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Featured Should Women Vote

Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by Salty, Nov 19, 2012.

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  1. Salty

    Salty 20,000 Posts Club
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    This thread is NOT in the political forum because:
    1) the thinking is based on her Biblical interpretation
    2) I want to keep this for the Baptist only section


    Click here for the blog of this lady


    Salty

    ps extra points if you recognize the surname
     
    #1 Salty, Nov 19, 2012
  2. Greektim

    Greektim Well-Known Member

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    bwahahaha... I can't believe you are going to even link us to that blog to get their hit count up.
     
    #2 Greektim, Nov 19, 2012
  3. 12strings

    12strings Active Member

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    I do recognize the surname...and the family photo!

    This church/pastor/wife get a lot of things right, but also get a lot wrong.

    ...and that's all I have to say about that!
     
    #3 12strings, Nov 19, 2012
  4. Aaron

    Aaron Member
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    We must understand that church and community are merely extensions of the family unit. The natural order in the family is also the natural order in society.
     
    #4 Aaron, Nov 19, 2012
  5. mont974x4

    mont974x4 New Member

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    Yep, which is why the liberals attacks on the family have been so devastating to our society.
     
    #5 mont974x4, Nov 19, 2012
  6. preachinjesus

    preachinjesus Well-Known Member
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    The whole post is based on a complete misunderstanding and misapplication of the biblical texts cited.

    The NT is clear about roles for the Christian home and churches. It is not, however, clear about matters outside of those entities. Also, it is clear from a briefest of surveys of the early Christian communities that women did have voices and votes (local pastors and elders were voted on by the early communities) for leadership.

    I've heard this perspective before and rejected it then. One of the challenges of this kind of argumentation is how it lacks a coherent hermeneutical approach. Quite simply it brings in an expectation of roles and behavior and then attempts to interpret the text based on those expectations.

    Women can and should vote. The NT has many of examples of how women were involved with, supported, and performed ministry. We shouldn't apply a misguided interpretation this broadly.
     
    #6 preachinjesus, Nov 19, 2012
  7. Amy.G

    Amy.G New Member

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    Should Deborah have been a judge?
     
    #7 Amy.G, Nov 19, 2012
  8. Scarlett O.

    Scarlett O. Moderator
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    Really, Salty.....REALLY? :BangHead:

    A quote from the link:

    Someone needs to tell this woman that the reason why abortion is legal is because of 7 MEN on the Supreme Court who ruled that banning of abortions is unconstitutional under the 14th amendment.

    In essence, the majority of states who at that time had laws banning abortion were deemed to be in violation of the constitution. State's rights were ignored.

    In fact, of all of the players in the case of Roe v. Wade, only 3 were women.

    Females (3):
    • plaintiff: - Norma McCorvey alias "Jane Roe" - who has since been converted to Christ and is a public pro-life activist.
    • attorneys: - Sarah Weddington and Linda Coffee
    Males (13):
    • defendent: - Henry B. Wade, District Attorney for Dallas County, Texas
    • attorneys: - John Tolle, Jay Floyd and Robert Flowers
    • Majority rule from U.S. Supreme Court: - Harry Blackmun, William J. Brennan, Chief Justice Warren Burger, William O. Douglas, Thurgood Marshall, Lewis Powell and Potter Stewart. In part, Harry Blackmun's majority opinion read: "State criminal abortion laws, like those involved here, that except from criminality only a life-saving procedure on the mother's behalf without regard to the stage of her pregnancy and other interests involved violate the Due Process Clause of the Fourteenth Amendment, which protects against state action the right to privacy, including a woman's qualified right to terminate her pregnancy. Though the State cannot override that right, it has legitimate interests in protecting both the pregnant woman's health and the potentiality of human life, each of which interests grows and reaches a "compelling" point at various stages of the woman's approach to term. Pp. 147-164."
    • Opposition opinion from U.S. Supreme Court: - William Rehnquist and Byron White.
    When people like this woman (and yes, I know who she is) make statements like "It's because women vote that we have abortions", I just want scream.

    This is nothing but ignorance. Ignorance of the Bible, of history, of civics, and of basic knowledge.

     
    #8 Scarlett O., Nov 19, 2012
  9. Amy.G

    Amy.G New Member

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    Where is the like button???? :thumbsup::thumbsup:
     
    #9 Amy.G, Nov 19, 2012
  10. OldRegular

    OldRegular Well-Known Member

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    Salty you done done it!
     
    #10 OldRegular, Nov 19, 2012
  11. Salty

    Salty 20,000 Posts Club
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    The reason for this discussion is so that we are aware of it. Women in churches probally do not speak of it to begin with. Therefore, we may not actually realize that believe that doctrine.

    We need to fully understdand the scriptue "in question" and properly defend it.
     
    #11 Salty, Nov 19, 2012
  12. HeirofSalvation

    HeirofSalvation Well-Known Member
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    Did God Call her to it? Or did he call Barak?
     
    #12 HeirofSalvation, Nov 19, 2012
  13. Scarlett O.

    Scarlett O. Moderator
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    God called Barak to be the one to take soldiers from Naphtali and Zebulun to Mount Tabor and to destroy Sisera. In fact, God said that he would deliver Sisera into Barak's hands.

    Deborah prophecied that call to Barak from God. In fact, she prophecied how the whole event would take place and that a woman would be the one to actually kill Sisera.

    God has already told the people how to tell a genuine prophet from a false one in Deuteronomy 18:20-22

    Everything she said came true and she and Barak gave God the credit for it and sang a song of praise exalting God's Name. They also recognized the men of Naphtali, of Zebulun, and the woman Jael for there roles in stepping up to the plate for God when others would not.​

    I see no where in the story where either Deborah or Barak were not doing what they were supposed to be doing.

    Nor is there in the story WHY God chose Deborah and Barak to do what they did.​
     
    #13 Scarlett O., Nov 19, 2012
    Last edited: Nov 19, 2012
  14. HeirofSalvation

    HeirofSalvation Well-Known Member
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    You are absolutely correct...Deborah was indeed a "Prophetess" and she was absolutely correct...

    Her status as a "prophetess" is un-disputed........I also think that David's wife Abigail was one too. But that isn't what I asked Amy.

    Yes, now please provide the context of that!!!
     
    #14 HeirofSalvation, Nov 19, 2012
  15. Scarlett O.

    Scarlett O. Moderator
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    Deborah was a prophet and a judge. The Bible says that. I can't make it say anything it doesn't say nor question the motives of God.

    Yes, judges were military in nature, but Deborah was there with Barak and his troops on top of Mount Tabor and gave him the encourage and the command to down the mountain and destroy Sisera.

    I don't know why people like to discard her as a judge. I don't know why God made her a judge and neither does anyone else unless they are making personal opinions and suppositions.

    It is what it is.

     
    #15 Scarlett O., Nov 19, 2012
  16. Amy.G

    Amy.G New Member

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    Judges 4:4 And Deborah, a prophetess, the wife of Lapidoth, she judged Israel at that time.

    Yes, God appointed her. Her office as judge is verified in that she was also a genuine prophetess. God was with her.
    I don't even know why you would question it.
     
    #16 Amy.G, Nov 19, 2012
  17. HeirofSalvation

    HeirofSalvation Well-Known Member
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    "Judge" and "Prophetess" are not the same word or office at all.........
    That is issue 1

    It is a fact, that...she "judged" Israel; it is also a fact that according to God's Word: "There was no king in Israel, and men did that which was right in their own eyes."
    So, Did God "Call" her to be a "Judge" in the same sense that he "called" Barak?....Provide the context.

    Saul prophesied, the Holy Spirit came upon him, and he prophesied...does that then mean that God's perfect plan was for Israel to have a king in the first place?? Amy........did that make him a "Judge"???? Different offices, different times. Please provide the context of GOD'S call to the status of "Judge" Both for Barak and for Deborah....
    It is not so complicated as you might think.
    I don't necessarily want women's suffrage removed...I just want the women on this board who are so obviously gung-ho for it, to know why they think it is so important and to properly defend it. We need them to explain why, without an equivocation between the office of "PROPHET" and "JUDGE".

    Betwixt yourself and Scarlett...neither of you have answered my simple and basic question in a straight-forward manner. I asked the question I asked for a reason.
     
    #17 HeirofSalvation, Nov 19, 2012
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 19, 2012
  18. Amy.G

    Amy.G New Member

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    Deborah was a Judge of Israel. What is your point HOS???
     
    #18 Amy.G, Nov 19, 2012
  19. HeirofSalvation

    HeirofSalvation Well-Known Member
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    That is a veritable dearth of "I don't knows"........ I do, though, and if you study the context and answer the questions I am posing to you, you will. If you don't know, then ask your husband, as the Scriptures instruct you to.

    I BTW....wouldn't take away "Women's Suffrage" in this Country, because our policies would be inconsistent.....namely:

    1.) If they can pay taxes....they should vote
    2.) If they can own property they should vote


    3.) Answer the questions I posed.........and you might see something there you haven't seen before...maybe not, but try it.
     
    #19 HeirofSalvation, Nov 19, 2012
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 19, 2012
  20. HeirofSalvation

    HeirofSalvation Well-Known Member
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    If you have a husband to explain what it is............then ask him. It's painfully obvious if you merely answer the questions I posed in their appropriate contexts.....I'm not going to give it to you.....But, if you read the Blog referred and linked to in the OP.......She explains it quite clearly.
     
    #20 HeirofSalvation, Nov 19, 2012
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