Good to hear! One more person who has been saved from an endless parade of illustrations, flow charts, and arrows, that would confuse a NASA engineer...
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I've Given Up Dispensationalism...
- Thread starter TCGreek
- Start date
Good to hear! One more person who has been saved from an endless parade of illustrations, flow charts, and arrows, that would confuse a NASA engineer...
pilgrim2009
New Member
"Study to show thyself approved unto God..."
Curious...when does the church inherit the land?Gods promises to Israel have not failed they are being fulfilled in the Church.
Galatians 3:28 neither Jew nor Greek......ye are ALL ONE in Christ Jesus.
Galatians 3:29 And if ye be Christ`s then are ye Abrahams seed,and heirs according to the promise.
Galatians 6:15 For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision availeth anything,nor uncircumcision,but a NEW CREATURE.
Galatians 6:16 And as many as walkk according to THIS RULE,peace be on them,and mercy,and upon THE ISRAEL OF GOD.
Jew and greek {i.e.gentile} are made ONE IN CHRIST and the above refers to those in Christ THE ISRAEL OF GOD.
Romans 9:8 Israel according to the flesh are not the children of God.
The same offer made to Nocodemus a JEW by Jesus 2000 years ago {John 3:1-6 still stands until Christ returns and then the earth will be destroyed by fire {2nd Peter 3:12}and the last Judgment and the New Heavens and earth {2nd Peter 3:13}
Peter said the new heavens and earth follows Christ coming and Rev chapter 21 the new heavens and earth appear and in Revelation chapter 20 is the 1000 year millennium {i.e.symbolic of the church age} and the 1st resurrection {i.e.spiritual resurrection of all believers in the church age}.
Dispensationalist are waiting on a millennium thats almost over.
Mercy.
If your Biblical system cannot be understood without a 1000 page book, and a 1500 poster boards with illustrations, it is most likely wrong. God says He has revealed Himself to the simple, not to the rocket scientists.
pilgrim2009
New Member
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Havensdad: "...that would confuse a NASA engineer." :laugh:
Well, I had trouble reconciling a lot of what I found in Dispensationalism with what the text of Scripture was naturally yielding.
OldRegular
Well-Known Member
Could be in the NEW EARTH [Revelation 21 and 22; Isaiah 65:17; Isaiah 66:22]
Isaiah 66:22 taken in context is particularly interesting:
Isaiah 66:15-24
15. For, behold, the LORD will come with fire, and with his chariots like a whirlwind, to render his anger with fury, and his rebuke with flames of fire.
16. For by fire and by his sword will the LORD plead with all flesh: and the slain of the LORD shall be many.
17. They that sanctify themselves, and purify themselves in the gardens behind one tree in the midst, eating swine’s flesh, and the abomination, and the mouse, shall be consumed together, saith the LORD.
18. For I know their works and their thoughts: it shall come, that I will gather all nations and tongues; and they shall come, and see my glory.
19. And I will set a sign among them, and I will send those that escape of them unto the nations, to Tarshish, Pul, and Lud, that draw the bow, to Tubal, and Javan, to the isles afar off, that have not heard my fame, neither have seen my glory; and they shall declare my glory among the Gentiles.
20. And they shall bring all your brethren for an offering unto the LORD out of all nations upon horses, and in chariots, and in litters, and upon mules, and upon swift beasts, to my holy mountain Jerusalem, saith the LORD, as the children of Israel bring an offering in a clean vessel into the house of the LORD.
21. And I will also take of them for priests and for Levites, saith the LORD.
22. For as the new heavens and the new earth, which I will make, shall remain before me, saith the LORD, so shall your seed and your name remain.
23. And it shall come to pass, that from one new moon to another, and from one sabbath to another, shall all flesh come to worship before me, saith the LORD.
24. And they shall go forth, and look upon the carcases of the men that have transgressed against me: for their worm shall not die, neither shall their fire be quenched; and they shall be an abhorring unto all flesh.
Verses 15 & 16 appear prophetic of Revelation 19.
OldRegular
Well-Known Member
You are very welcome!
Have you met anyone who understands the charts, etc. especially considering the fact that dispensationalism has made at least two major changes in the last 35 years? I have not met anyone who does and that includes students and pastors.
Exactly...and a plain reading of 1 and 2 Thessalonians supports my view quite nicely. I will counter that it takes eschatalogical gymnastics to squeeze the church into the meaning of Israel.
OldRegular
Well-Known Member
No one is trying to squeeze the Church into the meaning of National or carnal Israel. The Church is the continuation of Spiritual Israel, the believing remnant of the Old Testament. Paul clearly shows this in Romans 11 in the parable of the olive trees [assuming one is willing to believe Scripture].
By the way there is nothing in Thessalonians 1 or 2 that indicates a pre-trib rapture. That is just something that is read into them by dispensationalists.
I have never found the charts particularly helpful or confusing. They were ways that people used to try to help others understand. Some of them were good, and others were bad. I guess there are some who just don't get it.
Why do you continually equate your understanding of Scripture as Scripture itself...and any disagreement with your and your view "not believing Scripture"? Getting quite "old", regular...
The parable in Romans 11 refutes your view, not supports it. If a cherry branch is grafted into an orange tree, it still remains a cherry branch...but it is given life by the tree. Your view has the cherry branch becoming an orange branch upon grafting. Silly.
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Good question, as I read on I'm wondering the same thing. Talk about pontification!!
Darren
OldRegular
Well-Known Member
Probably because I have been talking to dispensationalists so much I have picked up their bad habits.
At least I have not picked up the habit of questioning the veracity of God if He does not agree with my interpretation.
OldRegular
Well-Known Member
Then prove it!
Yes and its very obvious to see when coming down to interpreting Rom 11 and the 144,000 sealed of Israel. Has God cast off Israel? Certainly NOT!!
Darren