What does Matthew 5:30 mean?

[xdisciplex]

I dont even know what this cut off your hand plug out your eye stuff means, does this mean that if you do not do it you go to hell even as a christian? who was this directed to? To christians? If christians go to hell when they do not remove every tempting thing then we're not safe at all. I thought as a christian you're safe in his hand. If it was directed to non-christians then what's the deal with this? Non-christians go to hell anyway it doesn't matter if they remove temptations or not.

 

[Living_stone]

The Jews often spoke in hyperbole. This is one of those times. Exaggeration to stress a point. Otherwise most everyone would be missing an eye and a hand.

 

[Eliyahu]

The message is very clear meaning that no human being can enter the Kingdom of God.

Even if anyone cut off his or her hands or feet and become limb-less(amputated), he or she will still commit sins with the eyes and or ears. Then if the eyes or ears are cut off, such person will still commit with the brain as it thinks about wrong things. Then the brain has to be removed. At the end, even if we die, we can never reach the goad set up by God. Therefore we need a Savior and Jesus is the only way and the only solution.
If we go to Jesus Christ, we can go to heaven without having our limbs cut off.

There is no way other than Jesus Christ for us to go to the Father ( John 14:6)

There is no other name than Jesus Christ by which we can be and we must be saved. ( Acts 4:12)

 

[DesiderioDomini]

It could also be symbolic, which I think it is, of the various traps Satan sets for us.

If watching sports causes you to think about gambling, dont watch sports.

If hanging out with certain people makes you think about lust, dont hang around them.

Anything can be a sin because we are sinful people. What may cause you to sin may not cause me a 2nd thought. You must discipline yourself.

 

[SpyHunter]

I would take it to mean systematic crucifixion of the flesh, whereas if by desire or action you are enticed to sin, then abandon them. Period. After all, nothing could be more drastic than to amputate yourself.

Blessings,

SpyHunter

P.S. -- Do NOT literally amputate yourself; no disciple or apostle did this, so neither should you.

 

[xdisciplex]

Hi!
The problem is what do I do if the internet tempts me but at the same time I need the internet for other important things? Or what do I do if TV tempts me but at the same time I also couldn't live without a TV?
Does this mean that if I keep the internet even though it tempts me then I'll go to hell because I didn't remove every source of temptation? But I can also be tempted outside when I see something which tempts me. I mean I cannot escape every temptation. This is what I don't understand.

 

[Claudia_T]

You just have to use common sense. If you use the internet, dont go to questionable internet sites, if you use television stay away from the wicked channels and movies and other shows and just watch the good ones.

Its not a sin to be tempted, its a sin to purposely place yourself in the way of temptation and if you give into sin then you are in trouble

[ April 28, 2006, 04:50 PM: Message edited by: Claudia_T ]

 

[Claudia_T]

Ps:101:3: I will set no wicked thing before mine eyes: I hate the work of them that turn aside; it shall not cleave to me

this explains it really. Dont purposely set anything wicked before you...

AND if anybody else puts something wicked in front of you, you cant help that, but you CAN not allow it to cleave to you.

 

[xdisciplex]

Well, the problem is that even when I avoid questionable sites I can still come across something tempting. For example when I want to check my emails after 0 AM then there's sex advertisement on the side. Before 0 AM there is normal advertisement and then they switch to this sex stuff. It's really hard not to come across temptations on the internet.

 

[Dustin]

Then check your e-mail at a time with no sex ads. It's not hard to aviod things like that, but if you can't then pray for the grace to overcome it.

 

[BobRyan]

Originally posted by xdisciplex:
I dont even know what this cut off your hand plug out your eye stuff means, does this mean that if you do not do it you go to hell even as a christian? who was this directed to? To christians? If christians go to hell when they do not remove every tempting thing then we're not safe at all. I thought as a christian you're safe in his hand. If it was directed to non-christians then what's the deal with this? Non-christians go to hell anyway it doesn't matter if they remove temptations or not.

You make excellent observations here!!

Nice going.

OSAS (Once saved always saved) is man-made-tradition.


Contrast that to God's Word --

1Cor 9
23 I do all things for the sake of the gospel, so that I may become a fellow partaker of it.
24 Do you not know that those who run in a race all run, but only one receives the prize? Run in such a way that you may win.
25 Everyone who competes in the games exercises self-control in all things. They then do it to receive a perishable wreath, but we an imperishable.
26 Therefore I run in such a way, as not without aim; I box in such a way, as not beating the air;
27 but I discipline my body and make it my slave, so that, after I have preached (the Gospel) to others, I myself will not be disqualified

Therefore the “loss of salvation” is seen whenever that state of salvation is explicitly seen to be revoked, when our acceptance and peace with God is denied by God.

#1. Turned over to Satan 1 Tim 1
#2. A certain terrifying expectation of Judgment to come – Heb 10
#3. Forgiveness revoked Matt 18 – old massive debt is now put back on us.
#4. Christ denying us 2Tim 2
#5. The shipwreck of faith 1 Tim 1
#6. Impossible to be renewed again having been partakers of the Holy Spirit Heb 6
Bound up to be burned – John 15, Heb 6
#7. Enslaved to sin again – as a dog that returns to its vomit


Turned over to Satan – in the shipwreck of faith

1Tim 1
18This command I entrust to you, Timothy, my son, in accordance with the prophecies previously made concerning you, that by them you fight the good fight,
19keeping faith and a good conscience, which some have rejected and suffered shipwreck in regard to their faith.
20Among these are Hymenaeus and Alexander, whom I have handed over to Satan, so that they will be taught not to blaspheme.

Denied by Christ instead of His “confessing us before God and His angels” –

2 Tim 2
11 It is a trustworthy statement: For if we died with Him, we will also live with Him;
12 If we endure, we will also reign with Him; If we deny Him, He also will deny us;
13 If we are faithless, He remains faithful, for He cannot deny Himself.
14 Remind them of these things, and solemnly charge them in the presence of God not to wrangle about words, which is useless and leads to the ruin of the hearers.

Soul bound by sin and under the condemnation of death

James 5
19-20, "My brothers, if anyone among you wanders from the truth and someone brings him back, let him know that whoever brings back a sinner from his wandering will save his soul from death and will cover a multitude of sins."

Forgiveness revoked –

Matt 18
21 Then Peter came and said to Him, ""Lord, how often shall my brother sin against me and I forgive him? Up to seven times?''
22 Jesus said to him, ""I do not say to you, up to seven times, but up to seventy times seven.

23 ""For this reason the kingdom of heaven may be compared to a king who wished to settle accounts with his slaves.
24 ""When he had begun to settle them, one who owed him ten thousand talents was brought to him.
25 ""But since he did not have the means to repay, his lord commanded him to be sold, along with his wife and children and all that he had, and repayment to be made.
26 ""So the slave fell to the ground and prostrated himself before him, saying, "Have patience with me and I will repay you everything.'
27 ""And the lord of that slave felt compassion and released him and forgave him the debt.
28 ""But that slave went out and found one of his fellow slaves who owed him a hundred denarii; and he seized him and began to choke him, saying, "Pay back what you owe.'

Matt 18
29 ""So his fellow slave fell to the ground and began to plead with him, saying, "Have patience with me and I will repay you.'
30 ""But he was unwilling and went and threw him in prison until he should pay back what was owed.
31 ""So when his fellow slaves saw what had happened, they were deeply grieved and came and reported to their lord all that had happened.
32 ""Then summoning him, his lord said to him, "You wicked slave, I forgave you all that debt because you pleaded with me.
33 " Should you not also have had mercy on your fellow slave, in the same way that I had mercy on you?'
34 ""And his lord, moved with anger, handed him over to the torturers until he should repay all that was owed him.
35 "" My heavenly Father will also do the same to you, if each of you does not forgive his brother from your heart.''

Severed FROM Christ and Fallen from grace

Gal 5

Gal 5
4 You have been severed from Christ, you who are seeking to be justified by law; you have fallen from grace.
5 For we through the Spirit, by faith, are waiting for the hope of righteousness.
6 For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision nor uncircumcision means anything, but faith working through love.
7 You were running well; who hindered you from obeying the truth?

Peace with God replaced by a certain terrifying expectation of judgment to come

Heb 10
26 For if we go on sinning willfully after receiving the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins,
27 but a terrifying expectation of judgment and THE FURY OF A FIRE WHICH WILL CONSUME THE ADVERSARIES.
28 Anyone who has set aside the Law of Moses dies without mercy on the testimony of two or three witnesses.
29 How much severer punishment do you think he will deserve who has trampled under foot the Son of God, and has regarded as unclean the blood of the covenant by which he was sanctified, and has insulted the Spirit of grace?

Fallen and yet hoping to be “grafted BACK in again” into the vine of Christ!

Rom 11
18do not be arrogant toward the branches; but if you are arrogant, remember that it is not you who supports the root, but the root supports you.
19You will say then, “Branches were broken off so that I might be grafted in.”
20Quite right, they were broken off for their unbelief, but you stand by your faith. Do not be conceited, but fear;
21for if God did not spare the natural branches, He will not spare you, either.

22Behold then the kindness and severity of God; to those who fell, severity, but to you, God’s kindness, if you continue in His kindness; otherwise you also will be cut off.
23And they also, if they do not continue in their unbelief, will be grafted in, for God is able to graft them in again.

24For if you were cut off from what is by nature a wild olive tree, and were grafted contrary to nature into a cultivated olive tree, how much more will these who are the natural branches be grafted into their own olive tree?

Having escaped, and tasted of the future life and been partakers of the Holy Spirit – fallen away and then burned.

Heb 6
4 For in the case of those who have once been enlightened and have tasted of the heavenly gift and have been made partakers of the Holy Spirit,
5 and have tasted the good word of God and the powers of the age to come,
6 and then have fallen away, it is impossible to renew them again to repentance, since they again crucify to themselves the Son of God and put Him to open shame.

7 For ground that drinks the rain which often falls on it and brings forth vegetation useful to those for whose sake it is also tilled, receives a blessing from God;
8 but if it yields thorns and thistles, it is worthless and close to being cursed, and it ends up being burned.

 

[xdisciplex]

Wow,
but this also scares me even more. I mean if you can lose your salvation then how can you even feel safe as a christian? I mean Jesus also says that we are safe in his hand, does this mean that Jesus can also lose some of his sheep which the father had given him? Then how shall I know if I'm still saved or if I have not lost my salvation somehow?
There are so many scary things in the bible that I don't even want to read the bible anymore. Being scared all the time makes life pretty hard.

 

[SpiritualMadMan]

The theoretical ability to lose one's salvation is a good spur to doing good works...

But, the real issue is this...

Why would any *real* Christian want to kick Jesus out of their life?

I mean after tasting and seeing that the Lord He is Good...

If after experiencing that in His Presence is fullness of Joy...

Why? Would I ever want to leave Him behind...


My God is a Jealous God... He fights for me...

Both to prove His love and to fend of all false loves...

Which Father will not do everything in their power to keep their sons and daughters in areas of their loving safety?

True enough my kids are 18 and 21 and can violate good sense if they want to...

But, their love for me constrains them against doing anything that might force me to kick them out...

Of course which of us Fathers *could* kick their kids out?

I mean they might get themselves in a place where they get killed in a car crash. God forbid!

But, unless they went into open rebllion and tried to kill me... I couldn't ever kick them out...

I suspect that God, as our "Abba" Father has similar feelings towards us...

John wrote us things so that we could and would know that we have eternal life...

1 John 5:13 I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God so that you may know that you have eternal life.

As long as you care if you belong to God or not...

I think that is a pretty good indicator that you haven't gone so far as to have lost your salvation...

And, trust me, if you ever stop caring...

God can get your attention in a way that will make you care pretty seriously... Pretty quickly

He's is not going to let you go without a fight...

James 4:8 Draw nigh to God, and he will draw nigh to you. Cleanse your hands, ye sinners; and purify your hearts, ye double minded.

If you care enough to draw nigh...

Lastly, how do you know you are saved in the first place?

Is it a feeling? NO...

It is based on the fact of the Word of God. Not feelings.

Feelings change daily, hourly even.

God's Word says that:

Romans 10:9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.

I may not *feel* saved but if I continue to believe in the Physical Bodily Ressurection of Jesus Christ and if I am not Ashamed to confess my relationship with Jesus to all men, if my goal in life is to allow Him to be my undisputed ruling authority...

Then I am saved. No matter how I feel. No mater how bad I've messed up.

Hey, if I feel miserable about messing up...

Then In a *very* real sense I have already confessed it to God and Repented...

All that's left is for me to believe and accept:

1 John 1:9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

I hope this helps?

Mike Sr.

 

[BobRyan]

Originally posted by xdisciplex:
Wow,
but this also scares me even more. I mean if you can lose your salvation then how can you even feel safe as a christian? I mean Jesus also says that we are safe in his hand, does this mean that Jesus can also lose some of his sheep which the father had given him? Then how shall I know if I'm still saved or if I have not lost my salvation somehow?

Adam was "safe" as long as he chose to remain in fellowship and obedience to Christ. The same is true with Lucifer and with Paul even though when you read Paul's statements in the text given above - you see that Paul is 100% fully sold out for Christ and does all to gain Christ.

Heaven/salvation is not a "ticket" not a "membership card" not a "bag of groceries" bought once and on the shelf-for-life.

It is a "relationship". It is the new creation the new birth "with Christ IN you the hope of glory".

The point Paul makes in Romans 11 is correct.

Assurance comes from God Rom 8:16 "The Spirit bears witness WITH our spirit that we ARE the children of God".

You can trust God - you can not trust a membership card.

This is what scared the Jews in Romans 2. They wanted to "get the t-shirt" or "have the membership card" but did not care about the relationship. Paul argues in Romans 2 - that this ultimately buys them "nothing".

in Christ,

Bob

 

[BobRyan]

Originally posted by SpiritualMadMan: The theoretical ability to lose one's salvation is a good spur to doing good works...

But, the real issue is this...

you are right this list of strong warnings from God the Father is pretty "motivating" --
http://www.baptistboard.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php/topic/28/3848.html#000010

The question is - should we practice "peace and safety misdirection" telling God's people to ignore what God is saying here since He can't possibly be "serious" in those warnings. they must "be fake".

I don't think we can afford to do that.

in Christ,

Bob

 

[BobRyan]

Originally posted by SpiritualMadMan: The theoretical ability to lose one's salvation is a good spur to doing good works...

But, the real issue is this...

you are right this list of strong warnings from God the Father is pretty "motivating" --
http://www.baptistboard.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php/topic/28/3848.html#000010

The question is - should we practice "peace and safety misdirection" telling God's people to ignore what God is saying here since He can't possibly be "serious" in those warnings. they must "be fake".

I don't think we can afford to do that.

in Christ,

Bob

 

[SpiritualMadMan]

Bob,

I agree that we don't dare neglect the clear warnings...

But, coming from a Pentecostal/Armenian background I also know that the "Fear of God" can be traumatic and disabling, for some...

I believe that there needs to be moderation in that we need to "encourage" to love and good works...

That is, niether demanding condemnation nor sit/settle on ones lees in Zion...

Mike Sr.

 

[BobRyan]

Agreed. I too am aware of the need of strong assurance and the Bible certainly provides that.

If God is for us who can be against US.

In fact Romans 8 is a great tribute to assurance within the context of God's own choice to sustain free will.

Rom 8
37 But in all these things we overwhelmingly conquer through Him who loved us.
38 For I am convinced that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor things present, nor things to come, nor powers,
39 nor height, nor depth, nor any other created thing, will be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.

 

[SpiritualMadMan]

Yep, that's the one I use a lot, too.