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Suicide Bombings

Discussion in 'General Baptist Discussions' started by Ben W, Nov 5, 2005.

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  1. Ben W

    Ben W Active Member
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    Below is an excerpt from Tony Campolo's recent book "Where I stand".

    Tony Campolo has brought up the topic on how Christians and Muslims relate which is not an easy topic to bring up in fundamentalist circles because it can be implied that Tony is not doing enough to share the gospel with muslims. Yet nothing could actually be further from the truth.

    In any event I would be interested in your thoughts on this excerpt.

    - TC: Peter Arnett used to be with CNN. I know him and I met him in an airport in Chicago, and I said, "Peter so glad to see you, I'm running out of stories. Tell me a story." He said, "I've got one . . . I'm in the West bank, a bomb goes off and bodies are blown through the air. The Israeli troops seal off the whole area. A man comes running up to me with a bloody little girl in his arms, and says, 'You are press, you can get us out of here. If I don't get her into a hospital then immediately she's going to die. You can get us out of here. You are press'. Peter said, "I put them in the back seat and threw a blanket over them."

    And I did get through the lines. As I rushed towards Tel Aviv in the car, I could hear him in the back seat, as he rocked this little girl in his arms whispering, "Go faster, oh God help him to go faster. God help him to go faster. Then he starts moaning, I'm losing her! I'm losing her! Oh God I'm losing her, I'm losing her!" Peter said by the time I got to the hospital I was emotionally drained. They took the little girl into the operating room, and the two of us sat down on a bench in the waiting room, exhausted. We must have sat there a half hour, silent, exhausted from the emotion. The doctor came out and said, "I'm sorry. She's dead." This man dissolved in tears. I put my arm around him and said, I'm not married. I don't have any children. I don't know what it's like to lose a daughter. The man snapped his head back and said, "My daughter? That little girl is not my child. I'm an Israeli settler, she's a Muslim girl.

    (by Shane Claiborne)

    - What can we learn about that kind of spirituality that can help us find common ground? No theological statements were made, no compromising beliefs, no attempts to come to a common denominator. And yet, a kind of spiritual oneness.

    That's the place where we come together, in common need and common suffering, as we reach out to one another in love, leaving judgment in the hands of God, sharing out of our own faith. I mean the last thing we are asking in those times is—is your theology the same as mine?—and vice-versa. All of the sudden in the hour of suffering there is a commonality. And that's where we meet. It's in mystical spirituality and in communal mutuality that's where we come together.

    (Tony Campolo, after hearing that story about the little girl dying.)
     
    #1 Ben W, Nov 5, 2005
  2. Joseph_Botwinick

    Joseph_Botwinick <img src=/532.jpg>Banned

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    Has nothing to do with sprituality or mysticism. Has everything to do with being human and caring for others no matter what race they are.

    Joseph Botwinick
     
    #2 Joseph_Botwinick, Nov 5, 2005
  3. tinytim

    tinytim <img src =/tim2.jpg>

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    It has always amazed me that in all cultures there is a conscience.

    I all cultures it is recognized to be wrong to:
    Murder
    abandon children
    dishonor father and mother
    lie
    steal
    (there are others you may want to add)

    There is an underlying knowledge of right and wrong, that I believe God placed in all human beings. (some call a conscience)

    When talking to others from other cultures and religions we can tap into this reserve and guide them to the true religion, and relationship with our Lord, Jesus Christ.
     
    #3 tinytim, Nov 5, 2005
  4. Marcia

    Marcia Active Member

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    I think Tony is reading too much into this. People tend to come together in disasters. They tend to feel for children especially no matter who they are or what side they are on. The answer is certainly not in "mystic spirituality," which I don't think this story represents anyway.

    I also think Tony makes a false dichotomoy here between saying "is your theology my theology" or having compassion for others. We can show compassion and care while at the same time being discerning and aware of theological boundaries (as in Christian vs. non-Christian).
     
    #4 Marcia, Nov 5, 2005
  5. Joseph_Botwinick

    Joseph_Botwinick <img src=/532.jpg>Banned

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    Exactly right. It is yet more of Campolo's liberal ecumenicalism that attempts to tear down theological barriers and endorse the universalist theology that we all worship the same god. Where he messes up is that compassion is a human trait that is universal whether they believe in God or not. I know some compassionate atheist. We do not share the same theology however.

    Joseph Botwinick
     
    #5 Joseph_Botwinick, Nov 5, 2005
  6. StraightAndNarrow

    StraightAndNarrow Active Member

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    Bush took that position when he claimed that Moslems and Christians worship the same god and each have their own way to heaven. But I suppose that's judging Bush when you're not judging Tony Campolo?
     
    #6 StraightAndNarrow, Nov 7, 2005
  7. bapmom

    bapmom New Member

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    What does Bush have to do with it?
     
    #7 bapmom, Nov 7, 2005
  8. superdave

    superdave New Member

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    There is also a huge difference between helping out a little muslim girl, or even caring for the medical needs of a captured terrorist, or whatever situation you want to come up with, and cooperating in ministry with someone who denies Christ, or saying that their "way" is acceptable to God.

    Yes, we are all humans, created in the image of God, for the purpose of bringing him Glory, thats true regardless of stated religion or belief system. We have a commonality on that level, it is a whole other arena to speak about that giving creedence to any religious dogma that denies or adds to the true Gospel.
     
    #8 superdave, Nov 7, 2005
  9. Joseph_Botwinick

    Joseph_Botwinick <img src=/532.jpg>Banned

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    Bush took that position when he claimed that Moslems and Christians worship the same god and each have their own way to heaven. But I suppose that's judging Bush when you're not judging Tony Campolo? </font>[/QUOTE]Bush was and is wrong about that. Theologically speaking, he is a heretic. He is not, however, a pastor like Tony Campolo. Therefore, his opinions about the Bible and religion are as irrelevant as Barbara Streisdand and Michael Moore's opinion are about politics.

    Joseph Botwinick
     
    #9 Joseph_Botwinick, Nov 7, 2005
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