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Seventh-Day Adventists
- Thread starter The Bible Answer Kid
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Heavenly Pilgrim
New Member
HP: I see some specific Scriptures that should enter into the equation. First it is NEVER right to violate ones conscience, or to compel another to violate ones conscience, even if I have perfect liberty to do what another feels condemned by. Ro 14:14 I know, and am persuaded by the Lord Jesus, that there is nothing unclean of itself: BUT to him that esteemeth any thing to be unclean, to him it is unclean.”
Heavenly Pilgrim
New Member
HP: I am not SDA by any means, but I believe Scripture can answer that for us. “He that sayeth he loveth me, and keepeth not my commandments is a liar, the truth is not in him.” Steaver, which commandments are being addressed?
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BobRyan
Well-Known Member
DHK said:
When Christ said "you MUST eat My flesh and drink my blood" there is no symbolism there it is a direct command by God (according to the RCC).
But "obviously" Peter is correct when HE GET's the point saying in John 6 "YOU HAVE the WORDS of LIFE".
And so it is also painfully obvious that not only did they not BITE CHRIST in John 6 (no matter how much the RCC claims this is a direct command to do so) it is ALSO obvious that Peter did not eat rats in Acts 10 or Acts 11 AND that when HE interprets the vision THREE TIMES for us - not once does HE give the DHK solution "EAT RATS".
How much more obvious can this be??
Here you over-extend your argument right off the cliff claiming that the inspired text of Acts 10 and 11 where Peter prives for US the interpretation is inferior to your own man-made supposition about eating rats.
In Can't believe you go to such extremes for your tradtions.
In Christ,
Bob
Heavenly Pilgrim said:
absolutely not, I dont have authority to condemn anybody. nor the inclination to. I view other Christians to be my brothers and sisters in Christ... not based on dietary laws. God knows a person's heart, I do not.
THAT is why Jesus told the story of the Good Samaritan. He knew God's requirements and did them better than those who supposedly knew God's Laws.
Claudia
Quote:
Originally Posted by steaver
I'm going to have an ice cream while I wait for you guy's answer...."yes" or "no"....God Bless! :wavey:
well what I said was pretty obvious... you cant go to heaven and disregard God's authority, His law,
is that plain enough? go read your Bible
HOWEVER, I also believe that the Bible says that to him who knows it is sin, then it is sin... meaning that many have not been CONVICTED on certain areas of the scriptures, and therefore nobody can judge anybody's salvation.
Jms:4:17: Therefore to him that knoweth to do good, and doeth it not, to him it is sin.
Once you KNOW you should keep God's Law then yes you are in trouble should you choose to ignore it.
I dont claim to speak for Bob Ryan, but this is the way that I personally view things.
I believe there are going to be lots of Catholics in Heaven... Many are living up to the light that they have...
God's people are in all denominations.
**Thats for if you couldnt read it the first time
Claudia
Originally Posted by steaver
I'm going to have an ice cream while I wait for you guy's answer...."yes" or "no"....God Bless! :wavey:
well what I said was pretty obvious... you cant go to heaven and disregard God's authority, His law,
is that plain enough? go read your Bible
HOWEVER, I also believe that the Bible says that to him who knows it is sin, then it is sin... meaning that many have not been CONVICTED on certain areas of the scriptures, and therefore nobody can judge anybody's salvation.
Jms:4:17: Therefore to him that knoweth to do good, and doeth it not, to him it is sin.
Once you KNOW you should keep God's Law then yes you are in trouble should you choose to ignore it.
I dont claim to speak for Bob Ryan, but this is the way that I personally view things.
I believe there are going to be lots of Catholics in Heaven... Many are living up to the light that they have...
God's people are in all denominations.
**Thats for if you couldnt read it the first time
Claudia
BobRyan
Well-Known Member
Our view is that you must alway accept ALL of scripture. When man-made-tradition drives you to the point that simply SEEING the NT quoted in text after text drives you to "make stuff up" -- you know that you are on the wrong track.
Salvation is by grace through faith - the gift of God EVEN THOUGH the NT texts I gave you are STILL be read and STILL true.
The fact that your reaction to seeing them posted is to instantly make stuff up - should help you see the flaw in the traditions that you are holding.
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Steaver then claims not to understand the post since I quoted Eph 2 and apparently it is confusing to him.
question for the group - does Eph 2 also confuse the rest to the point of not seeing the answer?
In Christ,
Bob
Salvation is by grace through faith - the gift of God EVEN THOUGH the NT texts I gave you are STILL be read and STILL true.
The fact that your reaction to seeing them posted is to instantly make stuff up - should help you see the flaw in the traditions that you are holding.
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Steaver then claims not to understand the post since I quoted Eph 2 and apparently it is confusing to him.
question for the group - does Eph 2 also confuse the rest to the point of not seeing the answer?
In Christ,
Bob
BobRyan
Well-Known Member
We seem to have gotten a huge reaction against these NT texts being posted here --
Mt:5:19: Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.
Mt:19:17: And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.
1Cor:7:19: Circumcision is nothing, and uncircumcision is nothing, but the keeping of the commandments of God.
1Jn:2:3: And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments.
1Jn:2:4: He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.
1Jn:3:22: And whatsoever we ask, we receive of him, because we keep his commandments, and do those things that are pleasing in his sight.
1Jn:3:24: And he that keepeth his commandments dwelleth in him, and he in him. And hereby we know that he abideth in us, by the Spirit which he hath given us.
1Jn:5:2: By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God, and keep his commandments.
1Jn:5:3: For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous.
2Jn:1:6: And this is love, that we walk after his commandments. This is the commandment, That, as ye have heard from the beginning, ye should walk in it.
Rv:12:17: And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.
Rv:14:12: Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.
Rv:22:14: Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.
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I find it amazing that these NT texts get such a strong negative reaction.
In Christ,
Bob
Mt:5:19: Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.
Mt:19:17: And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.
1Cor:7:19: Circumcision is nothing, and uncircumcision is nothing, but the keeping of the commandments of God.
1Jn:2:3: And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments.
1Jn:2:4: He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.
1Jn:3:22: And whatsoever we ask, we receive of him, because we keep his commandments, and do those things that are pleasing in his sight.
1Jn:3:24: And he that keepeth his commandments dwelleth in him, and he in him. And hereby we know that he abideth in us, by the Spirit which he hath given us.
1Jn:5:2: By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God, and keep his commandments.
1Jn:5:3: For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous.
2Jn:1:6: And this is love, that we walk after his commandments. This is the commandment, That, as ye have heard from the beginning, ye should walk in it.
Rv:12:17: And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.
Rv:14:12: Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.
Rv:22:14: Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.
--------------------
I find it amazing that these NT texts get such a strong negative reaction.
In Christ,
Bob
My question is simple. It is a question about salvation. As far as the scripture you quote, show you love for Jesus by keeping His commandments. Which He also clarified....Love God and Love thy neighbor as thyself and ye fullfill the Royal law, and ye do well.
God Bless!
Heavenly Pilgrim
New Member
HP: This obviously can not be taken literally to the ‘enth’ degree any more than Paul’s words that all things were lawful for him to do. Common sense would be in order as I read both passages.
BobRyan
Well-Known Member
Bob....
Christ said "by their fruits you SHALL know them.. not everyone who SAYS Lord Lord will enter the kingdom but he who DOES the will of My Father" Matt 7.
Paul said "Not the hearers but the DOERS of the Law WILL be justified" Romans 2:11-13
Christ said "IF you Love Me KEEP My commandments" John 14:15
John says that "the one who SAYS he knows Christ should WALK as Christ WALKED - if he does not - he is a liar" 1John 2:4-7
SDAs simply accept the Word of God just as it reads.
Many object to that - but it does not change the Word of God.
hmm paraphrasing "those dirty rotten SDAs keep quoting the NT Word of God that we don't want to read because it debunks our traditions-- how terrible".
how "instructive" by comparison.
In Christ,
Bob
Christ said "by their fruits you SHALL know them.. not everyone who SAYS Lord Lord will enter the kingdom but he who DOES the will of My Father" Matt 7.
Paul said "Not the hearers but the DOERS of the Law WILL be justified" Romans 2:11-13
Christ said "IF you Love Me KEEP My commandments" John 14:15
John says that "the one who SAYS he knows Christ should WALK as Christ WALKED - if he does not - he is a liar" 1John 2:4-7
SDAs simply accept the Word of God just as it reads.
Many object to that - but it does not change the Word of God.
hmm paraphrasing "those dirty rotten SDAs keep quoting the NT Word of God that we don't want to read because it debunks our traditions-- how terrible".
how "instructive" by comparison.
In Christ,
Bob
Heavenly Pilgrim
New Member
HP: You are avoiding the Scripture as I see it. Can you be saved without loving God? Do you need to keep the law of love towards God and your fellow man to be saved? If so, what might that 'law of love' entail?
Does the SDA church actually teach you how to avoid answering direct questions? Here it is once more....
Question for SDA's...Does one "need" to keep the commandments in order to receive salvation? Yes or No will do, no rabbit trails please!
God Bless!
Clue!!!!!!!!!!! YES or NO!!!!! It won't take you 30 seconds to give an answer! :smilewinkgrin:
BobRyan
Well-Known Member
DHK quotes 1Tim 4:4
I pointed out that what he is not quoting is vs 4 AND 5 where Paul shows that scripture must first APPROVE of what is being eaten.
4 For everything created by God is good, and nothing is to be rejected if it is received with gratitude;
5 for it is sanctified by means of the word of God and prayer.
Heavenly Pilgrim said:
I pointed out that what he is not quoting is vs 4 AND 5 where Paul shows that scripture must first APPROVE of what is being eaten.
4 For everything created by God is good, and nothing is to be rejected if it is received with gratitude;
5 for it is sanctified by means of the word of God and prayer.
Heavenly Pilgrim
New Member
HP: That in all fairness is a mute question. God calls on all men to REPENT and to turn from their selfishness in repentance and faith at salvation.
Heavenly Pilgrim
New Member
HP: I believe that is an excellent point to be considered. I had never thought about it in that way before.
Q1, Yes, God quickens your spirit and gives you a new life(saved), THEN you truly love God.
Q2, No, however it does come naturally from the regeneration. Some quickly and some slowly.
Q3, Love thy neighbor as thyself.
See, it isn't hard to answer "yes" or "no"!
God Bless!
we have been through this time and time again. If you claim to fulfill the "Law of Love" tell me, which of the 10 commandments is it acceptable for you to break?
killing your neighbor? worshipping idols? stealing from your neighbor?
we all know what the Bible says:
Romans 13
8: love one another: for he that loveth another hath fulfilled the law.
9: For this, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not kill, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Thou shalt not covet; and if there be any other commandment, it is briefly comprehended in this saying, namely, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
briefly comprehended means that LOVE is the SUMMARY of all 10 of the commandments. this is easy kids... romper room stuff.
Once you can tell me which of the 10 commandments you can break and still be loving God and loving your neighbor then you will be getting somewhere... Jesus said on these two commandments hang the whole law. The first 4 commandments are Love God and the Last 6 fall under Love thy neighbor.
Hello? as I said, Romper Room stuff here....
Claudia
killing your neighbor? worshipping idols? stealing from your neighbor?
we all know what the Bible says:
Romans 13
8: love one another: for he that loveth another hath fulfilled the law.
9: For this, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not kill, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Thou shalt not covet; and if there be any other commandment, it is briefly comprehended in this saying, namely, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
briefly comprehended means that LOVE is the SUMMARY of all 10 of the commandments. this is easy kids... romper room stuff.
Once you can tell me which of the 10 commandments you can break and still be loving God and loving your neighbor then you will be getting somewhere... Jesus said on these two commandments hang the whole law. The first 4 commandments are Love God and the Last 6 fall under Love thy neighbor.
Hello? as I said, Romper Room stuff here....
Claudia
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