Implications of Common Law Marriage

[Marcia]

Off the top of my head.....

For this reason a man shall leave his father and mother and cling to his wife and the two shall become one flesh.
Don't commit adultry.
Cling to the wife of your youth.
Submit to your husband.
Love your wife as Christ loved the church.
God hates divorce
What God has joined together, let no man tear asunder.

None of this goes against a state marriage or getting a marriage license, or vice-versa.

They declare themselves to be married by vowing to be married to each other before Almighty God and revealing their intention to married to family and friends.

Can you show them from scripture that they are wrong? Of course not. You just keep repeating the same argument that they are to submit to the government, even though it has been shown over and over that there is no prohibition from the government to do exactly what they have done.

And there's nothing about getting a marriage license that goes against being married in a godly manner. They are the ones challenging the norm here, and should prove their case. What if they were Mormons? Or part of a cult and declared themselves married? Would they be married in you eyes? I don't see scriptural support for not getting a marriage license.

 

[canadyjd]

They are the ones challenging the norm here, and should prove their case.

No, they are the ones seeking to follow scripture here, not the "norms" of society.

Those who oppose what they have done must make their case from scripture, not "norms", which no one has been able to do.

I don't see scriptural support for not getting a marriage license.

They don't see scriptural support for getting a marriage license.

Can you show them from scripture that they are wrong?

peace to youraying:

 

[Spinach]

I mostly agree with canadyjd here.

I have a marriage license for reasons of taxation, etc. It is not necessary to me, or to God, imo.

Casual s*x---fornication
S*x with anyone already married or with anyone other than your husband or wife---adultery
Becoming one flesh, commited to one another for life---marriage

Polygamy is a whole other topic, which I would enjoy discussing in a spin-off thread. Of course, it could just be once again beating a dead horse.

 

[Aaron]

A marriage license is primarily for the state to recognize two people for purposes such as taxation.

That's not true. Any license is a contract with the state. A marriage license makes the state a third party in the marriage.

 

[JustChristian]

That's not true. Any license is a contract with the state. A marriage license makes the state a third party in the marriage.

I suppose the state is a third party in the marriage. If the marriage fails and a divorce is requested the matter must be handled by the state to be legal. Once again we have a rendering unto Caesar situation.

What do you believe is the corruption that arises from this arrangement?

 

[canadyjd]

I suppose the state is a third party in the marriage. If the marriage fails and a divorce is requested the matter must be handled by the state to be legal. Once again we have a rendering unto Caesar situation.

What do you believe is the corruption that arises from this arrangement?

Jesus said that what God has joined together, let no man tear apart.

He was specifically addressing the traditions of men concerning marriage and divorce.

That seems, in the humble opinion of our hypothetical couple, to place marriage in the realm of rendering to God what belongs to God (not Ceasar to Ceasar).

peace to youraying:

 

[annsni]

Jesus said that what God has joined together, let no man tear apart.

He was specifically addressing the traditions of men concerning marriage and divorce.

That seems, in the humble opinion of our hypothetical couple, to place marriage in the realm of rendering to God what belongs to God (not Ceasar to Ceasar).

peace to youraying:

Can you show me where God says not to have a ceremony? Where God says to make sure you do it without the law involved?

 

[JustChristian]

Jesus said that what God has joined together, let no man tear apart.

He was specifically addressing the traditions of men concerning marriage and divorce.

That seems, in the humble opinion of our hypothetical couple, to place marriage in the realm of rendering to God what belongs to God (not Ceasar to Ceasar).

peace to youraying:

A full 50% of marriages today end in divorce. I'm not saying this is good. I'm stating a fact and Christian couples are even worse than the average. What would this "theoretical couple" do if their marriage fell apart? Who would have custody of the children? Would the person with money be required to support their children?

 

[Marcia]

No, they are the ones seeking to follow scripture here, not the "norms" of society.

Those who oppose what they have done must make their case from scripture, not "norms", which no one has been able to do.

They don't see scriptural support for getting a marriage license.

Can you show them from scripture that they are wrong?

peace to youraying:

They are the one challenging the need to have a marriage license and therefore need to show from scripture why they can be married by just declaring themselves married, and why it's okay for a Chrstian couple to appear to be living together in everyone's eyes. They are going against the norm, so the burden is on them. I don't see scriptural support for what they want to do.

As for divorce, God did allow it under certain conditions. What if this marriage fails? Do they declare themselves divorced? Or are they too perfect to contemplate such a possibility?

 

[canadyjd]

Can you show me where God says not to have a ceremony? Where God says to make sure you do it without the law involved?

FTR, our hypothetical couple did have a ceremony....between themselves and God and they announced it to family and friends....so they have never argued that scripture says to not have a ceremony.

You are making an argument from silence, which is almost always, 98.5% of the time, a losing argument.

"For this reason a man shall leave his father and mother and cling to his wife and the two shall become one flesh."

There is no mention of getting a marriage license here or getting the "law involved".

There are many other examples.

peace to youraying:

 

[canadyjd]

A full 50% of marriages today end in divorce. I'm not saying this is good. I'm stating a fact and Christian couples are even worse than the average.

hummmmmm...50% of state sponsored marriages end in divorce....hummmmmm....Christian couples involved in state sponsored marriages are even worse than average....hummmmm.....

And yet, no one seems to be able to understand why our hypothetical couple view state sponsored marriage as so corrupt that to participate would be an affront to God.

What would this "theoretical couple" do if their marriage fell apart? Who would have custody of the children? Would the person with money be required to support their children?

Our theoretical couple would never divorce or separate because...

1. As Christians, they took their vows seriously before God and not the state.
2. As Christians, they know that God hates divorce.
3. As Christians, they know that to divorce is to sin before God.
4. As Christians, they are bound together by Holy Spirit in a bond of mutual love and respect that is strengthened by hardship, protected from temptation, immune to selfishness, and comforted by the fact that their marriage will endure all things in the power of God.

peace to youraying:

 

[canadyjd]

They are the one challenging the need to have a marriage license and therefore need to show from scripture why they can be married by just declaring themselves married,.....

They gave God's command in instituting marriage...."For this reason a man shall leave his father and mother and cling to his wife and the two shall become one flesh". They gave examples from scripture of people being married by just delcaring themselves to be married. They have met the burden of scriptural support for their actions.

.....and why it's okay for a Chrstian couple to appear to be living together in everyone's eyes.

You misrepresent the matter. They do not appear to be living together in "everyone's eyes". They appear to be "living together" in the eyes of those who cling to tradition over scripture....who embrace societies norms over biblical commands.

As for divorce, God did allow it under certain conditions.

Jesus said that divorce was allowed (by Moses...not God) because of the hardness of people's hearts... and... that it was not that way in the beginning. That tells us that God's intention of marriage never included divorce. It is the "norms" of society that allowed marriages to be corrupted by divorce.

What if this marriage fails?

It will not fail. Their marriage is based first and foremost upon their mutual love of Jesus Christ, and secondly on their deep and abiding love and respect of each other. And, as those who believe scripture to be God's Word know and understand....such love never fails.

peace to youraying:

 

[annsni]

hummmmmm...50% of state sponsored marriages end in divorce....hummmmmm....Christian couples involved in state sponsored marriages are even worse than average....hummmmm.....

Guess what? The statistics are worse if you don't have a state marriage.[/QUOTE]

 

[annsni]

FTR, our hypothetical couple did have a ceremony....between themselves and God and they announced it to family and friends....so they have never argued that scripture says to not have a ceremony.

I can hear all of the teens "But mom and dad! We committed to each other! We made promises before God and now we're married!"

Yeah, that holds a lot of water. Guess what? That's not a marriage to the state ..... so it's illegal.

You claim you are married because you made a promise before God.

The state says you're married because you live together and tell each other you're husband and wife (in 11 states - NONE of the others recognize it).

So you are not married in the United States. Maybe in another country, but not in the United States.

 

[Magnetic Poles]

I can hear all of the teens "But mom and dad! We committed to each other! We made promises before God and now we're married!"

Yeah, that holds a lot of water. Guess what? That's not a marriage to the state ..... so it's illegal.

Not if they are of legal age in a common law state.

The state says you're married because you live together and tell each other you're husband and wife (in 11 states - NONE of the others recognize it).

Not correct. Let's say the hypothetical couple establish a common law marriage in Oklahoma, where it it legal. They then move to a state where common law marriage is not a legal method of establishing a marriage. That state will STILL recognize it as marriage, since the state in which the relationship was established does recognize it. This is a hot button issue with gay marriage...states recognize marriages established under the law of other states.

My spouse and I got married (in a church BTW) in another state. We now live in Colorado, which recognizes our out of state marriage. Moving here did not "unmarry" us.

 

[annsni]

Not if they are of legal age in a common law state.

In all but 2 states, they must be living together in order to be "married".

Not correct. Let's say the hypothetical couple establish a common law marriage in Oklahoma, where it it legal. They then move to a state where common law marriage is not a legal method of establishing a marriage. That state will STILL recognize it as marriage, since the state in which the relationship was established does recognize it. This is a hot button issue with gay marriage...states recognize marriages established under the law of other states.

My spouse and I got married (in a church BTW) in another state. We now live in Colorado, which recognizes our out of state marriage. Moving here did not "unmarry" us.

You cannot go to a common law state, get "common law" married one weekend and come back to your state to be married. You must live in the other state and fulfill the requirements of the common law first. But it's a murky thing - it's not a given that a state will recognize common law marriage if it is challenged.

 

[canadyjd]

Guess what? The statistics are worse if you don't have a state marriage.

Guess what? The statistics are 100% married forever and never divorce for those who follow God's instructions on marriage.

peace to youraying:

 

[canadyjd]

You claim you are married because you made a promise before God.

The state says you're married because you live together and tell each other you're husband and wife (in 11 states - NONE of the others recognize it).

So you are not married in the United States. Maybe in another country, but not in the United States.

Our hypothetical couple claim to be married because they have followed scripture.

You keep appealing to the state for validation.

They keep appealing to God and His Word for validation.

They are standing on a firm foundation of truth.

You are standing on the corrupted norms of society.

peace to youraying:

 

[annsni]

Guess what? The statistics are 100% married forever and never divorce for those who follow God's instructions on marriage.

peace to youraying:

Oh? Can I see those statistics?

 

[annsni]

Our hypothetical couple claim to be married because they have followed scripture.

You keep appealing to the state for validation.

They keep appealing to God and His Word for validation.

They are standing on a firm foundation of truth.

You are standing on the corrupted norms of society.

peace to youraying:

Can you show me the scriptural directions for marriage? Yes, there are words on marriage but it does not tell us HOW to marry. The verses that you have quoted are exactly what I have done too - and I have a legal marriage. I know that weddings in Bible times were legal marriages too - as well as religious ceremonies. There was not a "we are married" thing but a proper, traditional ceremony.

The corrupted norms of society are what God tells us to follow when we are told to obey our government. Why are you telling me that I'm sinning in having been married the way I was?