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Who is responsible?

Discussion in 'Fundamental Baptist Forum' started by agedman, Nov 10, 2011.

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  1. agedman

    agedman Well-Known Member
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    Who is responsible?

    In the parable of the seed and ground I have a question for the thinking folk of this forum.

    Who is responsible for the dirt?

    Seriously, who determines where the road is, the rocks piles, the areas where the dirt is little – possibly because it is walked on as a path to the barn, and the well tilled and prepared soil?

    Is it the one who is spreading the seed?

    Is it the soil that has the ability to move from one area to another?


    Is it the sun, moon, rain, wind, or other forces of nature or environment?

    Perhaps, it is the natural state of some dirt chosen for plowing and some for walking upon.

    Who is really in charge of the dirt?
     
    #1 agedman, Nov 10, 2011
  2. Winman

    Winman Active Member

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    If you read further, it is explained. Read Luke 18:18.

    Luk 18:18 Take heed therefore how ye hear: for whosoever hath, to him shall be given, and whosoever hath not, from him shall be taken even that which he seemeth to have.

    The condition of the soil is the responsibility of the hearer. The way side soil was hard and trodden down, the seed (word of God vs. 11) could not penetrate and lay on the surface, the fowls (the devil- love of sin vs. 12) take it away. The good soil are those who humble themselves and believe, to them more shall be given and they shall bear fruit (vs 15)

    Then Jesus concludes this parable and tells his disciples to be careful how they hear. To those that hear and believe more will be given, but to those that do not hear, even that which was given them shall be taken away.
     
    #2 Winman, Nov 10, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 10, 2011
  3. HankD

    HankD Well-Known Member
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    I don't think the point of the parable is to assign blame concerning the soil but just simply to predict/prophesy the response to the word during this age of planting seed and harvesting the crop.

    It is those who actually receive the word and "understandeth it not" who have it snatched away by the "wicked one".

    the word chosen for "understand" in this context may well mean that the individual prefers not to understand but is quite happy just the way he is. The "wicked one" simply accomodates him by snatching away the word.

    BTW who is this person - WWJDKID what axe is he grinding and why?

    Or is it better to just leave it alone?


    HankD
     
    #3 HankD, Nov 10, 2011
  4. agedman

    agedman Well-Known Member
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    WWJDkid

    What are you talking about? Are you sure you are on the right thread? I am not at all familiar with who DR. WALTER/MARK W FENISON/ PASTOR/ may be, and can sure you I don't have 5 children. I have 2 and neither one of them rejects the Scripture nor my sweet wife and me.
     
    #4 agedman, Nov 11, 2011
  5. agedman

    agedman Well-Known Member
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    HankD,

    I think it is very important. Winman would say that the soil is responsible for the soil. That would not be consistent with "the natural man receives not the things of the spirit."

    I wasn't assigning blame, but who is responsible. It would seem that the "Lord of the harvest" (owner of that dirt in question) would be ultimately responsible. Unless the person bearing the seed were the "Lord of the harvest" then the sower (preacher) has no responsibility other than to sow the seed.

    Hence, the parable would fit into the balance of scripture appropriately. Any other reckoning would place the preacher, or "soul winner" as responsible for the hearers condition (preparation of dirt to receive seed).

    Same thinking as those who would contend that the music should "prepare the hearts of the congregation to worship." It replaces the work of the Holy Spirit with the work of man.
     
    #5 agedman, Nov 11, 2011
  6. HankD

    HankD Well-Known Member
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    OK but I don't see it to that extent but to extend that this parable is given for the behalf of the harvesters so that their expectations are aligned with the coming reality of an "apparent" failure of some of the work.

    Also, we assist the Holy Spirit do we not? Or what would be the point of the preaching via human instruments or the gifts to the church of teachers, those gifted with wisdom and understanding, etc...

    However I do feel that worship is a 24/7 spontaneous activity of the children of God at some level of consciousness. The music could perhaps be used of the Spirit to heighten awareness.

    That God uses human instrumentality is found on every page of the Bible.

    HankD
     
    #6 HankD, Nov 11, 2011
  7. preacher4truth

    preacher4truth Active Member

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    I'd be cautious about teaching we assist the Holy Spirit. I feel and believe it's quite opposite of that, as He needs no assistance from us, but we are completely in need of His.
     
    #7 preacher4truth, Nov 11, 2011
  8. Amy.G

    Amy.G New Member

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    Certainly God does not need us, but for some reason He has chosen man to share in His work. I don't know why, but it's clear He does.
     
    #8 Amy.G, Nov 11, 2011
  9. quantumfaith

    quantumfaith Active Member

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    :thumbs::thumbs::thumbs:
     
    #9 quantumfaith, Nov 11, 2011
  10. HankD

    HankD Well-Known Member
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    Hi P4T, I never made the absurd statement that the Holy Spirit needs us, you are putting words in my mouth brother.

    "assist" may be a poor choice of words.

    We assist Him at His will of course (perhaps participate would be a better word). I use the word "assist" which involves our obedience to His will because I believe we can resist and grieve Him which we are commanded not to do.

    HankD
     
    #10 HankD, Nov 12, 2011
    Last edited: Nov 12, 2011
  11. convicted1

    convicted1 Guest

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    God does resist the proud, but gives His Grace to the humble. No humbleness=no repentence, no repentence=no salvation.
     
    #11 convicted1, Nov 28, 2011
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