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When Did Faith Become Works Based?

Paleouss

Active Member
Greetings and blessings to all my brothers in Christ Jesus.

The Bible tells us that “boasting is excluded because the law requires faith” (Rom 3:27). So then it would follow that faith is not works, for boasting is absent when talking about faith. In other words, there is no proclamation of 'self accomplishment' when we speak of faith (according to the Bible).

If “we are justified by faith apart from works” (Rom 3:28) then it follows that faith is not works; for it explicitly says that faith is “apart from works”. If we are justified by faith in Christ and not by the works of the law (Gal 2:16) then it is the case that faith is not works.

If the “one who does not work but trusts…their faith is credited as righteousness" (Rom 4:5). In Romans 4:5 the concept of "work" is contrasted against "but trusts". Then "but trusts" is associated with "faith". Therefore, faith/trust is not "works".

The entire theme of the Bible tells us that "works" and "boasting" is not "faith". They are opposites. The entire theme of the Bible tells us to have faith because there is only one thing absent of "works" and "boasting" and it is "faith".

So when did one espousing "faith" ever become a "works based" theology? I get it when one wants to assert that you cannot merit one's salvation through one's works. But the Bible is very clear that "faith" is not "works". John Calvin, the foundation the Reformed movement appeared to see this very clearly. He formulated "faith" to be "Faith, then, brings a man empty to God," (Calvin). What is Calvin saying man is "empty" of when he brings only faith? Calvin is saying that when man brings only faith he is empty of boasting. Calvin even says about man's part, that is faith, "Ought we not then to be silent about free-will, and good intentions, and fancied preparations, and merits, and satisfactions?" Calvin here is making a distinction between faith, which is empty, and boasting about free-will.

One might disagree on whether faith is "given" or "enabled" first or that man already has the ability of faith and God must first make His offer. But faith and man having faith is biblical. Faith is not works. Faith is not boasting. If you are boasting about your faith...well, that might be something else. But simply suggesting what the Bible tells us, that we must have faith and if we do He will credit it as righteousness.... is not boasting or works based.

So when did we drift so far from Calvin and start asserting that "faith" is "works based" and contains "boasting" and "merit"?

Peace to all my brothers that I agree and disagree with.
 
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JonC

Moderator
Moderator
Greetings and blessings to all my brothers in Christ Jesus.

The Bible tells us that “boasting is excluded because the law requires faith” (Rom 3:27). So then it would follow that faith is not works, for boasting is absent when talking about faith. In other words, there is no proclamation of 'self accomplishment' when we speak of faith (according to the Bible).

If “we are justified by faith apart from works” (Rom 3:28) then it follows that faith is not works; for it explicitly says that faith is “apart from works”. If we are justified by faith in Christ and not by the works of the law (Gal 2:16) then it is the case that faith is not works.

If the “one who does not work but trusts…their faith is credited as righteousness" (Rom 4:5). In Romans 4:5 the concept of "work" is contrasted against "but trusts". Then "but trusts" is associated with "faith". Therefore, faith/trust is not "works".

The entire theme of the Bible tells us that "works" and "boasting" is not "faith". They are opposites. The entire theme of the Bible tells us to have faith because there is only one thing absent of "works" and "boasting" and it is "faith".

So when did one espousing "faith" ever become a "works based" theology? I get it when one wants to assert that you cannot merit one's salvation through one's works. But the Bible is very clear that "faith" is not "works". John Calvin, the foundation the Reformed movement appeared to see this very clearly. He formulated "faith" to be "Faith, then, brings a man empty to God," (Calvin). What is Calvin saying man is "empty" of when he brings only faith? Calvin is saying that when man brings only faith he is empty of boasting. Calvin even says about man's part, that is faith, "Ought we not then to be silent about free-will, and good intentions, and fancied preparations, and merits, and satisfactions?" Calvin here is making a distinction between faith, which is empty, and boasting about free-will.

One might disagree on whether faith is "given" or "enabled" first or that man already has the ability of faith and God must first make His offer. But faith and man having faith is biblical. Faith is not works. Faith is not boasting. If you are boasting about your faith...well, that might be something else. But simply suggesting what the Bible tells us, that we must have faith and if we do He will credit it as righteousness.... is not boasting or works based.

So when did we drift so far from Calvin and start asserting that "faith" is "works based" and contains "boasting" and "merit"?

Peace to all my brothers that I agree and disagree with.
I've wondered the same.
 

kyredneck

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter

When Did Faith Become Works Based?​


There is no confusion in this matter when it's understood that our faith is NOT the source of our works. It is the regenerate heart that is the source of BOTH our works and our faith.

Several examples of works preceding conversion given in the scriptures.
 

Van

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Another great post, Paleouss! We are not saved by works. So to nullify our conditional election based on God crediting our faith as righteousness, coming to faith on our own is called works. Thus we must be saved unconditionally, then given faith via irresistible grace. The claim disregards Romans chapter 4.
 

kyredneck

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Another great post, Paleouss! We are not saved by works. So to nullify our conditional election based on God crediting our faith as righteousness, coming to faith on our own is called works. Thus we must be saved unconditionally, then given faith via irresistible grace. The claim disregards Romans chapter 4.

Vanology at it's best.
 

Van

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Vanology at it's best.
All these classy folks have is name calling and change of subject obfuscation.

We are not saved by works. So to nullify our conditional election based on God crediting our faith as righteousness, coming to faith on our own is called works. Thus we must be saved unconditionally, then given faith via irresistible grace.
The claim disregards Romans chapter 4.
 

Deacon

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Wayne Grudem, in his book against Free Grace Theology, turns to the Reformers when he defends (what he won't call) Lordship Salvation.

The historic Protestant position has often been summarized in a brief sentence:
We are justified by faith alone, but the faith that justifies is never alone.
The second half of the sentence, “the faith that justifies is never alone,” means that other things always accompany saving faith. In particular, saving faith is always followed by changes in a person’s conduct of life. In other words, saving faith is never alone in a person, for some good works will always accompany saving faith in a person’s life and will be seen after a person comes to faith.
Grudem, Wayne. 2016. “Free Grace” Theology: 5 Ways It Diminishes the Gospel. Wheaton, IL: Crossway.


Personally, I see it as a failure to separate salvation from sanctification.

Rob
 

Van

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Would God credit lip service faith lacking a deep seated commitment to follow Christ through headship and suffering?

Would God credit faith that does not make Christ the overriding priority of the believer, who values earthly treasures equally with Christ?

Coming to faith is not "works of the Law." Romans 4.

Coming to faith does not guarantee salvation, see Soils 2 and 3 of Matthew 13. Only faith as credited by God as righteousness results in salvation.
Pretty simple concept
 

Silverhair

Well-Known Member
There is no confusion in this matter when it's understood that our faith is NOT the source of our works. It is the regenerate heart that is the source of BOTH our works and our faith.

Several examples of works preceding conversion given in the scriptures.

The bible says we are born again/regenerate after we hear and believe the gospel not before.

We are saved because we believe and we do good works because we are saved. Why is that so confusing to you?
 
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