Featured The Amorality of Music

There are a lot of things in this world that tempt us to do things. I reject the premise that teens just cannot help but react tot he beat.I reject that notion that music is a mind altering drug.

While music has its effect on our emotions it does not force our behavior. A rather absurd notion. I would sooner believe in UFO's and Big Foot.

 

The point of the OP is that music is not benign or amoral.

Music therapy is vital to reaching those who are so bound that all other communications are vain imaginations.

Music is purposed to touch the heart and geared toward acceptance based on purely emotional conditions and not rational decision making.

It is well documented that certain combinations and repetitive rhythmic patterns numb the mind and engage basal forms of behaviors. Merely shifting the beat emphasis from the typical 1st and 3rd beats of a four beat march to that of the 2nd and 4th, gives the music a much different body motion to both performers and listeners. The vertical straight marching steps obliged by that of the 1st and 3rd emphasis is completely lost and replaced by far more horizontal hip sway with opposing arm movement obliged by the 2nd and 4th emphasis. The movement is further changed when certain syncopation patterns are applied, and rhythmic patterns of the heart are repeated. More change is evident when the heart patterns turn to the opposite of the heart beat. Add to that the sub base that mimics the rhythmic aspects of the breathing and heart, and it is not unusual to see a person responding in inappropriate behavior patterns.

That quick look into a single element of music was to demonstrate that it can be used as a "mind altering drug" as exampled by David and King Saul.

Often believers will meditate to music and find their emotional and even physical state modified.

If in these few examples it is demonstrated that music has "mind altering factors" the certainly the unregenerate heart listening to Satanic generated music is not going to have their mind, soul, and spirit become more rational and Godly.

You do bring up a point in the statement "While music has its effect on our emotions it does not force our behavior." However, I am not certain that extrapolation would be in agreement to validate the statement.

Going back to the example of the unregenerate. The music listened too is provided by evil Satanic hearts and presented to the heart of the unregenerate in such a way as that person will accept all manor of evil language, thoughts, attitudes, and scenes. In effect, the person becomes indoctrinated, "brain washed" and controlled perhaps even possessed of demonic forces and influences presented by the music.

The obvious question is, then does that person's behavior become modified and perverted by the music? If for instance the music is filled with sexual violence and hate, will the listener who fills their life with that steady indoctrination not be altered?

Is this then not music "forcing behavior?" Certainly, the person has a choice as to acting out, just as all perverts have a choice to manifest the perversion.

But there is one difference when comparing music to any other fine arts form. Music touches the heart/emotions before the rational even makes consideration. Even a child will respond with like or not like within a few bars of a tune played without even a rational reason. There is some attractive element (rhythm, tempo, style, mode, timbre, ...) that engages the child far sooner than rational examination of "why."

Did the demoniac that ran nude, broke chains, and lived in the tombs have control over his behavior?

Not saying that the demoniac got that way through music, just questioning how the extrapolation of satanic music indoctrination and possession does not result it forced control.

 

1. I, like mandym, reject that music CAUSES sinful behavior in and of itself.

2. Regarding addiction, the human mind is incredibly adept at becoming addicted to almost anything, and if we were to villify everything on which one can be addicted, we would have to cut out hundred's of good things from our lives.

3. Music CAN alter your emotions, but does not force anyone do to anything they did not already want to do. People at rock concerts want to dance, want to sway thier hips, want to interact sexually. HOWEVER...the fact that music affects emotions does not mean it has inherent morality, but that it has emotional effects. War marches, College theme songs, Jingle-bells, hymn-tunes...they all convey different emotions, but NONE of them are sinful!
-Music should be used carefully in a way that fits the message, but there are many types of GOOD messages that can be conveyed: Stately hymn tunes matched with text on the majesty of God, light-hearted happy-birthday to your toddler son, and even Hard, driving Rock matched with a text like: "Wake up and see the glory!" (Steven Curtis chapman song about not settling for small wordly satisfactions when God offers his infinite self).
-I might play some Manhiem Steamroller (Rock instrumental group that does rock versions of classical music...thier version of carol of the bells is great) while I'm doing some house-cleaning, because it gives me a little energy boost. The fact that I shouldn't play that same music the next time I run sound for a funeral doesn't mean the first is IMMORAL.

4. I like Folk music, blue-grass, Acoustic Rock, Driving Rock, Hymns, Classical and many other types of music. I don't particularly like Hip-hop, rap, modern Country, or death-metal, or 20th century atonal music. BUT... I can see how each of these styles CAN BE REDEEMED and used for good purposes...Perhaps not much use in an actual worship service for a few of them, but I can't say they are inherntly IMMORAL... The reason is that the bible doesn't say they are...and I am not willing to go around calling things sinful that the Bible doesn't.

 

regarding this i-dose stuff, I had not heard of that...BUT...

...I searched it on you-tube and found a teen boy who video-taped himself listening to "gates of hades" in this format...(there are other videos of people being really scared by it, so he wanted to try it). He quit after 4 minutes CUZ HE WAS BORED!!! Doesn't sound like an uncontrollable force to me. He said it got his blood pumping a little bit, but not much else.

It simply shows that different people react differently to the same music. Play Justin Bieber in a room of teenage girls, with thier parents, and you will see this very clearly...the music has NO EFFECT on middle-aged people! (well, repulsion is an effect, I guess)

Music can scare people, and bring up many other emotions, but it is because we have strong associations with music, and the music brings up thoughts that we already have in our head.

The National Anthem would not make anyone think of America if they had never heard of america, and known this song to be associated with it.

 

Here we come to an important issue in this discussion: What EXACTLY is the line between GOOD music and EVIL music? If you maintain that music has morality, there must be a line. Some point to the beat on 2 & 4...what about Rock-music that is in 3/4 or 6/8, or 7/8 for that matter? Is it certain instruments? Is 6 strings more sinful than 88 keys? Is a drum inherently sinful? THERE IS NO BIBLICAL ANSWER TO ANY OF THESE QUESTIONS.

-Further, The hip-sway method of dancing often seen is modern dancing is, unfortunately something that girls pick-up very early from TV and watching other people...however I don't think the music did it...They learned it by imitation. I have noticed that there is a difference between young girls who have been exposed to things like hanna-montana, and those who have been somewhat sheltered...The sheltered girls don't dance that way, even when there is rock music...they just kind of bounce up and down.


Displaying that music affects emotions is a far cry from displaying that music has MORAL essence. No one disputes that music affects emotions...but those emotions, like music, can be USED for good or evil. Dark reds and oranges in restaurants make me hungrier...can i blame my gluttony on the color, and consider myself more holy if I avoid those colors because I consider them immoral? NO. Why? Because the Bible doesn't say they are sinful, so neither do I.

 

Woody here is a link to a site that deals with it from a Christian standpoint.
http://www.av1611.org/articles.html#Rock

http://www.av1611.org/articles.html#Crock

 

We are still asking the wrong question regarding things we do in the flesh. The question is not: What is wrong with it? The pointy question is: What is right with it?

Our problem: We want to offer fleshly offerings. God cannot be worshipped in the flesh--it matters not how we candy coat it.

We have redefined what a spiritual song might be. Try "Amazing Grace"--acapella. It will put one to the knees--where we need to be to worship God in spirit and in truth.

We live in an amoral world--the audio/video, including so-called Christian Rock proves this fact. Many ecumenical churches have conformed. New Testament churches are conforming.

Even so, come Lord Jesus.

This is an introduction to a sermon.

Peace,

Bro. James

 

Same thing

YOu do not know what you are talking about. I contradicted nothing and a mind altering drug is one that effects the nervous system and chemical balance in the body.

I grew up listening to the same kind of music and at no point did I enter an altered state.

Yea...it doesn't do that either.

Whether music is amoral or not your claims are absurd. I sat and listened to the same garbage in IBC when I was young. Entire sermons were created devoid of any scripture by preachers who were scared to death of the African off beat that would alter your mind and was straight from hell.


The claim is just as ridiculous now as it was then.

 

Music is sounds. Vibrations from a vibrating string, vocal chord, or membrane that travels through the air to your ear which translates them into electrical signals to the brain. IT CANNOT FEED THE SOUL! It is a physical phenomenon. God alone can feed the soul!

The reasons I would condemn weed smokers are (1) because on your FIRST puff of weed, you begin to get high...ie Drunk...The bible condemns drunkenness, & (2) If someone is seeking refuge and security in a drug, they are not seeking that refuge in God. Not seeking God and drunkenness are sins spoken of the bible. Listening to "LOUD CYMBALS" is not...in fact its encouraged and commanded..
-BTW, weed does not affect your emotions IN THE SAME WAY as music. It's a DIFFERENT way.

If my wife is leaving the house and our kids are screaming, and she is in a hurry, I might very well scream "I LOVE YOU!" so she can hear me. I don't like crazy screams of death metal any more than you, but there are places in our lives for cries of distress to God (check the psalms)...These could be it, I don't know. Anyway, Death metal screams are really on the periphery of this discussion, since it seems some want to arbitrarily say anything with a back beat or electric guitar is automatically sinful...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DvoIF_4N8zY

Your problem is you are calling Rock Music trash without (1) defining what Rock Music is (2) showing why this style of music is indeed a dumpster, rather than perhaps a mine with lots of dirt, but also quite a few diamonds in the rough.

It is precisely the desire for "fresh" music that drives and allows us to use multiple varied styles of music to Glorify God by Expressing praise to God, edifying truth to people, love to my wife, happy birthday wishes to my son, and simple enjoyment music while I clean the house or work in the garage.

 

You may be familiar with Steve Camp. He (10 or more years ago) wrote a 107 theses indicting the CCM industry for straying after worldly things...HOWEVER, his case is not with the music style, but with the heart, theology, and lifestyle of the musicians involved...which is where it should be. You can read the whole thing here:

http://www.wphafm.org/107Theses.htm

Notice all the scripture he uses! He does not call for an end to Contemporary Christian music, because the Bible doesn't ban musical styles.

"Praise the Lord with Loud Cymbals!"

 

FYI...I'll be at out of town and away from a Computer until Friday...taking a group of Teenagers to a church camp where we will praise God with Loud cymbals, stringed instruments, & subwoofers...I'll try to find this thread again when I get back. So write some good stuff everybody!:smilewinkgrin:

 

jusy wondering if the Lord can redeem ANY musical style to his glory? My understanding is that its not in the "beat" that makes music good/bad, but in its content and message!

 

Music can affect moods and motives. The same music can do different things to different people. In my case, at church, I find traditional hymns, special music, and arrangements like Handel's Messiah very inspirational and stirs my soul. There is nothing wrong with contemporary music, Gaither style, or Southern Gospel, but it bores me to tears, so I ignore it.

On the secular side, I find classical music very relaxing. I stay away from modern music, as the words are almost always filth or trash. My pop music listening is mostly confined to the 50s and 60s, and the light rock. I stay away from the heavy rock or music to take drugs by.

I enjoy insturmental music, such as Love is Blue, the theme to the Good, Bad and Ugly, and theme from the Lone Ranger, Classical Gas, etc.

I think music is a gift from God to be used for all sorts of occasions, but mainly to worship Him.

There is no right or wrong music, this is just my preference. I think any type of music or anything else in life that puts something before the Lord is better left alone.

 

Very interesting post. Thanks for doing the research. I have said on this Forum that music itself can affect the emotions and I object to certain music in the worship services. It appears that your research confirms that opinion.

Your comments on music in silent movies is particularly interesting since some movie channels play the old silent movies.

 

Sapper Woody

Reading some of the responses to your OP I see you are getting a lot of nonsensical flack from some folks. I also see that you handle them very well. My respects to you!

 

We seem to be having a problem in definitions: amoral, immoral and moral. Our codes of conduct are based on our flesh nature which is totally depraved. God has a moral code for man: Be ye holy as I am holy. Of himself, man can never make that bar. We think we want to keep a code of law without realizing that we cannot of our selves do so. "All have sinned and come short of the glory of God".

A divine law was given to Israel. They could not keep it. God gave it to them to show they could not keep a law. We have the same problem today--we think we can keep some sort of code to get right with God--a salvation by our works. We also think we can worship God in our flesh. "No es possible". We have difficulty defining the line between flesh and spirit--especially in worship.

Back to morals--amorality is a lack of moral code. If it feels good do it--as long as it does not infringe on the amorality of others.

Immorality is an interesting notion--an act contrary to the code of man, not necessarily of God. That which is immoral seems to change with who is inside the beltway. God's code does not change.

Morality is having a concept of that which is right and that which is wrong. We spent a lot to have the ten commandents carved in stone in various places of law making. Now we want to have such removed--along with prayer and any references to GAOTU. Many of our founding fathers were Deists/Humanists, not necessarily followers of Immanuel.

We have watered down what true worship of God might be--we are like Cain changing the spiritual to the carnal. Worship has become entertainment. We applaud one another's performances like glee clubs of holiness. God is not looking for entertainment. Most of what we do is of wood, hay and stubble. It will not survive the Bema Seat.

Be careful what we call a "joyful noise" which is fact is clanging brass and tinkling cymbals.

The big problem with music is the beat--it has a mesmerizing effect on the whole body. The bump-bump-bump came out of Equatorial Africa to become Rock and Roll, then AC/DC. The entertainment industry is still greatly enriched--God probably does not get 10%.

The definition of amoral probably does not include the concept of neutrality. But rather it is slanted toward the flesh, which in man's depraved code may seem spiritual.

Acapella is still the safest position in terms of worship.

Peace,

Bro. James