Which Bible is It?

[Jerome]

Does anyone recognize the Bible version(s) from these books by John Robinson (pastor of the Pilgrims)?:

Of Religious Commvnion Private, & Publique (1614):
The simple beleeveth every vvord: but the prudent looketh vvell to his goeing. Prov. 14.15.

A Manvmission to a Manvdvction (1615):
Stand fast in the liberty wherwith Christ hath made you free. Gal. 5.1.
Be not partaker of other mens sinns: keep thyself pure. I.Tim.5.22.

The Peoples Plea (1618):
I. Cor. 14.1.
Follow after charity, and desire spirituall gifts, but rather that yee may prophesie.

 

[Jerome]

Now, it cannot be the KJB, because the Pilgrims (and Puritans and conservatives and early Baptists) REJECTED that "Anglican Version". They all eschewed and spurned that "government" Bible endrosed by the King, right?

 

[annsni]

Was it the Geneva Bible? I believe that was the Pilgrim's Bible.

 

[TC]

Does anyone recognize the Bible version(s) from these books by John Robinson (pastor of the Pilgrims)?:

Of Religious Commvnion Private, & Publique (1614):
The simple beleeveth every vvord: but the prudent looketh vvell to his goeing. Prov. 14.15.

The simple beleeueth euery word: but the prudent man looketh well to his going. (1611 KJV)

The foolish will beleeue euery thing: but the prudent will consider his steppes. (Geneva)

An ignorant body beleueth euery worde: but who so hath vnderstanding, loketh well to his goynges. (Bishops)

A Manvmission to a Manvdvction

(1615):
Stand fast in the liberty wherwith Christ hath made you free. Gal. 5.1.
Be not partaker of other mens sinns: keep thyself pure. I.Tim.5.22.

Gal 5:1

Stand fast therefore in the libertie wherewith Christ hath made vs free, (1611 KJV)

Stand fast therefore in the libertie wherewith Christ hath made vs free, (Geneva)

Stande fast therfore in the libertie wherwith Christe hath made vs free, (Bishops)

1 Tim 5:22

neither bee partaker of other mens sinnes. Keepe thy selfe pure. (1611 KJV)

neither be partaker of other mens sinnes: keepe thy selfe pure.(Geneva)

neither be partaker of other mens sinnes. Kepe thy selfe chaste.(Bishops)

The Peoples Plea

(1618):
I. Cor. 14.1.
Follow after charity, and desire spirituall gifts, but rather that yee may prophesie.

Follow after charitie, and desire spirituall giftes, but rather that yee may prophesie.(1611 KJV)

Folowe after loue, and couet spirituall giftes, and rather that ye may prophecie. (Geneva)

Folowe after loue, and couet spirituall [giftes] but most chiefelie that ye may prophesie. (Bishops)

 

[Logos1560]

Pilgrims and early Baptists may well refer to or quote from more than one English translation since they did not advocate a one-translation-only theory. Was John Robinson referring to the rendering of the KJV at Acts 14:23?

In 1625, John Robinson referred to Acts 14:23: “where Paul and Barnabas do ordain elders in every church by suffrages (not their own as some fancy, unto whom to lift up and to lay on hands is all one) but the people’s; or by the lifting up of hands” (Just and Necessary, p. 34).

 

[Jerome]

Pilgrims and early Baptists may well refer to or quote from more than one English translation

Even the King James Bible? Really?
Isn't it true that:

The pilgrims refused to use the KJV for this very reason. They were not about to compromise with the Church of England and use their translation of the Bible.

Almost EVERYONE rejected the Anglican Version. The Pilgrims and Puritans would not allow one in America. They ALL hated the Bishop (Great) Bible and its revision (what some today call the KJV). It was not until decades later, when the Geneva Bible was not allowed to be printed or distributed, that the AV was grudgingly used.

the Pilgrims used the Geneva Bible instead of the KJV -- since that was the King's Bible (Anglican)

Baptists and Pilgrims and Puritans, etc, did not use the AV1611 (they had the Geneva Bible; why use a government church Anglican Bible?)

Yet here we have the Pilgrims' pastor apparently employing the KJB prominently.
What gives?
Did he not get the memo?

 

[Logos1560]

Yet here we have the Pilgrims' pastor apparently employing the KJB prominently.
What gives?

Perhaps apparently, but there could be another explanation. If the books by John Robinson were printed in England where they had to been licensed or approved by Church of England officials, it could be that the printer would substitute quotes from the 1611 KJV for any quotes from the 1560 Geneva Bible in order to make it more likely that a license or approval to print the book could be obtained. The Archbishop of Canterbury, the Bishop of London, or one of their chaplains had to approve of books before they could be printed. There was no freedom of religion and freedom of the press in England in those days. Another possibility would be that John Robinson himself would use quotations from the 1611 KJV for books to be printed in England, knowing that would make it more likely that approval for printing could be obtained.

The Geneva Bible could not be printed in England after 1616. David Cloud claimed: “In 1616 the king [James I] issued a command that only the King James Bible was to be printed in England” (Faith, p. 584). MacGregor wrote that the last quarto edition of the Geneva Bible printed in England was in 1615 and the last folio in 1616 (Literary History, p. 145). There could have been pressure on printers against including quotations from the Geneva Bible even before 1616. Other methods to attempt to decrease the use of the Geneva Bible had likely been tried before the order that forbid the printing of the Geneva Bible in England.

 

[Jerome]

If the books by John Robinson were printed in England...

No, remember they had moved to the Netherlands.

Thus, English Short Title Catalogue:

Robinson, John, 1575?-1625. Of religious communion private, & publique. [Amsterdam? : s.n.], Printed anno 1614.
Robinson, John, 1575?-1625. A manumission to a manuduction, or Answer to a letter inferring publique communion in the parrish [Amsterdam: G. Thorpe], Anno Domini. 1615.
Robinson, John, 1575?-1625. The peoples plea for the exercise of prophesie. [Leiden] : Printed [by William Brewster], in the yeare. 1618.

I guess it's back to the drawing board?
We can't have him actually using THAT Bible by choice, oh no.
Maybe the Geneva Bible was outlawed in Holland too? Yea, that's the ticket!

 

[Jerome]

The Geneva Bible could not be printed in England after 1616.

What version was Cromwell's The Souldiers Pocket Bible [London, 1643]?

 

[Dr. Bob]

What version was Cromwell's The Souldiers Pocket Bible [London, 1643]?

The "Geneva".

BTW that the Pilgrims "as a rule" rejected and did not use the AV is historic fact. That some verses of the AV were quoted by some Pilgrims is not the issue.

We're talking about the PRINCIPLE of the thing.

Hey, you can look at my sermon tomorrow and I use quotations from 20 various English translations INCLUDING the 1769 KJVoxford revision. But "as a rule" . . .