The D. C. of Hyper-Aminianism beliefs...

[webdog]

That was not a similie...so obviously you don't know what it means.

 

[Heavenly Pilgrim]

Webdog: That was not a similie...so obviously you don't know what it means.

HP: Inform us my friend as to my error. I made a comparison using 'like or as.' Who knows? I am not an English major, and besides that what does that have to do with our discussion? Make your point.

 

[Gerhard Ebersoehn]

Webdog: The new birth cannot be rejected once it has taken place. Justification is a one time event...being born again. Once born, you are NEVER unborn.

HP: Can you offer the list any Scripture, or reason from common sense reasoning, that might substantiate this presupposition?

GE:

Here has the point arrived where one stands through faith, Scripture or no Scripture. Common sense is most inappropriate at this point. The presupposition "The new birth cannot be rejected once it has taken place. Justification is a one time event...being born again. Once born, you are NEVER unborn", has Faith as the substance of its evidence, because "Faith, IS the PROOF of things not visible". Anyone saved, "obtain(s his) good report by it". Never a bad one!

 

[Gerhard Ebersoehn]

HP: You have left the realm of common sense and reason with this remark. There is nothing that anyone can add that has the ability to overcome the shere impervious bar of unfounded presuppositions. Nothing can be more detrimental to the open examination of any notion. There is simply nothing further that your mind will even consider objectively in this matter at this time, taking into consideration your present stated opinion. I consider that as sad and detrimental to any discovery of the truth.

GE:

.... the god of reason ....

 

[Gerhard Ebersoehn]

Grasping at reason, how does one get a bad report (of getting lost after having been saved through faith) through faith? You're wise enough to answer that? Is that what faith brings about? That one can go to hell agter all that Grace has done? What's the use of faith then? Speak of fatalism!

 

[Gerhard Ebersoehn]

In each of the examples mentioned in Hebrews 11 of men who through faith have "obtained witness", "good, report" is given of how and what exactly their obtainment or attainment consisted. Not one of them failed! Faith cannot fail a believer. That is logic; that is Christian Faith.

 

[Heavenly Pilgrim]

GE: Faith cannot fail a believer. That is logic; that is Christian Faith.

HP: What are the Scriptures speaking about when they speak of making shipwreck of the faith? 1Ti 1:19 Holding faith, and a good conscience; which some having put away concerning faith have made shipwreck:

 

[BobRyan]

Oh wait!! I know! I know!!


1Tim 1
18This command I entrust to you, Timothy, my son, in accordance with the prophecies previously made concerning you, that by them[/b] you fight the good fight,
19keeping faith and a good conscience, which some have rejected and [b]suffered shipwreck in regard to their faith.
20Among these are Hymenaeus and Alexander, whom I have handed over to Satan, so that they will be [b]taught not to blaspheme. [/B]


Denied by Christ instead of His “confessing us before God and His angels” –


2 Tim 2[/b]
11 It is a trustworthy statement: For if we died with Him, we will also live with Him;
12 [b]If we endure, we will also reign with Him; [b]If we deny[/B] Him, He also [b]will deny us;[/B]
13 [b]If we are faithless[/b], He remains faithful, for He cannot deny Himself.
14 Remind them of these things[/b], and solemnly charge them in the presence of God not to wrangle about words, which is useless and leads to the ruin of the hearers.


Soul bound by sin and under the condemnation of death

James 5
19-20, "My brothers, if anyone among you wanders from the truth and someone brings him back[/b], let him know that whoever brings back a sinner from his wandering will save his soul from death[/b] and will cover a multitude of sins."


Forgiveness revoked –

]Matt 18
21 Then Peter came and said to Him, ""Lord, how often shall my brother sin against me and I forgive him? Up to seven times?''
22 Jesus said to him, ""I do not say to you, up to seven times, but up to seventy times seven.

23 ""For this reason the kingdom of heaven may be compared to a king who wished to settle accounts with his slaves.
24 ""When he had begun to settle them, one who owed him ten thousand talents was brought to him.
25 ""But since he did not have the means to repay, his lord commanded him to be sold, along with his wife and children and all that he had, and repayment to be made.
26 ""So the slave fell to the ground and prostrated himself before him, saying, "Have patience with me and I will repay you everything.'
27 ""And the lord of that slave felt compassion and released him and forgave him the debt.
28 ""But that slave went out and found one of his fellow slaves who owed him a hundred denarii; and he seized him and began to choke him, saying, "Pay back what you owe.'
[/quote]

Matt 18 <[

b]Forgiveness Revoked!>

29 ""So his fellow slave fell to the ground and began to plead with him, saying, "Have patience with me and I will repay you.'
30 ""But he was unwilling and went and threw him in prison until he should pay back what was owed.
31 ""So when his fellow slaves saw what had happened, they were deeply grieved and came and reported to their lord all that had happened.
32 ""Then summoning him, his lord said to him, "You wicked slave, I forgave you all that debt because you pleaded with me.
33 " Should you not also have had mercy on your fellow slave, in the same way that I had mercy on you?'
34 ""And his lord, moved with anger, handed him over to the torturers until he should repay all that was owed him.
35 "" My heavenly Father will also do the same to you[/b], if each of you does not forgive his brother from your heart.''

Severed FROM Christ and Fallen from grace

Gal 5

4 [b]You have been severed from Christ[/b], you who are seeking to be justified by law; you have fallen from grace.
5 For we through the Spirit, by faith, are waiting for the hope of righteousness.
6 For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision nor uncircumcision means anything, but faith working through love.
7 You were running well; who hindered you from obeying the truth?

 

[BobRyan]

Rom 11
18do not be arrogant toward the branches; but if you are arrogant, remember that it is not you who supports the root, but the root supports you.
19You will say then, “Branches were broken off so that I might be grafted in.”
20Quite right, they were broken off for their unbelief, but you stand by your faith. Do not be conceited, but fear;
21for if God did not spare the natural branches, He will not spare you, either.

22Behold then the kindness and severity of God; to those who fell, severity, but to you, God’s kindness, if you continue in His kindness[/b]; otherwise you also will be cut off.
23And [b]they also, if they do not continue in their unbelief, will be grafted in, for God is able to graft them in again.




24For if you were cut off from what is by nature a wild olive tree, and were grafted contrary to nature into a cultivated olive tree, how much more will these who are the natural branches be grafted into their own olive tree?


Having escaped, and tasted of the future life and been partakers of the Holy Spirit – fallen away and then burned.

Heb 6

4 For in the case of [b]those who have once been enlightened and have tasted of the heavenly gift and have been made partakers of the Holy Spirit[/b],
5 and have tasted the good word of God and the powers of the age to come,
6 and then have [b]fallen away, it is impossible to renew them again to repentance[/b], since they again crucify to themselves the Son of God and put Him to open shame.

7 For ground that drinks the rain which often falls on it and brings forth vegetation useful to those for whose sake it is also tilled, receives a blessing from God;
8 but if [b]it yields thorns and thistles, it is worthless[/b] and close to being cursed, and it ends up being burned.

 

[Heavenly Pilgrim]

Oh God, help me to use wisdom and to listen to the admonitions and warnings of your Word, and not to think more highly of myself than I aught.