Was Judas saved?

[standingfirminChrist]

StandingfirminChrist

First I want you to know I am not disagree because I am unsure and looking for the answers. You said

Quote:
And I besought thy disciples to cast him out; and they could not. (Luke 9:40)


Can I ask you why they could not?

This is the verse I had in mind about demons


Matthew 10:1 (KJV)
1 And when he had called unto him his twelve disciples, he gave them power against unclean spirits, to cast them out, and to heal all manner of sickness and all manner of disease.

It would appear He gave them power to cast out demons and that includes Judas as one of the twelve, Don't you think?

You also said

Judas did not embrace Jesus' teachings. As a matter of fact, if one rightly divides the Word of Truth, one will see that Judas walked contrary to Christ's teachings.

Could I please have some scripture to show this that he walked contrary to His teachings?

I

f ye love me, keep my commandments. (John 14:15)

One of the commandments, I am sure you know it... "Thou shalt not steal'

Then saith one of his disciples, Judas Iscariot, Simon's [son], which should betray him, Why was not this ointment sold for three hundred pence, and given to the poor? This he said, not that he cared for the poor; but because he was a thief, and had the bag, and bare what was put therein. (John 12:4-6)

Judas was a thief. He stole from people. This verse here indicates that even though he was one of the Apostles, he was stealing from the Lord's treasury!

But there are some of you that believe not. For Jesus knew from the beginning who they were that believed not, and who should betray him. And he said, Therefore said I unto you, that no man can come unto me, except it were given unto him of my Father. From that [time] many of his disciples went back, and walked no more with him. Then said Jesus unto the twelve, Will ye also go away? Then Simon Peter answered him, Lord, to whom shall we go? thou hast the words of eternal life. And we believe and are sure that thou art that Christ, the Son of the living God. Jesus answered them, Have not I chosen you twelve, and one of you is a devil? He spake of Judas Iscariot [the son] of Simon: for he it was that should betray him, being one of the twelve. (John 6:64-71)

There is no question about it. Judas never believed in who Jesus was. He followed along because it was easy for him to put his hand in the money bag.

 

[Bro. Curtis]

I don't see any scripture that tells me Judas ever trusted Christ to forgive him. Belief in Jesus is not enough. I believe, like Judas, a lot of folks will miss heaven by about a foot & a half, the distance between the brain & the heart. Judas died in his sin, and never accepted the righteousness of Christ.

James 2:19 Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble.

 

[DHK]

HP: So you don’t have to be discipled to be a disciple? I wonder if you have to follow to be a follower? Are you saying that all the five thousand that followed Christ were disciples as well?
I think that we need to rethink what it means to be a disciple of Christ.

Yes, we need to re-evaluate it just as much as we need to re-evaluate the word "Christian." That puts it in a better perspective, since "Christian" simply means "follower of Christ." The word is used in Acts 11:26 where they were first called Christians at Antioch, and now statistics say that one out of every five people in the world are Christian! We know that is not true. How do we account for the statistic that says one out of every five people in the world is a "follower of Christ"?

 

[Iamodd4God]

He was called as a disciple of Christ.

Judas Iscariot was a disciple of Christ, he was a genuine believer although many rejects it, but I submit Scriptural proof proving that Judas Iscariot was a genuine believer...

Matthew 10:1 And when he had called unto him his twelve disciples, he gave them power against unclean spirits, to cast them out, and to heal all manner of sickness and all manner of disease.
Matthew 10:2 Now the names of the twelve apostles are these; The first, Simon, who is called Peter, and Andrew his brother; James the son of Zebedee, and John his brother;
Matthew 10:3 Philip, and Bartholomew; Thomas, and Matthew the publican; James the son of Alphaeus, and Lebbaeus whose surname was Thaddaeus;
Matthew 10:4 Simon the Canaanite, and JUDAS ISCARIOT, who also betrayed him.

Jesus gave the twelve disciples the power against unclean spirits to cast them out, and to heal all manner of sickness and diseases. Judas was among the twelve. If Judas Iscariot wasn't a true disciple of Christ, then how was it he was able to receive this power from Jesus?

Matthew 12:25 And Jesus knew their thoughts, and said unto them, Every kingdom divided against itself is brought to desolation; and every city or house divided against itself shall not stand:
Matthew 12:26 And if Satan cast out Satan, he is divided against himself; how shall then his kingdom stand?

If Judas was not a true disciple of Christ he would not have been able to cast out devils as Jesus proved here that it cannot be done.

Judas was not the son of predition when Jesus gave him the power to cast out devils. Judas became the son of perdition when Satan entered him...

John 13:27 And after the sop Satan entered into him. Then said Jesus unto him, That thou doest, do quickly.

...actually it is possible that Judas became the son of perdition before the last supper, but one thing is for certain he was not always the son of perdition, and because of his turning away from God the devil was able to possess him.

Was Judas saved? I believe he was saved under the OT, but not under the NT. He committed suicide, and according to the Word of God no murderer has eternal life in him.

1John 3:15 Whosoever hateth his brother is a murderer: and ye know that no murderer hath eternal life abiding in him.

In the name of Jesus Christ,

Ken

 

[standingfirminChrist]

Judas Iscariot was a disciple of Christ, he was a genuine believer although many rejects it, but I submit Scriptural proof proving that Judas Iscariot was a genuine believer...

Matthew 10:1 And when he had called unto him his twelve disciples, he gave them power against unclean spirits, to cast them out, and to heal all manner of sickness and all manner of disease.
Matthew 10:2 Now the names of the twelve apostles are these; The first, Simon, who is called Peter, and Andrew his brother; James the son of Zebedee, and John his brother;
Matthew 10:3 Philip, and Bartholomew; Thomas, and Matthew the publican; James the son of Alphaeus, and Lebbaeus whose surname was Thaddaeus;
Matthew 10:4 Simon the Canaanite, and JUDAS ISCARIOT, who also betrayed him.

Jesus gave the twelve disciples the power against unclean spirits to cast them out, and to heal all manner of sickness and diseases. Judas was among the twelve. If Judas Iscariot wasn't a true disciple of Christ, then how was it he was able to receive this power from Jesus?

And Jesus knew their thoughts, and said unto them, Every kingdom divided against itself is brought to desolation; and every city or house divided against itself shall not stand: And if Satan cast out Satan, he is divided against himself; how shall then his kingdom stand? (Matthew 12:25-26)

Jesus may have given the Apostles the power to cast out devils, but Scripture does not say any of the twelve cast out devils in the Gospels during Jesus' earthly ministry.

And I besought thy disciples to cast him out; and they could not. (Luke 9:40)

Judas may have had that power and authority, but he never did cast them out. He would not have. Had he cast devils out, he would have been divided against himself and his kingdom could not stand.

If Judas was not a true disciple of Christ he would not have been able to cast out devils as Jesus proved here that it cannot be done.

Answered above

Judas was not the son of predition when Jesus gave him the power to cast out devils. Judas became the son of perdition when Satan entered him...

John 13:27 And after the sop Satan entered into him. Then said Jesus unto him, That thou doest, do quickly.

Earlier in the ministry, Jesus said to the twelve:

Jesus answered them, Have not I chosen you twelve, and one of you is a devil? (John 6:70)

Clear indication that Judas was the son of perdition all along.

...actually it is possible that Judas became the son of perdition before the last supper, but one thing is for certain he was not always the son of perdition, and because of his turning away from God the devil was able to possess him.

Judas never turned from God because he never was for God. He never called Jesus Lord. He did submit to God's commandments.

Was Judas saved? I believe he was saved under the OT, but not under the NT. He committed suicide, and according to the Word of God no murderer has eternal life in him.

Judas was never saved. He proved that in the end. Jesus knew Judas heart. He knew Judas was a thief all along and would be the one who would betray Him to be crucified.

Salvatiton is a free gift. It is given by God to man. The gifts and calling of God are without repentance. Salvation cannot be lost.

 

[Eliyahu]

Sounds like a question:

Can a devil be saved?

JOhn 6:70

Jesus answered them, Have not I chosen you twelve, and one of you is a devil?

If a devil repent and can be saved....


I know a man who often gets drunken, then repent a lot about his past life, about his situation.

 

[Kay]

Luke 10:17 The 70 disciples returned with joy, confirming that the demons were subject to them in Jesus’ name

I think they did cast out demons according to this scripture. I think some of the disciples did by this scripture. Don't you think?

 

[Kay]

Luke 10:17 The 70 disciples returned with joy, confirming that the demons were subject to them in Jesus’ name

I think they did cast out demons according to this scripture. I think some of the disciples did by this scripture. Don't you think?

And here
Mark 6:13 "And they were casting out many demons and were anointing with oil many sick people and healing them."

 

[standingfirminChrist]

Luke 10:17 The 70 disciples returned with joy, confirming that the demons were subject to them in Jesus’ name

I think they did cast out demons according to this scripture. I think some of the disciples did by this scripture. Don't you think?

These were the 70, not the 12. The 12 stayed with Jesus.

Notice verse 1 of Luke chapter 10:

After these things the Lord appointed other seventy also, and sent them two and two before his face into every city and place, whither he himself would come. (Luke 10:1)

The other seventy were sent out, not the original twelve.

 

[Kay]

Ok thank you for that explanation what about this verse though

Mark 6:13 "And they were casting out many demons and were anointing with oil many sick people and healing them."

 

[standingfirminChrist]

Luke 10:17 The 70 disciples returned with joy, confirming that the demons were subject to them in Jesus’ name

I think they did cast out demons according to this scripture. I think some of the disciples did by this scripture. Don't you think?

And here
Mark 6:13 "And they were casting out many demons and were anointing with oil many sick people and healing them."

Here, the twelve are sent out, and yes devils were cast out. I stand corrected on the disciples not casting out devils during Jesus' earthly ministry.

But, I do not believe Judas was one who did the casting out of devils. The one sent with Judas more than likely did the casting out of devils.

Judas, as one who was not truly saved, who served two masters, could not have cast out devils.

 

[TCGreek]

1. Do we believe that a person who has been truly saved by the Lord can lose his or her Salvation?

2. At the end of the day, this is what this Judas debate must come do to.

3. If he was saved and then lost his salvation, then we must throw out eternal security.

4. Or consider Judas case unique. But the Scripture would not allow us to do such.

 

[Kay]

When did Satan really enter him? This shows it was at the last supper. If he was a devil from the beginning?

Luke 22:1-6 (KJV)

1 Now the feast of unleavened bread drew nigh, which is called the Passover.
2 And the chief priests and scribes sought how they might kill him; for they feared the people.
3 Then entered Satan into Judas surnamed Iscariot, being of the number of the twelve.
4 And he went his way, and communed with the chief priests and captains, how he might betray him unto them.
5 And they were glad, and covenanted to give him money.
6 And he promised, and sought opportunity to betray him unto them in the absence of the multitude.

 

[TCGreek]

When did Satan really enter him? This shows it was at the last supper. If he was a devil from the beginning?

Luke 22:1-6 (KJV)

1 Now the feast of unleavened bread drew nigh, which is called the Passover.
2 And the chief priests and scribes sought how they might kill him; for they feared the people.
3 Then entered Satan into Judas surnamed Iscariot, being of the number of the twelve.
4 And he went his way, and communed with the chief priests and captains, how he might betray him unto them.
5 And they were glad, and covenanted to give him money.
6 And he promised, and sought opportunity to betray him unto them in the absence of the multitude.

Before the supper Jesus had already remarked, "Did I Myself not choose you, the twelve, and yet one of you is a devil?" (John 6:70).

 

[standingfirminChrist]

Before the supper Jesus had already remarked, "Did I Myself not choose you, the twelve, and yet one of you is a devil?" (John 6:70).

You are correct, TCGreek.

Jesus had identified Judas as a devil at least a year, maybe longer, before the Last Supper.

 

[Heavenly Pilgrim]

DHK” Yes, we need to re-evaluate it just as much as we need to re-evaluate the word "Christian.

HP: Never truer words were spoken. Lord, help us to set the example of a true Christian disciple.

 

[Heavenly Pilgrim]

StandingfirminChrist: Jesus knew he was the one who would betray Him from the beginning,

HP: I am just curious. Do you have a verse in mind that states that or is that your opinion?

 

[Heavenly Pilgrim]

StandingfirminChrist: There is no question about it. Judas never believed in who Jesus was. He followed along because it was easy for him to put his hand in the money bag.

HP: How do you know the motives of Judas early on in his ministry? Who told you when he began to steal? Besides that, I cannot count the times I have heard that nothing we do has anything to do with ones salvation, nor does it have anything to do with keeping ones salvation, so what is so bad about being a thief? Were the rest of the disciples, or are you, perfect? Is being a thief any different than the litany of sins some on the list say they can commit, even daily, and still be a Christian?

Just wondering.

 

[standingfirminChrist]

Who says the people who commit the same sins daily are Christians? It must be the world, as the Word of God does not declare them to be Christians.

Like DHK said, we need to reevaluate the word 'Christian'

 

[Heavenly Pilgrim]

IamoddforGod: he was not always the son of perdition, and because of his turning away from God the devil was able to possess him.

HP: I believe I am in agreement with you here. There is no indication that Judas was always a devil or even that he was always a thief. We know what he became in the end, but that in no way proves he was that way at the beginning of his ministry.
Some on this list seem to believe they are able to discern his motives from the beginning. I am waiting to see their evidence.