Where did Ellen White Get her Revelations from?

[Yeshua1]

What was their source?

 

[BobRyan]

Numbers 12:6 explains how prophecy works. It is worth reading I think.

1Thess 5:19-20 tells us how NT saints are to react to the gift of prophecy.

1John 4:1-4 tells us how NT saints are to test the prophets.

Is 30:8-11 tells us how God views rebellion against the work of the Holy Spirit in this regard.

And of course Rev 12:17 and 19:10 tell us that even at the end of time the saints are known for this gift of the Spirit of Prophecy.

in Christ,

Bob

 

[targus]

She was hit on the head with a rock as a child.

 

[Revmitchell]

Numbers 12:6 explains how prophecy works. It is worth reading I think.

in Christ,

Bob

That is a non answer

 

[BobRyan]

It is the Bible answer for where prophets get their information and how.

So also is 2Peter 1:20-21.

But to know if someone is a true or false prophet -- there are Bible tests which include things like 1John 4:1-4 and Isaiah 8:19

 

[Yeshua1]

It is the Bible answer for where prophets get their information and how.

So also is 2Peter 1:20-21.

But to know if someone is a true or false prophet -- there are Bible tests which include things like 1John 4:1-4 and Isaiah 8:19

TRUE prophets get their revealtions from God, but where did Ellen white get hers, as hers denied the true Gospel, and added doctrines and practices contrary to the Bible?

HOW can there be any additional revelations from FGod since revealtion ceased when canon closed?

 

[BobRyan]

TRUE prophets get their revealtions from God,

Indeed that is what 2Pet 1:20-21 and Numbers 12:6 tell us.

but where did Ellen white get hers,

From God - didn't we just read 2 Pet 1:20-21??

HOW can there be any additional revelations from FGod since revealtion ceased when canon closed?

No Bible text says "revelation from God ceased when Catholics closed the canon".

I think we both know that.

Also no Bible text says that "all prophets write scripture" - I think we all see that in 1Cor 14 where "each one had a revelation" but all at the Church of Corinth did not write scripture.

That is the easy part.

in Christ,

Bob

 

[Revmitchell]

Where did Ellen White Get her Revelations from?]

Probably the same place Joseph Smith did.

 

[BobRyan]

When you study with Mormons they ask you to simply "accept" Joseph Smith and read their books.

When you study with Seventh-day Adventists they ask you to "Study the Bible" and test doctrine 'sola scriptura'.

Anyone can simply say no to whatever they wish. That is easy.

The hard part is doing what Paul said in 1Thess 5:19-20 and what John said in 1John 4:1-4 - the sola scriptura test that affirms what is right and knows how to detect that which is not.

in Christ,

Bob

 

[Yeshua1]

When you study with Mormons they ask you to simply "accept" Joseph Smith and read their books.

When you study with Seventh-day Adventists they ask you to "Study the Bible" and test doctrine 'sola scriptura'.

Anyone can simply say no to whatever they wish. That is easy.

The hard part is doing what Paul said in 1Thess 5:19-20 and what John said in 1John 4:1-4 - the sola scriptura test that affirms what is right and knows how to detect that which is not.

in Christ,

Bob

BOTH denied the Gospel of jesus, as taught by Apostles, so BOTH were NOT from/Of God!

 

[Yeshua1]

Probably the same place Joseph Smith did.

Think both got it from same One that gave Muhammed His!

 

[BobRyan]

BOTH denied the Gospel of jesus, !

Ellen White strongly affirmed the Gospel - and this is easily found in devotional books such as "Steps to Christ" and also her commentary on the life of Christ "Desire of Ages".

in Christ,

Bob

 

[steaver]

What I would like to know Bob, is what "revelation" did EGW give that was not already recorded in the scriptures? For if it was already recorded, then that is preaching rather than giving revelation.

 

[BobRyan]

What I would like to know Bob, is what "revelation" did EGW give that was not already recorded in the scriptures? For if it was already recorded, then that is preaching rather than giving revelation.

Agreed. The Claim being made by prophets is not simply that they are "preaching what someone else was told by God". The claim is that God has just told them something in true Numbers 12:6 fashion.

Someone else asked this same question so a I started a thread for that very purpose (which has since gotten a little side-tracked but if you read page 1 you will see the point)..

http://www.baptistboard.com/showpost.php?p=2001656&postcount=1

in Christ,

Bob

 

[steaver]

Agreed. The Claim being made by prophets is not simply that they are "preaching what someone else was told by God". The claim is that God has just told them something in true Numbers 12:6 fashion.

Someone else asked this same question so a I started a thread for that very purpose (which has since gotten a little side-tracked but if you read page 1 you will see the point)..

http://www.baptistboard.com/showpost.php?p=2001656&postcount=1

in Christ,

Bob

I read the whole article on EGW's quotes and the commentary of those. I gotta be honest brother, I don't see any thing spiritually prophetic for the body of Christ, nor anything more than presumptions made from a witness of the signs of the times.

When you say she is a prophet of God, I would think that she would have some "God said" declarations for the church. I didn't see any of those.

 

[BobRyan]

I read the whole article on EGW's quotes and the commentary of those. I gotta be honest brother, I don't see any thing spiritually prophetic

So then you did not see anything in the long list of confirmed facts relating to health sciences either?

REally? It all just slipped right passed you?

I find that to be a small miracle all in itself.

in Christ,

Bob

 

[BobRyan]

Disasters and Wars

In 1902, she warned that the cities around the bay area of California would suffer disaster. She wrote this:

Not long hence, these cities will suffer under the judgment of God. San Francisco and Oakland are becoming as Sodom and Gomorrah, and the Lord will visit them in wrath (Evangelism, 403-404).
Those who heeded Ellen White’s warning left this area and avoided the earthquake of April 18, 1906, which devastated the cities mentioned! In 1890, when peace was prevalent, she wrote this:
The tempest is coming.... We shall see trouble on all sides. Thousands of ships will be hurled into the depths of the sea. Navies will go down and human lives will be sacrificed by millions (Signs of the Times, April 21, 1890).

In 1904, she wrote this:

Soon great trouble will arise among nations—trouble that will not cease until Jesus comes (Review and Herald, February 11, 1906).

The world has seen two world wars and numerous skirmishes since then. Currently, it is a sad fact that over 200 wars between ethnic nations are raging across the globe, leading to what is often called “ethnic cleansing.” Besides these global warnings, Ellen White made a number of personal predictions regarding individual church members who refused to heed the counsel of God. These too were all fulfilled to the letter.
Health

Regarding the establishment of the health ministry, Ellen White received numerous visions with detailed instructions as to what constitutes a healthy lifestyle. The information that was brought to light was way ahead of its time, mostly contradictory to the views held by the scientific fraternity of her time. Her predictions concerning future health hazards are currently unfolding.

HEALTH

The health message was designed to lift humanity out of the quagmire of erroneous ideas on the issue of health and to provide a bulwark against disease. The health message was also designed to prepare a people spiritually to withstand the stresses and spiritual warfare predicted for the time of the end.... Space does not allow a detailed discussion on her health counsels, but a few issues are worthy of note. As far back as 1864, when the medical world was unaware of the dangers of tobacco, and indeed often prescribed it as a cure or preventative measure against certain lung ailments, Ellen White wrote this:

Tobacco is a poison of the most deceitful and malignant kind, having an exciting, then a paralysing influence upon the nerves of the body. It is all the more dangerous because its effects upon the system are so slow, and at first scarcely perceivable. Multitudes have fallen victims to its poisonous influence (Counsels on Health, 84).

Not until 1957 did a committee of scientists appointed by the American Cancer Society and the American Heart Association conclude that smoking was a causative factor in lung cancer. Counseling physicians on how to regard the issue of smoking, she wrote this:

The physician should be a strictly temperate man. The physical ailments of humanity are numberless, and he has to deal with disease in all its varied forms. He knows that much of the suffering he seeks to relieve is the result of intemperance and other forms of selfish indulgence. He is called to attend young men and men in the prime of life and in mature age, who have brought disease upon themselves by the use of the narcotic tobacco (Counsels on Health, 321-322).

The fact that Ellen White calls tobacco a narcotic is indeed surprising, since the narcotic effects of nicotine have only been established in recent times. Given this fact, and the present knowledge that the use of tobacco is a recognized precursor for the development of cravings for stronger stimulants such as drugs, to which the youth is particularly susceptible, it is indeed astounding that she wrote about these issues in her time.

The use of tobacco and strong drinks has a great deal to do with the increase of disease and crime. Tobacco is a slow, insidious, but most malignant poison, and its use is working untold harm...Boys begin the use of tobacco at a very early age. The habit thus formed, when body and mind are especially susceptible to its effects, undermines the physical strength and corrupts the morals (Manuscripts Releases, 115).
The Bible teaches that the body is the temple of the Holy Spirit, and that we are admonished to preserve our bodies as living sacrifices:
I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service. And be not conformed to this world, but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good and acceptable and perfect will of God (Romans 12:1-2).
This call would include the avoidance of harmful substances, as Ellen White explains:
Men can do much more for God and his fellow-man, if he is in the vigour of health, than if he is suffering from disease and pain. Tobacco using, liquor-drinking, and wrong habits of diet, induce disease and pain which incapacitate man for the use he might be in the world (Health Reformer, October 1, 1877).

 

[BobRyan]

More Health Examples -

Ellen White counseled that the use of animal products in the diet was harmful and that their use would become even more harmful as time progressed. The following statements, so contradictory to the views of her day, are a brief extract of what she wrote on the issue.

The meat diet is the serious question. Shall human beings live on the flesh of dead animals? The answer, from the light that God has given, is No, decidedly No. Health reform institutions should educate on this question. Physicians who claim to understand the human organism ought not to encourage their patients to subsist on the flesh of dead animals. They should point out the increase of disease in the animal kingdom. This testimony of examiners is that very few animals are free from disease, and that the practice of eating largely of meat is contracting diseases of all kinds— cancers, tumours, scrofula, tuberculosis, and numbers of other like affections (Counsel for Diet and Foods, 338).

This counsel is only now being proved by the scientific fraternity. The link between meat consumption and the diseases listed is well documented. Worldwide, and in my own laboratory, this link has been established beyond doubt.i
Vegetarian societies have a much lower risk of contracting the diseases listed than omnivorous societies. Ellen White also warned that the time would come when, for the sake of health, one would have to dispense with all animal products, including milk and eggs. Never did she, however, advocate fanatical views on this issue and even cautioned that circumstances should be taken into account when counseling those who did not always have access to alternative foods. In 1901, she wrote this:

We see that cattle are becoming greatly diseased, the earth itself is corrupted, and we know that the time will come when it will not be best to use milk and eggs. But that time has not yet come. We know that when it does come, the Lord will provide. The question is asked, meaning much to all concerned, Will God set a table in the wilderness? I think the answer may be made, Yea, God will provide food for His people (Counsel for Diet and Foods, 359).
Milk, eggs, and butter should not be classed with flesh meat. In some cases, the use of eggs is beneficial. The time has not come to say that the use of milk and eggs should be wholly discarded. There are poor families whose diet consists largely of bread and milk. They have little fruit, and cannot afford to purchase the nut foods. In teaching health reform, as in all other gospel work, we are to meet the people where they are. Until we can teach them how to prepare health reform foods that are palatable, nourishing, and yet inexpensive, we are not at liberty to present the most advanced propositions regarding health reform diet (Counsel for Diet and Foods, 351).

She counseled that God would prepare the way for the substitution of harmful foods with healthier alternatives. This prediction has been fulfilled with the introduction of new cultivars, such as the soybean and its by-products, as well as the expansion of trade and communication routes.

In all parts of the world, provision will be made to supply the place of milk and eggs. And the Lord will let us know when the time comes to give up these articles. He desires all to feel that they have a gracious heavenly Father who will instruct them in all things. The Lord will give dietetic art and skill to His people in all parts of the world, teaching them how to use, for the sustenance of life, the products of the earth (Counsel for Diet and Foods, 359).

The time will come, however, come when these items were to be discarded from the diet:

Soon butter will never be recommended, and after a time, milk will be entirely discarded, for disease in animals is increasing in proportion to the increase of wickedness among men. The time will come when there will be no safety in using eggs, milk, cream or butter (Manuscript Releases Volume 8, Letter 14, 1901, 3).

In our time, these predictions have been fulfilled in a manner that has astounded both the scientists and the general public. Indeed, even governments are in a panic over the modern flood of diseases striking the farming industry.
In Britain, the entire stock of cattle needs to be exterminated in view of BSE (mad cow disease). The chicken and egg industry has been reeling under the exponential increase in transferable infectious diseases caused by bacteria such as Salmonella, forcing governments to introduce legislation restricting the sale of uncooked eggs in restaurants.
The modern animal husbandry industry has produced a new breed of antibiotic resistant bacteria that are threatening the outbreak of worldwide epidemics of food poisoning from the consumption of animal products. The outbreak of food poisoning is no longer confined to countries or institutions with poor hygiene, but has become universal.

 

[BobRyan]

When you say she is a prophet of God, I would think that she would have some "God said" declarations for the church. I didn't see any of those.

She has a book written to Ministers and a 9 volume set of "Testimonies to the Church" all of them loaded with "God said " ..

And the book "Great Controversy" takes us all the way through to the end of time - with God providing information at a detail level far beyond what we had prior to that.

All of it available for free online. Do the search on "I was shown" and "said the Angel" since this seems to be one area you are interested in.

in Christ,

Bob

 

[BobRyan]

An even easier example to find and example of spiritual insights given through the 1Cor 12 gift of prophecy is simply to read her online book "Christ's Object Lessons".

Easier than that - read the first 4 chapters of the online book "Patriarch's and Prophets".

The Conflict of the Ages series is a commentary on the Bible from Genesis to Revelation.

1. Patriarchs and Prophets covers Genesis through Judges.
2. Prophets and Kings covers the remainder of the O.T.
3. Desire of Ages - the Gospels.
4. Acts of the Apostles - the NT writings.
5. Great Controversy - and sweeping view of world history from the destruction of Jerusalem until the New Earth of Rev 21 and 22.

So the first four chapters of book 1 above - is a great place to get an "example" of the kind of spiritual insights that come from the 1Cor 12 gift of prophecy.

in Christ,

Bob