They teach Investigative Judgment, that Christ is in the Heavenly Sanctuary at this time, deciding who is worthy of salvation among the professors of faith.
5. That only the 144,000 will actually go to Heaven (them of course), and the rest of us bums will only be allowed on the New Earth.
6. They do not believe in a 1000 year reign of Christ on earth, and at Christs second coming all is done, excluding the battle of Armageddon.
7. They conclude the tribulation has already occurred, when Jerusalem was disbursed by Titus in AD 70.
There is a lot more but I really think this is enough, and will save my fingers from further typing.
1. Of course it is well known they say we must keep the Sabbath, but they consider those who don’t have taken the mark of the Beast also.
2. They believe in Soul Sleep, that is the soul remains in the grave with the body until resurrection day.
3. They believe in Annihilationism that is no everlasting Hell, the non-believer just simply ceases to exist.
4. They teach Investigative Judgment, that Christ is in the Heavenly Sanctuary at this time, deciding who is worthy of salvation among the professors of faith.
5. That only the 144,000 will actually go to Heaven (them of course), and the rest of us bums will only be allowed on the New Earth.
6. They do not believe in a 1000 year reign of Christ on earth, and at Christs second coming all is done, excluding the battle of Armageddon.
7. They conclude the tribulation has already occurred, when Jerusalem was disbursed by Titus in AD 70.
There is a lot more but I really think this is enough, and will save my fingers from further typing.
Samuel Owen
New Member
This fellow did, and he is the main speaker of "It Is Written", the SDA's foremost mouthpiece. It was more by inference than a direct statement, never the less he said it. It was well documented by Ellen White one of their main founders, to whom they still pay great reverence.
They use the reference to Little Flock, and connect that to the 144,000 SDA's.
They use the reference to Little Flock, and connect that to the 144,000 SDA's.
Last edited by a moderator:
Ed Edwards
<img src=/Ed.gif>
The meaning of the word 'cult' is so inpreciseThe Bible Answer Kid said:
it can mean anything. Therefore the term 'cult' is useless to express
anything. What exactly is your question? Please tell us what you are
asking. Thank you.
'Cult' maximum - complete thought control by the guru
of the members
'Cult' minimum - you don't agree with me.
(with many shades of grey inbetween)
'Cult' is a very non-descriptive term.
Samuel Owen
New Member
How about if you have to agree with all the Churches ordinances, and accept the teachings of their prophetess Ellen White as equal to the Bible, before you can become a member, does that spell - cult?.
Claudia_T said:
David Michael Harris said:As Christians we do not need to to be Jews.
We are Christians and need to live according to Christian teaching, Christ fulfilled the demands of the law for us. We are in Christ.
N
Open your eyes people.
David
GE:
What you say is true. But what is it you have in the back of your mind?
I ask, and I am not a SDA.
BR:
"For many Christians today there is the "need" to insert ideas about the "good Bible" "
GE:
And for SDAs there since their origin has been the need of some 'lesser light' to illuminate the Light of God's Word.
"For many Christians today there is the "need" to insert ideas about the "good Bible" "
GE:
And for SDAs there since their origin has been the need of some 'lesser light' to illuminate the Light of God's Word.
- Status