When Is A Believers Baptisim Invalid?

[webdog]

The so-called "universal church" is useless, if it exists at all, for it has never obeyed one syllable of the great commission, nor can it.

So when Jesus said "...upon this Rock I will build my church (singular"), which local church was He referring to?

 

[Allan]

Here are some basic scriptures I have found that fleshes out some of the differences I have seen.

Scriptures concerning the Universal Church
Added to by the Lord...............................................Acts 2:47
Entered by baptism..................................................I Cor 12:13
None but the saved.................................................2 Tim 2:19
Satan Can’t prevail against.....................................Matt 16:18
Relationship of Christ/Christians
.........No functional organization,
........oversight, or treasury.....................................Eph 1:22-23
Distributive (individual) action.................................Eph 5:24

Scriptures concerning the Local Church
Joins oneself to.......................................................Acts 9:26-28
Accepted into or received by...................................Act 18:27
Some are sick or dead............................................1 Cor 11:30
Satan can prevail against.......................................Acts 20:29-30
.......regarding some entering into the church and leading others astray........
Relationship of Christians w/ Christians.................Act 15:22-23
...............................................................................Col 4:12
Functional organization w/ Oversight & treasury.........Act20:28
................................................................................I Cor 16:2
................................................................................I Pet 5:2
Collective group action............................................Phil 4:15

 

[Tom Butler]

So when Jesus said "...upon this Rock I will build my church (singular"), which local church was He referring to?

Greetings, webdog:

I hold that Jesus was referring to the church that came into existence when he completed calling the twelve disciples. Jesus built that group by teaching them doctrine, adding the ordinances (both of which existed before Pentecost, by the way) and teaching to be witnesses.

It was a traveling church at first, finally settling in Jerusalem after the resurrection, where it had grown to at least 120 members.

What Jesus said about the assembly he founded is true of your congregation and mine. He is the Head, he purchased it with his own blood, and he builds it.

 

[Tom Butler]

I'm afraid we about to hi-jack this thread with our discussion of local vs. universal church. There's another thread dealing with this subject, that I think you started, webdog.

There is a loose connection here, since the discussion is about what constitutes valid baptism and most debate is over who is the administrator of the ordinances.

But for now, anything further on the subject of the church, I'll say it in webdog's thread, titled "Who's the Great Commission?"

 

[annsni]

I know the majority of us believe in immersion for baptistm - one thing I think about even aside from the "going into the water" and "coming out of the water" is what we say when baptisms are done (we just had 10 this weekend - mostly young people under 17 - what a blessing it was!). We say "buried in the likeness of His death" as they go under the water, and "raised in the likeness of His resurrection". I don't think we bury with just a bit of dirt sprinkled over the person but they are put into the ground. What an awesome visual of the burying of the old man and the life of the new man coming forth.

Ann

 

[Allan]

Good point Tom, Don't want to hi-jack the thread.

 

[Tom Butler]

I know the majority of us believe in immersion for baptistm - one thing I think about even aside from the "going into the water" and "coming out of the water" is what we say when baptisms are done (we just had 10 this weekend - mostly young people under 17 - what a blessing it was!). We say "buried in the likeness of His death" as they go under the water, and "raised in the likeness of His resurrection". I don't think we bury with just a bit of dirt sprinkled over the person but they are put into the ground. What an awesome visual of the burying of the old man and the life of the new man coming forth.

Excellent, Annsi. Add Romans 6:4 "...buried with him by baptism..." and "...like as Christ was raised..." and you have the scriptural basis for what the preacher says when he baptizes.