Soul winning...whose job?

[Jensen]

On another topic in the baptist denom. section, people brought up some concerns about the SBC and fewer baptisms, etc...

Here are some questions I would like to see people respond to:

1. Who's job is it to evangelize? Who's job is it to regenerate the soul?
2. If "so-and-so" does not hear me tell them the gospel (and give them an invitation...another story right there) and they leave my presence and get in a wreck and die without saving faith .... who's fault was their going to hell? Mine for not sharing the gospel? Theirs for not trusting in Christ?
3. In other words - who does the converting? God or man? Put it this way - can there ever be one of God's elect that ends up in hell because a person didn't share the gospel with them? If no, then it must be God's responsability to convert the soul. Salvation is all of Him.
4. If it is man's job ... then let's just eliminate parts of the message (the unessential things - if there were such things) to make it "taste: better. We could even have "give aways" --- like a prize system to those who give their "life" to Christ. Any child who makes a profession could get a bicycle.... and a new 4-wheeler if they get baptized! Take about "decisions!

Why are there fewer "baptisms" in the SBC? Maybe more and more pastors are not baptizing pagans... or maybe, just maybe God is not electing as many people unto Salvation because of His sovereign choice!

Just some thought. Please respond.

Steve

 

[Johnv]

Jensen, when a church is growing, detractors will say "it must be growing because they're not doing something right".

Then, when a church is not growing, the same detractors will say "it must not be growing because they're not doing something right".

Typically, I don't think the size (or rate of growth/shrinkage) of a church is the primary factor in a church's ability to adhere to the Gospel. It certainly should not be a litmus test.

 

[HankD]

Soul winning...whose job?

The Trinity.

John 6:44 No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.

Mathew 11:26
27 All things are delivered unto me of my Father: and no man knoweth the Son, but the Father; neither knoweth any man the Father, save the Son, and he to whomsoever the Son will reveal him.

John 16:8 And when he (the Spirit) is come, he will reprove the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment

 

[pinoybaptist]

Originally posted by HankD:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Soul winning...whose job?

The Trinity.

John 6:44 No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.

Mathew 11:26
27 All things are delivered unto me of my Father: and no man knoweth the Son, but the Father; neither knoweth any man the Father, save the Son, and he to whomsoever the Son will reveal him.

John 16:8 And when he (the Spirit) is come, he will reprove the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment </font>[/QUOTE]And the Three-in-One did a thorough and complete job in the Person of Jesus Christ, God's only begotten Son.

Thank you, HankD.

 

[pinoybaptist]

Originally posted by Jensen:
On another topic in the baptist denom. section, people brought up some concerns about the SBC and fewer baptisms, etc...

Here are some questions I would like to see people respond to:

1. Who's job is it to evangelize?

Clearly, scripture says those in the ministry should evangelize. The real question is what is the purpose of evangelization ? Is it to "save" souls ? Or to tell the good news of salvation to those for whom the good news is intended ? Is the good news for the entire world ? Or is it for those whose ears the Lord had opened and whose souls panteth after God and thirst for righteousness ?

Who's job is it to regenerate the soul?

That is exclusively the Holy Spirit's job. He needs no help from nobody, nor from anything, at any time.

2. If "so-and-so" does not hear me tell them the gospel (and give them an invitation...another story right there) and they leave my presence and get in a wreck and die without saving faith .... who's fault was their going to hell? Mine for not sharing the gospel? Theirs for not trusting in Christ?

Leave that to the hands of a God infinitely wiser and merciful than any of us can ever hope to be wise, or any of us fancy ourselves merciful.

3. In other words - who does the converting? God or man? Put it this way - can there ever be one of God's elect that ends up in hell because a person didn't share the gospel with them? If no, then it must be God's responsability to convert the soul. Salvation is all of Him.

Regeneration and eternal salvation is all of God's business, that's His, ain't ours in anyway. However, conversion is where God uses means. He may use a man, he may use events in a person's life, he may use nature, he may use the preached word, or His written word. To answer your question: there is no way any of God's elect will end up in hell because a missionary, a preacher, or another believer did not get to preach the gospel to them before their demise.

4. If it is man's job ... then let's just eliminate parts of the message (the unessential things - if there were such things) to make it "taste: better. We could even have "give aways" --- like a prize system to those who give their "life" to Christ. Any child who makes a profession could get a bicycle.... and a new 4-wheeler if they get baptized! Take about "decisions!

Oh, but, many churches are doing that already. In my early years in the Bible Baptist churches, I used to be struck by the similarities between their 'soul winning' programs and the sales and marketing promotion programs that the company I worked for had been implementing for years.

You know. Pert/cpm and goals and objectives in commercial business versus evaluations, and target souls, and those after-visitation meetings in the afternoon-after-church soul-winning and visitation programs.

Imagine the effect of that commercialization of salvation to a just converted atheist !

 

[GODzThunder]

the reason there are fewer baptisms in the SBC today is that the Church today, not just the SBC but all Churches, are pulling away from truth and Spirit. Yesterday's generation did not have to go out soulwinning, at least not in the way that the Church does today. This is because back in 1930 everyone went to Church. Those who did not attend Church in most communities were seen as sinners and outcasts. It was the norm to go to Church. Prayer was expected in school. respect to parents was demanded in the home. Now in 2004 more and more people are turing away from truth to fulfill their own selfish needs. The Church in kind is not increasing their efforts to win these lost who know not of the saving grace of Christ. Many in the Church today are still living off the expectations that all people just know they need God and are just being stubborn. The truth is that today's generation does not know Christ thus we need soul winners who are willing to go and get these people. You would be suprised how many people would come to know Christ just by invitation.

 

[GODzThunder]

as for the suggestion in number four. I do believe that I know a great many people who would "get saved" for a prize. Does that spark a genuine relationship with Christ though? I once got a $50.00 gift card in the mail to go try red lobster. The intention of the company was that I would try the restaurant and like it enough that it would become my favorite. I used the card and I liked what I ate but my heart did not jump for joy to the point that red lobster became my favorite place. prizes do not spark relationships. Such things done in the Church today remind me about Judas selling out his Lord for 30 pieces of silver.