Was the word homosexuality introduced into the bible later on?

[Joseph_Botwinick]

I just tried the link and it worked fine for me. You might perhaps need to wait for the player to load for about 5-10 seconds. Try it again.

Joseph Botwinick

 

[FollowMeHome]

Cool.

But I don't understand why many christians are so totally focused on proving that being gay is a choice. Doesn't reality prove them wrong? If it is a choice then why are there gays which suffer from it or which even marry because they hope that everything will work out once they're married? I have seen and heard this many times from gays that they tried to "heal" themselves but it simply didn't work. I think it's somehow really strange when christians simply insist on homosexuality being a choice. This is like saying being heterosexual is a choice. I never choose to be heterosexual I simply am heterosexual. But this also creates problems because if there are in fact gays which are born this way or which started being gay at an early age then what does this imply? Does this mean that God won't hold them accountable for it or that he only holds them accountable if they don't want to be cured from it?

AMEN!!!

There are degrees of sin. While drinking to excess is a sin, it is much less grave than homosexual activity. A person who has same sex attraction (SSA) is not sinning if they do not dwell or act on those thoughts. Praying for strength to fight and rid one's mind of those thoughts, is the best most can do.

At best, someone who claims to be healed of homosexuality was bisexual to start with. I truly believe that people are born homosexual. It's not a choice. I will leave room for doubt that a person (males, specifically) may unconsciously choose homosexuality due to molestation as a young child. The jury is out on that theory.

God gives us crosses to bear. I have mine and I'm sure everyone else has theirs. For many, homosexual feelings are their cross to bear.

 

[BobRyan]

So you think that these people are not honestly wanting the truth but they only want to bend the bible to fit into what they want to be true?

Yes.

Go to Lev 18 and "tell me" if you need the word "homsexual" inserted into the text before "getting the point". Hint although that word is not IN the text - the text clearly condemns it.

God to Romans 1 - there too you see it clearly condemned without needing the word inserted.

These people are doing what many people do - taking an apriori bias TO the text THEN reading it in a way that is bent and twisted ENOUGH to rationalize problem texts away from the man-made-traditions they would PREFER to have seen written into scripture.

In their case it is grossly aparent to all - but that does not mean they are the only ones doing it.

Look at the way compromised Christian evolutionists try to READ EVOLUTION INTO Genesis no matter how clear and explicit that summary is in Exodus 20:8-11 on those 7 days or how clear Gen 1-2:3 is.

Look at the way the bending, twisting and wrenching of the text happens every day!

 

[xdisciplex]

Yes, that's really sad.

 

[mcdirector]

But you have to admit that not all people are the same. If ALL people had homosexual fantasies and lusts then you could say that but the normal person doesn't even have such thoughts. Here is already a difference between a homosexual and a normal person + another major difference, which is the fact that a homosexual isn't attracted to women because this would make him bisexual. Heterosexual christians which struggle with lust can simply marry and this way they at least get what they want, homosexuals cannot simply marry. For them there is no "hope". This is a huge difference. Imagine a heterosexual who desires women but knows that he is never allowed to marry. Such a person would also get problems, just look at what many priests do with children. This is a result of not being allowed to have sex.

You are trying to make sex a stronger drive than other desires. I don't know that it is and maintain that it is still a matter of self-control -- of giving over that temptation to God.

And being able to marry and have sex doesn't stop some from giving into their sinful sexual wants.

 

[Heavenly Pilgrim]

Xdisciplex: Heterosexual christians which struggle with lust can simply marry and this way they at least get what they want, homosexuals cannot simply marry. For them there is no "hope".

HP: God, through the atoning work of Christ, is in the business of changing not only outward actions, but desires as well. Anyone, regardless of the problem can overcome and conquer sinful lusts and desire. There are numerous former homosexuals that can testify that God did indeed change their former sinful desires, and the stable marriages they now have are a testimony to that fact.

Temptation and lust are not necessarily the same in every sense, although I know it can be a fine line. I believe we can be tempted without lusting. Jas 1:14 But every man is tempted, when he is drawn away of his own lust, and enticed.
15 Then when lust hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin: and sin, when it is finished, bringeth forth death.
16 Do not err, my beloved brethren.

In the first part of the verse, sin seems to be generated from our lust, but in the last portion sin is not involved until the lust( or simply strong desire) has conceived. Temptation and lust are closely associated when lust bears the meaning of simply strong desire. On the other hand, strong desire must be elevated by the injection of the will forming an intent to carry out or gratify that strong desire in order for sin to come into fruition. Lust can be thought of in two sense, One, strong desire, and one willful intent. There is a world of difference, although the line between them may be clouded by accusations from the enemy of our souls. When we first encounter temptation, it of necessity has to have some draw and influence towards selfish desire and subsequent behavior. The accuser of the brethren, may in fact inject feelings of guilt, as if though we in some way have sinned by being tempted. That is a lie of he enemy of our soul. Sin is not conceived until our wills yield to that influence or temptation by forming a selfish intent.

Take one for instance that has been tempted or fallen into the sinful lifestyle of homosexuality in the past. Subsequent to repentance and faith in the Lord, one still may face temptation or desire in some sense of the word, but one can have their will fixed upon the Lord to the degree that such a one is unwilling too give into those sinful desires, and with the help of the Lord, prayer, Bible reading, meditation, and the association with other believers, proper habits will be formed, and such a one realize the freedom that comes as those latent desires are suppressed and not allowed to be conceived.

Every Christian suffers from temptation of the past to one degree or another, but none are forced to give in, or allow those temptation to overrule and control ones intents and subsequent lifestyles. No evil influence is so strong that it is stronger than God who has promised the strength that we need to overcome such temptation. We are commanded to “fight the good fight of faith” and resist such impulses and temptations with the Lord’s help.

We are first to do that which we are well capable of doing, i.e., to fix our heart, soul,will, and strength upon God in repentance, faith and obedience, and then allow Him to help reduce and even eliminte the pull of any and all latent desire that serves to drag us back into sin. I fully believe that if we will honestly do that which we can do, God will make up the hedge by reducing the ability of temptations force to draw us back into sin and away from Him.

“Php 4:13 I can do all things through Christ which strengtheneth me.”

 

[Stinker2]

The passages of scripture in Leviticus just do not address 'homosexuality' . They address acts which heterosexual people commit from time to time.

We all know of people we have met that we understood should have been born with the body of the opposite sex. What comes to mind is the Saturday Night Live skit 'Pat' . The tease about this skit is that the way the character looked, dressed, and talked, you couldn't really tell if it was a man or woman.

Which leads us to the question as to whether Hermaphrodites are sinning when they portray themselves to be the sex that their mind tells them....because their body tells us just the opposite!

I do see that more and more people are beginning to realize that the Koine Greek words in 1Cor.6:9 arsenokoitai & malakoi and 1Tim.1:10 arsenokoitai, have been mistranslated.

The last thing....I just wish Christians would look with their eyes at the Romans 1:18-28 passage and notice that it is addressing heterosexuals in such a setting (pagan worship?) that they become so depraved that they inflame their passion by doing what comes unnatural to them rather than natural.

 

[BobRyan]

NOTHING in Lev 18 or Romans 1 says "THIS is only wrong if you don't do it OFTEN ENOUGH or CONSISTENTLY ENOUGH!!".

If you don't mind abolishing the sola scriptura practice of solid Bible exegesis you could "tell yourself a story ANYWAY" but NOTHING in the Lev 18 text OR the Romans 1 text says "These wicked peopled failed to sin OFTEN ENOUGH to make their sin ACCEPTABLE"!

THERE IS NO sin in the Bible that is said to be "OK:" as long as you do it Persistently and consistently.

Those who make up stuff like that are practicing a very transparent form of eisegesis!!

NOTE that in Lev 18 - the PAGAN NATIONS were expelled for doing those sins - NO MENTION of "HOW OFTEN they did them" as you have supposed!

 

[xdisciplex]

This is really funny.
This means if I lust after a woman sporadically it's sin, but if I do it consequently then it's okay. :laugh:

But the hermaphrodite thing is interesting.
What shall a hermaphrodite do? Shall he/she be male or female?
Shall she simply decide for 1 sex and then ger surgery?`This is in fact a very difficult question, isn't it?

@ HP

I think the sex drive or the hormones also play a huge role. Somebody with a strong sex drive will most likely lust more after women than somebody with a low sex drive, isn't this unfair somehow? Because this person cannot do anything against his hormones but the hormones make him sin, don't they?

 

[rbell]

The passages of scripture in Leviticus just do not address 'homosexuality' . They address acts which heterosexual people commit from time to time.

We all know of people we have met that we understood should have been born with the body of the opposite sex. What comes to mind is the Saturday Night Live skit 'Pat' . The tease about this skit is that the way the character looked, dressed, and talked, you couldn't really tell if it was a man or woman.

Which leads us to the question as to whether Hermaphrodites are sinning when they portray themselves to be the sex that their mind tells them....because their body tells us just the opposite!

I do see that more and more people are beginning to realize that the Koine Greek words in 1Cor.6:9 arsenokoitai & malakoi and 1Tim.1:10 arsenokoitai, have been mistranslated.

The last thing....I just wish Christians would look with their eyes at the Romans 1:18-28 passage and notice that it is addressing heterosexuals in such a setting (pagan worship?) that they become so depraved that they inflame their passion by doing what comes unnatural to them rather than natural.

Nice job of bending the text to fit your opinions.

 

[Heavenly Pilgrim]

Xdisciplex: I think the sex drive or the hormones also play a huge role. Somebody with a strong sex drive will most likely lust more after women than somebody with a low sex drive, isn't this unfair somehow? Because this person cannot do anything against his hormones but the hormones make him sin, don't they?

HP: Scripture states that we are all tempted in ways common to man. We are obviously not all created equal in any physical sense. God is our Creator and through the influx of sin and physical depravity much has changed since the time of creation. In light of that, God has still allowed in some sense for this obvious abundance of some things such as mega hormones with some, and a disparagement of those issues with others, but He calls on all men to take of all of what they are gifted with or whatever state they find themselves in, and to use those things or the lack thereof in keeping with His moral law and in the best interest of our ourselves and our fellowman. God is fair and a Just God. We are called upon to control our hormones or whatever physical or mental influence we face, regardless of the strength of the temptation to misuse, abuse, or that might lead to a violation God’s law.

There is therefore now no hormone overtaken you but such as is common to man, but God is faithful to make a way of suppression, that ye may be able to resist its influence and seeming control over your will. You and I can overcome any such influence, IF we ‘will.’ It is not that men cannot, but that often men ‘will not.’

Prisons and mental hospitals are designed to help those that will not take control over their temperament and hormones to protect them from the harm they inevitably inflict upon others and themselves. God has designed an eternal hell for those that will be found in willing rebellion to His moral law and that have rejected His offer of forgiveness of sins that are past, and are found at the judgment to be still in their sins.

 

[pinoybaptist]

Stinker2

So, according to you, there were no homosexuals, sodomites, transvestites, crossdressers, and pedophiles (boy-lovers) in Moses' time ?
And as for the Greek error, why don't we start a movement to eradicate all Bibles not translated by the modern translators on the grounds that those old translators were very stupid and lacked the knowledge that we modern men have ?

But back to your argument.

Granting that the passage was addressed to heterosexuals, does that make homosexuality any less repulsive to God ? you mean today's homosexuality and lesbianism took God by surprise ?

Wow.

you're a real stinker.

 

[xdisciplex]

Wow.

you're a real stinker.

Who? Me? :tear:

@ HP

Do you really think it's that easy? Do you think you have total control over you? I really wonder what you would do if you suffered brain damage which would turn you into a criminal from one day to the other. Such cases exist.

 

[Heavenly Pilgrim]

Xdisciplex: Do you really think it's that easy? Do you think you have total control over you? I really wonder what you would do if you suffered brain damage which would turn you into a criminal from one day to the other. Such cases exist.

HP: Sure I do. Listen to God speaking to Cain. Ge 4:7 If thou doest well, shalt thou not be accepted? and if thou doest not well, sin lieth at the door. And unto thee shall be his desire, and thou shalt rule over him.”

Xdiciplex: I really wonder what you would do if you suffered brain damage which would turn you into a criminal from one day to the other. Such cases exist.

HP: IF such a one was no longer a moral agent, he would not be considered a criminal, but rather a candidate for a mental hospital. Such a one in THAT condition, not being able to make moral decisions would not be a proper subject of moral law. I believe God would judge that person according to his actions prior to the injury that eliminated his being a moral agent, and all subsequent actions would not be moral or sin from that point on. I personally find your illustration a bit far-fetched.

You ask a lot of far out questions, and that is not all bad. Just the same, remember this. True fortitude of knowledge does not allow the things we cannot know with certainty to confuse the things we absolutely know to be true. Don’t allow your questioning mind to inject so many outlandish questions into the mix, that you confuse the things we can indeed know and be assured of.

You can control your hormones, if you will.