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What if Abraham disobeyed God?

Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by Rye, Nov 8, 2024 at 1:20 PM.

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  1. Rye

    Rye New Member

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    I was listening in on a Bible Study and a lady said that if her faith was tested in the same manner as Abraham then she thinks that she would fail. I pondered on this and wondered if Abraham could have failed also. Could Abraham have refused to sacrifice Isaac?

    There are differing views according to several commentaries I’ve been looking at. Some say yes, some say no.

    Yes because Abraham had a choice and God would have still accepted Abraham as righteous man based on his faith even though he failed in his works.

    No because God chose Abraham to be His servant and to bring in the Messiah through his descendants and it was absolutely certain that he would obey Him.

    However you see these two points of view, we can all have assurance in our Lord.

    1 Corinthians 10:13 - There hath no temptation taken you but such as is common to man: but God is faithful, who will not suffer you to be tempted above that ye are able; but will with the temptation also make a way to escape, that ye may be able to bear it.
     
    #1 Rye, Nov 8, 2024 at 1:20 PM
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  2. 37818

    37818 Well-Known Member

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    My question becomes does this fall into the category of either or even both a foolish and unlearned question, where either should be avoided?

    2 Timothy 2:23, But foolish and unlearned questions avoid, knowing that they do gender strifes.

    Matthew 22:31-32, . . . have ye not read that which was spoken unto you by God, saying, I am the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob? God is not the God of the dead, but of the living
     
    #2 37818, Nov 8, 2024 at 2:15 PM
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  3. Scarlett O.

    Scarlett O. Moderator
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    The Bible says that Abraham was counted as righteous because of his faith and belief in God long before Isaac was even born.

    Also, the book of Hebrews chapter 11, in the roll call of the faithful which teaches what faith IS...

    ....it says in verse 19 that Abraham believed that God would raise Isaac from the dead and it also says that "figuratively speaking" that's what happened.

    Why does it say that in a manner of speaking that's what happened - that God raised a dead Isaac from the dead???

    Because in Abraham's heart and mind, Isaac was already dead. He was about to plunge that knife into his body or neck and did not hesitate. He gave up his son and considered him dead the moment God asked him to.

    And he was convinced beyond any doubt that God would bring him back.

    So says the Bible.

    That's why Jesus' half-brother James, used Abraham and Rahab as the great examples of what faith is. He could have chosen from among others. But he chose those two.
     
    #3 Scarlett O., Nov 8, 2024 at 2:58 PM
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  4. DaveXR650

    DaveXR650 Well-Known Member

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    Not if it's just informal conversation between friends but otherwise, absolutely. I'm still trying to figure out if Adam had a belly button.
     
    #4 DaveXR650, Nov 8, 2024 at 3:07 PM
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  5. MrW

    MrW Well-Known Member

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    Adam nor Eve had navels.

    God had already Himself to Abraham. He knew He could count on Abraham to obey.
     
    #5 MrW, Nov 8, 2024 at 3:29 PM
  6. 37818

    37818 Well-Known Member

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    If they had, it would have to be by design, they were not born as by a parent.
     
    #6 37818, Nov 8, 2024 at 3:58 PM
  7. Martin Marprelate

    Martin Marprelate Well-Known Member
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    No, because faith is proved by deeds. Have a read of James 2:14-26. If I tell you that everything in Walmart will be half price tomorrow, what would be the proof that you believe me? Surely it will be that you turn up at your local Walmart with a pile of cash and a very large station wagon. If you don't turn up, it is a sign that you don't believe me, which, in this case, is the wise thing to do.
    So it was with Abraham. His faith had failed him on more than one occasion: when he lied about Sarah being his sister, and when he took Hagar as a concubine. On the latter occasion, he didn't hear from God again for 13 years.
    But when Isaac was born, Abraham knew that he could trust God's promises, no matter how strange they seemed, so when God told him to sacrifice Isaac, he reasoned that God could raise the dead (Hebrews 11:19), and obeyed.
    Yep! There is a Godward as well as a manward side to this. God opened Abraham's heart to believe. There was no chance that he would refuse.
     
    #7 Martin Marprelate, Nov 11, 2024 at 10:16 AM
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  8. kyredneck

    kyredneck Well-Known Member
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    My question to you is, why so critical?

    It's informal conversation based in the Bible. What better place to be? Psalms 1:2
     
    #8 kyredneck, Nov 11, 2024 at 10:40 AM
  9. 37818

    37818 Well-Known Member

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    Matthew 22:31-32, . . .
    God, saying, I am the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob? God is not the God of the dead, but of the living.
     
    #9 37818, Nov 11, 2024 at 10:46 AM
  10. kyredneck

    kyredneck Well-Known Member
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    K. Still doesn't address the question of the OP - what if?
     
    #10 kyredneck, Nov 11, 2024 at 10:53 AM
  11. 37818

    37818 Well-Known Member

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    It sure does.
    Matthew 22:31-32, . . .
    God, saying, I am the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob? God is not the God of the dead, but of the living.

    Are you calling God a liar?
     
    #11 37818, Nov 11, 2024 at 11:21 AM
  12. kyredneck

    kyredneck Well-Known Member
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    OP question:
    ....wondered if Abraham could have failed also. Could Abraham have refused to sacrifice Isaac?

    @37818 response:
    Matthew 22:31-32, . . .
    God, saying, I am the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob? God is not the God of the dead, but of the living.
     
    #12 kyredneck, Nov 11, 2024 at 11:34 AM
  13. kyredneck

    kyredneck Well-Known Member
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    Go, relax, take a pill.
     
    #13 kyredneck, Nov 11, 2024 at 11:43 AM
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  14. yc205

    yc205 New Member

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    Hey if it wasn't for that Abraham, it would've been another Abraham that obeyed.
    God is the God of Abraham. :)
     
    #14 yc205, Nov 11, 2024 at 1:20 PM
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  15. kyredneck

    kyredneck Well-Known Member
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    Reminds me of Exodus 32:9-10. He was ready to create 'another Israel' from Moses.
     
    #15 kyredneck, Nov 11, 2024 at 2:46 PM
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  16. percho

    percho Well-Known Member
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    IMHO God called Abram out of unbelief unto belief.
     
    #16 percho, Nov 12, 2024 at 12:46 AM
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