The CALL, Is there One Call to All or not

I'll post my previous reply to this & then pick up on your argument. Then we can go from there, but right now, I have to get busy, so I'll post my prior post.

 

Feeble call, as you call it: Mat 22:14 For many are called, but few are chosen. Can be rejected as when the gospel is preached.
Powerful call inclusive of only the elect: 1Co 1:23 But we preach Christ crucified, unto the Jews a stumblingblock, and unto the Greeks foolishness;
1Co 1:24 But unto them which are called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God, and the wisdom of God.

1Co 1:26 For ye see your calling, brethren, how that not many wise men after the flesh, not many mighty, not many noble, are called:

This "calling" - invitation is only to a few. I.E. "the chosen" - "elect", which is the drive of the context. I.E. "the foolish things, weak things, base things, despised things, etc.

 

Quote Allan: In other words God does something (general Call) without any purpose to it since He is not expecting any results from it. End Quote.

God is not per-say, "expecting results" from His call from even the elect. Since He is the One who produces the results, then He knows what will be, for He will bring it to pass.
As I have said, the general call, is general, because the elect are among the "world". It is a fact that the gospel preached to every creature will only be received or believed by the elect. The gospel is the means by which God calls His elect, but the Spirit applies with power the gospel to the elect.

 

I must also make the point concerning the sheep "elect".
The salvation of God's elect is not the transference from being a goat to becoming a sheep. Notice this:

Joh 10:15 As the Father knoweth me, even so know I the Father: and I lay down my life for the sheep.
Joh 10:16 And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one fold, and one shepherd.

It has been pointed out by others that the "other sheep" are the gentiles. To this I agree, but that does not change the fact that these are not saved as yet when Christ makes this statement, & yet they are identified as his sheep - elect - given to him by the Father.
And lest the argument be made, that this group is not a group identified, but is just a big glob not identified the Scripture says: Joh 10:27 My sheep hear my voice, and I know them. Christ identifies a personal relationship & fellowship with his sheep. This has to take in individuals. For what is his flock "elect" but a group of individuals? In Mat 7:23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity. He speaks this to individuals in the last day. I never knew you. These were not Christ's sheep. In eternity or time.

Though in their sins, they are under the wrath of God, God's election of them in Christ has secured their salvation & the elect of God are saved from wrath. And classes them as Christ's flock even before their salvation.

 

jne;
Get yourself a pen to write with and put down the crayons please

 

Questions:

Why, if Christ died for pre-selected individuals, does God need to wait for them to believe? Why not just regenerate them all and be done with it?

2 Peter 3:9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.

If the "any" in this verse is to be understood as "the elect", why the "longsuffering"? If the "any is "the elect", this verse has God patiently waiting for Himself to regenerate the elect so that none of them will perish. He is patiently waiting for them to "come to repentance" which they are not capable of doing until He regenerates them. This would make God longsuffering toward Himself. Would it not?

 

These are questions you should address to God Himself. All I am capable of showing is what Scripture says, not why God decided to do this or that. This is the whole problem. Can man be content to let God be God? You could just as soon ask, why did God let Satan become as he is, why did He permit the fall, why wait till Satan has damned so many to put him in hell, why create hell for to punish man for eternity? Why does God say He hates sin & then permit it to be? These are questions only answered in the wisdom of God. Not in our ability to explain them all. We must be willing to accept God as He makes His ways manifest.

 

Quote Blammo: This would make God longsuffering toward Himself. Would it not? End Quote.

Answer, no. He is long suffering to usward. It is plain to see if you understand how God views us outside of Christ, that if He waits till the time appointed by Himself to save us, that is still long suffering, considering the fact He could have chosen to put us in hellfire.
Why did he wait to send Christ? Why not send him before the law? Was God long suffering to Himself then or to the people? We should be content to believe the report & leave the difficult questions to God's wisdom & believe He knows what He is doing.

 

I was actually hoping you had some answers. Oh well.

BTW, the questions I asked are not simple "why did God do that" questions, they are "if the verse means what the calvinists say it means, does it make any sense?" questions.

 

I think you know why I answered the way I did. Lets not play games. I could ask you, if God knows who will believe & who will not, why not save all the believers in one shot & take them all to heaven & be done with it. But God has chosen to wait. That is His business.

 

I wonder, what else is there left to say. I see now how Calvinist become so wrapped up in their belief. After being taught by the "hand picked Decrees", what else could they believe. I always said Calvinist read Roman and Eph and spend the rest of their time trying to make the rest of the whole bible line up with what they got out of Romans and Eph.

 

That's pretty good, considering the time you have spent trying to make the whole Bible square with what you think John 3:16 means.:thumbs:

 

I just use that one because you all have such a rough time with it and I enjoy watching you try

 

You have found no rough time here & you know it. I have no problem with that verse at all. But I am not filling up another thread telling you why. I am content this far to let you believe as you wish.:wavey:

 

Hello Allan,

For a person that has spent the last few weeks saying to many people (Calvinist) hold to logic and/or theology and not the Bible, you just blow your idea with this long OP.

logic?

Theology? Allan...how could you???

Yes..we all do it. We cannot have our faith as we know it without theology.

So lets look close....one passage at a time. 1st...what does Ed have to do with this passage as you posted the words above?

I will even tell you before hand where I'm going with this.
After we address Ed from your OP, we will link it to foreknow your key point. If foreknow (as you see it) falls, everything will fall. We shall see what happens.


In Christ...James

 

good answer I guess

I too have filled up pages refuting your answers and that is why the short statements. It seems we back to chapter one again.

 

No hard feelings.:tongue3:

 

I think you answered the question the way you did cause you don't have a good answer. Let me ask the question a different way:

Is God patiently waiting for people to accept the gospel truth and obey it, or is He patiently waiting for Himself to regenerate the elect so they will believe cause He has saved them?

 

Since you put it that way. Both.:thumbs: An I did not answer your first way of reasoning because it would not serve any purpose to answer it or attempt to answer it.
Let me show you why. We are presently awaiting the redemption of our bodies. Why not just redeem our bodies as soon as we believe? Making us incapable of sinning? Only God knows. Why ask?