The vision of Obadiah

[Van]

The word translated as “vision” in the OT refers to a revelation from God as expressed by a prophet. Now one of the theories of bible interpretation is that prophecies may have both a near term fulfillment and an end times fulfillment applicable to a much wider audience. Assuming this idea is true, or partially true, how should we understand Obadiah’s vision as applicable to us?

Do we see ourselves as secure in our fortress, occupying the high ground?

 

[Van]

I see that no one has a clue as to how we might apply Obadiah to our lives. Lets see, God's people were being sacked and the Edomites did not lift a finger to help them. God was displeased and punished them. Now today Christians are being attacked on two fronts, the terrorists and the atheists. For example South Korea has many Christians, and North Korea may attach. Should we lift a finger?

 

[Van]

2 The Lord says, “Look! I will make you a weak nation;
you will be greatly despised!
3 Your presumptuous heart has deceived you—
you who reside in the safety of the rocky cliffs,
whose home is high in the mountains.
You think to yourself,
‘No one can bring me down to the ground!’
4 Even if you were to soar high like an eagle,
even if you were to make your nest among the stars,
I can bring you down even from there!” says the LORD (NET)​

Contextually this passage (Obadiah 1:2-4) addresses Edom, but can we consider whether in whole or in part, it might be applied to America? They thought themselves safe because they occupied the high ground. We are protected by two Oceans and two like-minded nations. (Never-mind ICBMs and bump-stock weapons, or the onslaught of falsehoods found on line.)

We are the richest, most powerful nation! We do not need the wisdom of God's word, we have the wisdom of the crowd. The people who want to enslave the masses do not like the book that teaches truth and that freedom is better than slavery.

Such is the prevailing view, as least as presented by the main stream media.

 

[agedman]

All the principles taught in the Scriptures can be applicable to a person, assembly, and even a nation.

Psalm 33, “Blessed is the nation ...”

Whether the US is or is not strong is of little importance in the preservation as a nation.

It is God who establishes (or allows to be established), and not mere human strength and ingenuity.

My own personal view is that the US will be destroyed. That this nation has long deceived itself and embraced what is not only ungodly, but taken pleasure and riches as ungodly.

Remember Khrushchev?

I think it was in his address to the UN general assembly that he said, we don’t intend to conquer the US, it will drop like over ripe fruit into our hand.

Khrushchev is long dead, but his statement was prophetic.

 

[agedman]

Should the US get involved?

IMO, why?

Does not the Scriptures teach believers are to pray for them that do evil against them?

 

[Van]

Just a quick note on what Scripture teaches about response to evil.

Scripture addresses the issue on three levels, our individual response, the response of our assembly, i.e. our local church, and the response of government. All three responses are biblical. As an individual we are to turn the other cheek, pour metaphorically hot coals on them by treating them well, and praying not only for them but also how we either individually or with the aid of others can help them.

However, when acting under the cover of church authority, we are to address the false assertions, the lack of truth, and the harmful results of evil.

And finally, when acting under the cover of governmental authority, we can and should engage in forceful action, including if necessary lethal action, to defend our community, neighbors and family.

 

[agedman]

... As an individual we are to turn the other cheek, pour metaphorically hot coals on them by treating them well, and praying not only for them but also how we either individually or with the aid of others can help them.

Agreed

However, when acting under the cover of church authority, we are to address the false assertions, the lack of truth, and the harmful results of evil.

Of that which inflicts or influences the assembly, and individual members of the assembly.

However, this does not extend beyond the assembly.

And finally, when acting under the cover of governmental authority, we can and should engage in forceful action, including if necessary lethal action, to defend our community, neighbors and family.

At this point, it might be wise to ask that you present specific NT Scriptures that agree with this view.

For when the Lord spoke concerning the government authorities, it was that the believer is to obey and to pray.

I wonder what "lethal action" is shown in the gospels?

 

[Van]

Please turn to Hebrews 11, and look at the last five names listed. Ask yourself what they accomplished by faith!

 

[agedman]

Please turn to Hebrews 11, and look at the last five names listed. Ask yourself what they accomplished by faith!

And this answers????

 

[Van]

What does scripture say about those acting under color of government authority? Just read Hebrews 11:32-34.

And finally, when acting under the cover of governmental authority, we can and should engage in forceful action, including if necessary lethal action, to defend our community, neighbors and family.

 

[Van]

The USA faces the "Day of the LORD" just like all other nations. Will the Lord find us one nation under God, or will our governing authorities have tossed out the Bible, and its truths? Are we going to lift a finger or flee into darkness.