What does "believe" really mean?

Is your question about salvation?
Becasue the works aren't for salvation or to keep salvation. They are becasue of salvation. The bible assumes(a dn tells us) to do good works reflecting our christianity to the world. But the benefit is not that people see us and judge our 'evidence'(they can't see everyting we do, therefore they do not see all the evidences either way), but they are also for an obedient personal relationship with God.
I know I didn't actually answer you question, sorry.

 

But is that to say if we see a christian being disobedient they are not really saved? And are we to decide that(thier salvation)? And isn't disobedience sin? If so then if a christian sins are they really christians? Have you ever disobeyed God? If so are you really a christian?
People are different levels of growth, we aren't automatically adult fully mature christians the moment we are saved. We need to give people the room to grow without judging them unsaved. It isn't the moment (everyone has bad moments)that tells if your a christian but the lifetime.

 

Believe or belief would generally mean to have confidence in ,to trust and rely on something or someone (in our case that would be God).

I tried to keep it simple and put it in a few words. Amity it might be a good idea to get yourself a Vines Concise Dictionary of Bible Words. Vines is simple ,reasonably accurate and inexpensive (only about $13 in paperback).There are also Bible dictionaries and encyclopedias in E-Sword which is online and free. E-Sword also has many other Bible helps.E-Sword can be downloaded for free fight on the internet. Just type e-sword in your seach box and hit find. When the selctions pop up it will be easy to select and start downloading.
Good luck in your studies and God Bless.

 

Believe, as a plain word, is ambiguous. It might mean your opinion, as in I believe that, historically, Carl Marx really did exist. Does that mean I believe in Carl Marx? In one way, it does, and in another way, it does not. There. That is the ambiguity.

Normally, to believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God would imply you've taken the logical step, having that opinion, and started to trust Him for your eternal life and salvation. But that isn't necessarily so! James pointed out even the demons believe and yet instead of having salvation, they tremble. Because there is no commitment to Him.

But if we make a heartfelt commitment to following Him as our Lord and Savior . . . THEN we have believed unto salvation.

Such a commitment, over time, will naturally display some works as evidence of that commitment. The works are not a requisite of the belief - but as James put it, show me your faith without works, and I will show you my faith by my works!

 

Your question is a good one.

I know many of the 123-pray after me folks might not like it, but saying you "believe" and praying a prayer does not make you a possessor of saving faith.

Those who as you point out, "believe" and than fall away, are those who John said, went out from us because they were not of us. They didn't lose anything, cause you can't lose what you never had.

That is why I can hold to OSAS and reconcile it with those who supposedly fall away from their faith. There are plenty of Phonies out there who have been cleaned up on the outside, but never really had a repentant heart.

The fruit in someones life, long term, is really the only indicator we have to determine who is serious, and who is merely professing to be saved. And even that is not foolproof, many will say Lord, Lord, and be told to depart.

 

James 2:19 Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble.

The devils believe what? That there is one God? And they arent saved by this? Go figure. That isn't the gospel for one thing. The muslims also believe there is one God, should we think they could believe this a little harder and add some works to it, and be saved? For another, Jesus Christ didn't die so that devils might be saved. A devil cannot believe on Jesus Christ to be saved, because He did not die for the devils. Using this verse to say that simple belief doesn't save you is just a straw man. The book of James is written to those who are already saved.

 

Amity, would you share with us the answer you got on the other board?

Great answers to difficult questions are always of value.

MR

 

"Let us labour therefore to enter into that rest, lest any man fall after the same example of unbelief." (Hebrews 4:11)

"For if we sin willfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins, But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries." (Hebrews 10:26-27)

"Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven." (Matthew 7:21)

 

Ah, now if we could only see all the hidden good works of those whose salvation we doubt and the hidden sins of those who judge them.

Do you suppose we might not be able to tell them apart?


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...The Lord does not look at the things a man looks at. Man judges by outward appearance but the Lord looks at the heart.

{1st Samuel 16:7}

If we could see into a backsliders heart and feel the grief that they feel for disobeying the Lord time and again and the futility and frustration they feel for stumbling in their walk with Him, maybe we wouldn't be so quick to judge.

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However, to the man who does not work but trusts God who justifies the wicked, his faith is credited as righteousness.
{Romans 4:5}

MR

 

Why are the righteous defined by their works in Jesus' description of the Judgement?


Mat 25:31 When the Son of man shall come in his glory, and all the holy angels with him, then shall he sit upon the throne of his glory:
Mat 25:32 And before him shall be gathered all nations: and he shall separate them one from another, as a shepherd divideth [his] sheep from the goats:
Mat 25:33 And he shall set the sheep on his right hand, but the goats on the left.
Mat 25:34 Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world:
Mat 25:35 For I was an hungred, and ye gave me meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me drink: I was a stranger, and ye took me in:
Mat 25:36 Naked, and ye clothed me: I was sick, and ye visited me: I was in prison, and ye came unto me.
Mat 25:37 Then shall the righteous answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, and fed [thee]? or thirsty, and gave [thee] drink?
Mat 25:38 When saw we thee a stranger, and took [thee] in? or naked, and clothed [thee]?
Mat 25:39 Or when saw we thee sick, or in prison, and came unto thee?
Mat 25:40 And the King shall answer and say unto them, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye have done [it] unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done [it] unto me.
Mat 25:41 Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:
Mat 25:42 For I was an hungred, and ye gave me no meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me no drink:
Mat 25:43 I was a stranger, and ye took me not in: naked, and ye clothed me not: sick, and in prison, and ye visited me not.
Mat 25:44 Then shall they also answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, or athirst, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not minister unto thee?
Mat 25:45 Then shall he answer them, saying, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye did [it] not to one of the least of these, ye did [it] not to me.
Mat 25:46 And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal.

 

If you believe something it will change your attitude/worldview. Your attitude/worldview dictates your behavior.

If your behavior doesn't change and continue to change toward Christlikeness then that represents a strong proof that you do not truly believe. I am not advocating the ideas of humans reaching a state of sinlessness but rather a general, persistent direction of life.

 

I concur Scott, its not about the behavior, its about a changed heart that creates good behavior