Should Christians support a platform that keeps abortion on demand abortion choice?

[JonC]

I watched the VP debate last night. I was impressed with Vance and surprised Waltz was such an oaf. But one question came to mind among all the talk.

Should (not "can", we can do a lot) a Christisn support a platform that is dedicated to keeping abortion as a means of birth control a choice for citizens?


For me, the answer is "no". I realize all candidates have to support abortion in order to be a viable candidate. And I realize that supporting abortion is a compromise for many. But I cannot support such a platform.

 

[Charlie24]

I watched the VP debate last night. I was impressed with Vance and surprised Waltz was such an oaf. But one question came to mind among all the talk.

Should (not "can", we can do a lot) a Christisn support a platform that is dedicated to keeping abortion as a means of birth control a choice for citizens?


For me, the answer is "no". I realize all candidates have to support abortion in order to be a viable candidate. And I realize that supporting abortion is a compromise for many. But I cannot support such a platform.

It's difficult times for the believer who is determined to remain true to their Biblical values.

The line that plays on our conscience is being pushed further and further to the left.

 

[Charlie24]

It's difficult times for the believer who is determined to remain true to their Biblical values.

The line that plays on our conscience is being pushed further and further to the left.

I'm not qualified to advise anyone with this struggle.

What comes to mind is the old saying of Dr. Bob. Jones Sr., "do right though the stars fall."

Every one of us has to decide for himself/herself what is right with our conscience in the Word of God.

 

[37818]

The essential principle against murder.
Genesis 9:6, Whoso sheddeth man's blood, by man shall his blood be shed: for in the image of God made he man.

But now who is arguing to make abortion a capital crime?

God already calls this matter for the need for salvation.

1 John 3:15, Whosoever hateth his brother is a murderer: and ye know that no murderer hath eternal life abiding in him.

Abortion is a functional hatered of the unwanted, who are not yet born.

 

[KenH]

From the platform of the American Solidarity Party:

• We recognize that the inalienable right to life, from conception until natural death, must be formally acknowledged by all levels of government. This acknowledgment includes a Human Life Amendment to the U.S. Constitution clarifying that equal protection of the laws applies from the moment of conception, as well as laws that prohibit or restrict abortion at the state and federal level. In the interim, we insist that federal, state, and local governments end taxpayer funding of organizations that provide, promote, or facilitate abortions, and of health care plans that include abortion coverage. We oppose any procedures which cause the intentional destruction of human embryos, procedures which include in-vitro fertilization (IVF).
  
  
• We call for all levels of government to meet the needs of vulnerable women and children, promote a culture of life, and to directly address the maternal mortality rate of US women, by funding crisis pregnancy centers and other organizations that provide prenatal care and maternal support.
  

- American Solidarity Party

 

[JonC]

From the platform of the American Solidarity Party:

• We recognize that the inalienable right to life, from conception until natural death, must be formally acknowledged by all levels of government. This acknowledgment includes a Human Life Amendment to the U.S. Constitution clarifying that equal protection of the laws applies from the moment of conception, as well as laws that prohibit or restrict abortion at the state and federal level. In the interim, we insist that federal, state, and local governments end taxpayer funding of organizations that provide, promote, or facilitate abortions, and of health care plans that include abortion coverage. We oppose any procedures which cause the intentional destruction of human embryos, procedures which include in-vitro fertilization (IVF).
  
  
• We call for all levels of government to meet the needs of vulnerable women and children, promote a culture of life, and to directly address the maternal mortality rate of US women, by funding crisis pregnancy centers and other organizations that provide prenatal care and maternal support.

- American Solidarity Party

That is better on the abortion part.

Who do they have in Congress?

 

[KenH]

That is better on the abortion part.

Who do they have in Congress?

No one. They were on the ballot in Arkansas in 2020(I was one of their 1,713 votes in my state), and they are also on the ballot in Arkansas this year. Here is a map of their current ballot status nationwide:

 

[JonC]

No one. They were on the ballot in Arkansas in 2020(I was one of their 1,713 votes in my state), and they are also on the ballot in Arkansas this year. Here is a map of their current ballot status nationwide:

View attachment 10080

So essentially they are a way for people to make their voices heard (to one another anyway) but not to get anybody elected?

I think that it is impossible for a current party to have a viable candidate, still oppose abortion, and speak in opposition to the LGBT lifestyle.

I could see a "Christian Party", at least to be heard, but given that they would be an extreme minority I doubt anybody would hear their voice.

 

[KenH]

So essentially they are a way for people to make their voices heard (to one another anyway) but not to get anybody elected?

I think that it is impossible for a current party to have a viable candidate, still oppose abortion, and speak in opposition to the LGBT lifestyle.

I could see a "Christian Party", at least to be heard, but given that they would be an extreme minority I doubt anybody would hear their voice.

Well, unless one lives in a "swing state"(Arkansas is 60-65% Republican), folks like me can pretty vote however we want concerning the candidates. The winner in all statewide races in Arkansas is not in doubt. If a Democrat can even reach 40% in a statewide election in Arkansas, it is considered an achievement.

 

[JonC]

Well, unless one lives in a "swing state"(Arkansas is 60-65% Republican), folks like me can pretty vote however we want concerning the candidates. The winner in all statewide races in Arkansas is not in doubt. If a Democrat can even reach 40% in a statewide election in Arkansas, it is considered an achievement.

So parties like the American Solidarity Party merely serve to take away Christian votes (to give the DNC an advantage)?

 

[KenH]

So parties like the American Solidarity Party merely serve to take away Christian votes (to give the DNC an advantage)?

I guess I didn't communicate effectively. I'm sorry. I'll try again:

In Arkansas, a Democrat cannot come within shouting distance of winning a statewide race - whether for the presidency, or the U.S. Senate, or any state office. Thus, it doesn't matter if one votes for a Democrat, or a Libertarian, or the Constitution Party candidate, or the American Solidarity Party candidate, or writes in the current TNA Wrestling world champion Nic Nemeth, the Republican wins all such races without breaking a sweat.

 

[JonC]

I guess I didn't communicate effectively. I'm sorry. I'll try again:

In Arkansas, a Democrat cannot come within shouting distance of winning a statewide race - whether for the presidency, or the U.S. Senate, or any state office. Thus, it doesn't matter if one votes for a Democrat, or a Libertarian, or the Constitution Party candidate, or the American Solidarity Party candidate, or writes in the current TNA Wrestling world champion Nic Nemeth, the Republican wins all such races without breaking a sweat.

I expected this of Arkansas. They have a very conservative population. When I was in Little Rock (decades ago) there was a heavy Christian presence as well.

But I meant on a national scale. Wouldn't such a party only serve to take away the Christian vote from the GOP and help the DNC?

 

[DaveXR650]

For me, the answer is "no". I realize all candidates have to support abortion in order to be a viable candidate. And I realize that supporting abortion is a compromise for many. But I cannot support such a platform.

I fully understand what you are saying and I know Christians who feel the same way and simply can't support either party this time around.
But keep in mind that you may be able to do a lot more than you think by playing the game and using some strategy. The thing to remember is that you don't have to have absolute voting power to get your way. You need enough power that you become essential for a side to win, and then you need the discipline to play some poker so to speak and sometimes you can greatly influence a party. Right to Life used to do that, and so did the NRA. So do the unions.

If the Dems win this one, I see a future of Federal legislation prohibiting any restriction on abortion until birth. If the Republicans win I see a future of conflict with some states putting meaningful restrictions on it and no Federal interference with states that want to do more. I think it's worth it. Read Wilberforce on the battle over slavery in England and you'll see they did everything to manipulate and even trick the opposition into banning slave trade. It's just the way our system works and my own take on it is you do what you can - knowing it won't be perfect and knowing you will be working with people who actually have nothing but contempt for you and your beliefs if the truth were known.

 

[KenH]

But I meant on a national scale. Wouldn't such a party only serve to take away the Christian vote from the GOP and help the DNC?

The same question could be asked about a party, such as the Green Party, taking away(I don't like that terminology, as I don't think that any political party is entitled to anyone's vote, including the two major parties) Progressive Liberal votes from the DNC and, thus, helping the GOP.

The last time a party started up and was able to become a major party with real, sustained influence on elections was the Republican Party in the mid-1850s. Which should pretty much tell you what the chances are of such happening again during the lifetime of anyone currently active on Baptist Board.

 

[Scarlett O.]

I watched the VP debate last night. I was impressed with Vance and surprised Waltz was such an oaf. But one question came to mind among all the talk.

Should (not "can", we can do a lot) a Christisn support a platform that is dedicated to keeping abortion as a means of birth control a choice for citizens?


For me, the answer is "no". I realize all candidates have to support abortion in order to be a viable candidate. And I realize that supporting abortion is a compromise for many. But I cannot support such a platform.

The whole Trump family is pro-choice. Melania just spoke out this past week her own radical views. It's from her new book and Donald told her to write what she believed. She also put this in a video. I saw that.

From The Guardian -

"Melania Trump made an extraordinary declaration in an eagerly awaited memoir to be published a month from election day: she is a passionate supporter of a woman’s right to control her own body – including the right to abortion.

'It is imperative to guarantee that women have autonomy in deciding their preference of having children, based on their own convictions, free from any intervention or pressure from the government,' the Republican nominee’s wife writes, amid a campaign in which Donald Trump’s threats to women’s reproductive rights have played a central role.

'Why should anyone other than the woman herself have the power to determine what she does with her own body? A woman’s fundamental right of individual liberty, to her own life, grants her the authority to terminate her pregnancy if she wishes.

“Restricting a woman’s right to choose whether to terminate an unwanted pregnancy is the same as denying her control over her own body. I have carried this belief with me throughout my entire adult life.'"

 

[Mikoo]

I expected this of Arkansas. They have a very conservative population. When I was in Little Rock (decades ago) there was a heavy Christian presence as well.

But I meant on a national scale. Wouldn't such a party only serve to take away the Christian vote from the GOP and help the DNC?

I thought on another thread you were arguing that Christians couldn't support the DNC or GOP because of their stance on abortion. Why would it matter to you? What is the purpose of your question?

 

[JonC]

I thought on another thread you were arguing that Christians couldn't support the DNC or GOP because of their stance on abortion. Why would it matter to you? What is the purpose of your question?

Yes, I stated my view on another thread, and in the OP here as well.

The purpose of this thread is to discuss whether a Christian should support a platform that presents abortion as a choice.

It matters to me because I am a Christian. It provides insight into the convictions of Christians as well as the compromises Christians are willing to make.

As it stands it seems that Christians are willing to support abortion as a choice when in the past a pro-life stance was very important to most believers.

It demonstrates abortion becoming accepted as a normal element of culture, and that culture influencing professing Christians.

 

[JonC]

I fully understand what you are saying and I know Christians who feel the same way and simply can't support either party this time around.
But keep in mind that you may be able to do a lot more than you think by playing the game and using some strategy. The thing to remember is that you don't have to have absolute voting power to get your way. You need enough power that you become essential for a side to win, and then you need the discipline to play some poker so to speak and sometimes you can greatly influence a party. Right to Life used to do that, and so did the NRA. So do the unions.

If the Dems win this one, I see a future of Federal legislation prohibiting any restriction on abortion until birth. If the Republicans win I see a future of conflict with some states putting meaningful restrictions on it and no Federal interference with states that want to do more. I think it's worth it. Read Wilberforce on the battle over slavery in England and you'll see they did everything to manipulate and even trick the opposition into banning slave trade. It's just the way our system works and my own take on it is you do what you can - knowing it won't be perfect and knowing you will be working with people who actually have nothing but contempt for you and your beliefs if the truth were known.

I agree that the GOP has a less evil platform, but I worry that it is more dangerous to churches (the DNC, obviously, is more dangerous to our nation).

I understanding trying to keep the DNC from making the issue worse. But to be fair, neither side will decrease the number of abortions.

I just cannot bring myself to support the GOP because that would be supporting the GOP platform. I agree with their economic and immigration policies, and I appreciate a move away from "big government".

But I'd be supporting a pro-abortion policy and pro-LGBT normalization policy by supporting the GOP (a less encompassing policy than the DNC, but those evils nonetheless).

I just can't.

 

[Mikoo]

Yes, I stated my view on another thread, and in the OP here as well.

The purpose of this thread is to discuss whether a Christian should support a platform that presents abortion as a choice.

It matters to me because I am a Christian. It provides insight into the convictions of Christians as well as the compromises Christians are willing to make.

As it stands it seems that Christians are willing to support abortion as a choice when in the past a pro-life stance was very important to most believers.

It demonstrates abortion becoming accepted as a normal element of culture, and that culture influencing professing Christians.

I got none of that from your response:

'But I meant on a national scale. Wouldn't such a party only serve to take away the Christian vote from the GOP and help the DNC?'

It must of went right over my head.

 

[Mikoo]

I agree that the GOP has a less evil platform, but I worry that it is more dangerous to churches (the DNC, obviously, is more dangerous to our nation).

I understanding trying to keep the DNC from making the issue worse. But to be fair, neither side will decrease the number of abortions.

I just cannot bring myself to support the GOP because that would be supporting the GOP platform. I agree with their economic and immigration policies, and I appreciate a move away from "big government".

But I'd be supporting a pro-abortion policy and pro-LGBT normalization policy by supporting the GOP (a less encompassing policy than the DNC, but those evils nonetheless).

I just can't.

So it shouldn't matter if another party takes votes away from the GOP.